Don't confuse expensive with decent. My Synergy build uses some buyout drivers but that's because I haven't found any non-buyout ones that would appear to work any better (or even as good).
Member
Joined 2003
I was happy with the synergy design with the clarion drivers, but being the kit was designed in Australia with odd drivers made it impossible for me to get it at that time. I was thinking about trying the pyle mids with the unity horn design just for fun, after my wood working skills improve a bit. The pyle mids are easy to get... But the 2" clarion seemed to solve some issues... Oh well...
P.S... I worked for BB for almost a decade. That place satiated my home/audio car bug when i was younger as I got cost on stuff. Made it easier to play around with stuff... I could own it for a while, then sell it when I wanted to try something else. Hey, if it was not for us selling even basic JBL, I would not know what EOS stood for
Of all the years I worked for them, those were my favorite speakers by far... (I liked the advent laureattes as well).
I still want to make a unity or synergy horn... need to improve my wood working skills first.
I was bummed when the S3 horns were made with the orion mids. Too hard to get, especially for playing around. The pyle's look like they are cheap and easy to get still...
P.S... I worked for BB for almost a decade. That place satiated my home/audio car bug when i was younger as I got cost on stuff. Made it easier to play around with stuff... I could own it for a while, then sell it when I wanted to try something else. Hey, if it was not for us selling even basic JBL, I would not know what EOS stood for
Of all the years I worked for them, those were my favorite speakers by far... (I liked the advent laureattes as well).I still want to make a unity or synergy horn... need to improve my wood working skills first.
I was bummed when the S3 horns were made with the orion mids. Too hard to get, especially for playing around. The pyle's look like they are cheap and easy to get still...
As this was asked about the Visaton M10 drivers way back in october and nobody seems to have added anything since (that I can see anyway) I thought I'd pop something on.
I picked up some unused Visaton M10 drivers off of the bay as they looked interesting and have just tried them out on a 90 x 55 horn that I built.
I haven't done anything special with them, just using two straight 18mm deep x 16mm diameter ports per driver they give a pretty usable frequency range (+/-3db) between around 400hz to 2khz.
The only deviation to that is a 2db bump around 500hz, which I'd probably just crossover a little higher to bring it into line (rolling off a bit below 500hz).
As for the drivers themselves I think they are quite nice little units, the square frame format means the cone extends nice and near to the edge making them easier to get close to the tweeter.
Also because the cone angle is relatively shallow the air chamber in front is automatically small making them easily reach up to 2khz with little or no effort.
I hope this helps.
Paul.
I would love to see the measurements for the Visaton M10s. Since I'm still in Germany for a couple more months I've been thinking about picking some up for a future Synergy build (first want to make some AMT tweeters for the apex).
Is it the size of the horn or the FS of the M10 that is the primary cause the roll off below 500 Hz in your measurements?
Is it the size of the horn or the FS of the M10 that is the primary cause the roll off below 500 Hz in your measurements?
Unfortunately I didn't save a plot with Visaton M10 drivers on (just have a few figures written down) and have moved on a bit with that horn with a number of other changes.
So any measurements I'd make now wouldn't be typical ones.
As for the roll off below 400-500hz,
The horn I played with isn't very large with only a 24" x 12" mouth so it may have a bit of an effect.
However having said that when I tried similar midranges with a lower FS figure on the same horn they didn't roll off until around 300hz.
So I suspect that it is indeed the FS which has the greater effect in this case.
I hope this helps,
Paul.
So any measurements I'd make now wouldn't be typical ones.
As for the roll off below 400-500hz,
The horn I played with isn't very large with only a 24" x 12" mouth so it may have a bit of an effect.
However having said that when I tried similar midranges with a lower FS figure on the same horn they didn't roll off until around 300hz.
So I suspect that it is indeed the FS which has the greater effect in this case.
I hope this helps,
Paul.
A couple observations:
1) where will you put the super tweeter? If you put it on top of the horn there's going to be a big discontinuity in the directivity.
2) in a unity horn we're basically building our own compression driver for each frequency band. So the efficiency of the midranges can end up much higher than might be expected. For instance, the midrange array in the Lambda Unity is more efficient than the compression driver in the Lambda Unity.
Rvrasvan, where do you put the level for cheap? According to Earl Geddes, modern compression drivers are a commodity, and any competent 1" driver can cover the range from about 1K on up. At least the differences between them would be much less than grafting a tweeter to a 2" waveguide. I would think it pretty easy to find a suitable 1" driver on the used market.
Or one could say the the efficiency of the HF driver is less than expected, because the constant directivity of the waveguide does not compensate for the power fall off of the HF driver. With a passive crossover between HF and Mid, the bottom range of the HF driver is effectively padded down, along with the mids. With an active crossover, one can boost the range above around 5K, and probably get away with the same amp power on HF and mids, because there is not that much musical content (signal amplitude?)above 10K anyway.
Sheldon
Or one could say the the efficiency of the HF driver is less than expected, because the constant directivity of the waveguide does not compensate for the power fall off of the HF driver. With a passive crossover between HF and Mid, the bottom range of the HF driver is effectively padded down, along with the mids. With an active crossover, one can boost the range above around 5K, and probably get away with the same amp power on HF and mids, because there is not that much musical content (signal amplitude?)above 10K anyway.
Sheldon
Basically the reason that I've never considered a 2" compression driver for a unity is because the midranges ARE a compression driver. This might not be immediately obvious, that the midranges are basically equivalent to using *four* large format compression drivers on a single horn. (This is also the reason that I gravitate towards very small midranges for my Unity horns. I get so much gain from the compression chamber, I don't need large midranges)
Replace the phenolic diaphragms with titanium, use Eminence Alpha 8" drivers below.
These spekers will be used for party's so high output will be important. Covering 140 to 6Khz with a point source seem to be a good ideea. The Seleniums are reated at 75W and they can be crossed as low as 500hz. This gives more room to play, and a wider variety of drivers.
In the future i will try to use a 2"coaxial drivers. But they are not that cheap!
In the future i will try to use a 2"coaxial drivers
. But they are not that cheap!
