Suitable midrange cone, for bandpass mid in Unity horn. - Page 3 - diyAudio
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Old 17th November 2006, 08:51 AM   #21
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I put together a spreadsheet with eleven midranges for a Unity horn / waveguide.

It's on Google Docs, so you guys are welcome to add to it.

So far the two best candidates are the LA6-MR from Eminence and the JBL 400GTI.

I came up with a scoring system too. Basically 532 is a perfect score, and anything above or below that isn't quite perfect. John Sheerin's driver gets a perfect score, bracketed by the JBL 400GTI and the LA6-MR. The Beyma 5G40ND and the Ciare 6.38 NdMR look sharp too.

Here it is:

Unity Midrange Spreadsheet



woofer fs qes qms qts (2 * fs)/qes cost Unity Index Buy It! Specs
MCM 55-1595 100 0.88 2.44 0.65 227 $12 -1.30 http://www.mcminone.com/product.asp?...fo=details</a>
Eminence NH2008 47 0.29 6.5 0.28 324 $67 -0.61 http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/pshow... </a>
Aurasound NS2 164 0.85 4.83 0.72 386 $16 -0.36 http://www.madisound.com <a href="ht... </a>
P-Audio SN-8MB 62 0.32 4.67 0.30 388 $79 -0.35 http://www.loudspeakersplus.com/html... </a>
Aurasound NS3-194-8E 125 0.6 7.1 0.55 417 $11 -0.26 http://www.madisound.com/cgi-bin/ind...E%20v2.pdf</a>
JBL 400GTI 187 0.85 7.8 0.77 440 $150 -0.19 ebay
the john sheerin driver 81 0.31 4.2 0.29 523 $999 0.00 http://ldsg.snippets.org/HORNS/unity2.html
Eminence LA6-MR 90 0.28 2.92 0.26 643 $50 0.19 http://www.usspeaker.com/LA6-MR-1.ht... </a>
Beyma 5G40ND 110 0.33 4.9 0.31 667 $110 0.22 http://www.usspeaker.com/beyma%205g4... </a>
Ciare 6.38 NdMR 197 0.36 1.47 0.29 1094 $60 0.52 http://www.assistanceaudio.com/08_CI... </a>
P-Audio WN-520N 173 0.256 0.912 0.20 1352 $100 0.61 http://www.loudspeakersplus.com <a h...N-520N.pdf</a>
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Old 17th November 2006, 09:06 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally posted by omarmipi
Awesome! I got a value of 491Hz with the Audax HM100C0 drivers that I am currently using. I am not sure if the 54Hz Fs matters though. The motor on this thing is freakishly large too.
Nice one! I'll have to look that up.

I found another good & cheap candidate. The TangBand W2-880 scores an 889. It costs $12 IIRC. I have a few at home, but I didn't measure them yet. I'm using the data that John Krutke measured. Another plus is that the W2-880 has much lower distortion than the Aura NS2s that I'm using.

For a "real" unity the TBs are rather puny, but for a car, the small size is a bonus.

Here's the data:

http://www.zaphaudio.com/minitest/
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Old 18th November 2006, 04:56 AM   #23
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Greets!

I'm curious why 532 Hz is the 'perfect score' when TD says 500 Hz, though obviously there is some wiggle room. FWIW, the ones I chose for 'M' before he scored the 'real deal' is the Fostex FF125K, which clocks in at ~533 Hz.

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Old 18th November 2006, 05:09 AM   #24
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Default Hey GM...

do the Fostex FF125K run open back or with a small enclosure? Regards Moray James.
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Old 18th November 2006, 05:36 AM   #25
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Greets!

It would be tiny, ~2x the front chamber Vb with it mounted flat against the horn. For open back, you'd need a ~500 Hz Fs driver with a mass corner slightly >1 kHz, ergo a large front chamber Vb with large vents, so not a viable option IMO since you'd need a Qes = ~0.05 to get the front Vb/vents down to ~where they need to be.

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Old 18th November 2006, 05:44 AM   #26
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Default Ok open back it is...

The Fostex fe126e is close in specs and a little cheaper would this work also? I would worry that with the few very inexpensive drivers that you might end up having to buy a bunch to obtain drivers with the parameters needed so not much if any saving in the end. Regards Moray James.
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Old 18th November 2006, 06:44 AM   #27
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Greets!

I doubt its surround could remain linear under pressure at rated power.

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Old 18th November 2006, 05:45 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally posted by GM
Greets!

I'm curious why 532 Hz is the 'perfect score' when TD says 500 Hz, though obviously there is some wiggle room. FWIW, the ones I chose for 'M' before he scored the 'real deal' is the Fostex FF125K, which clocks in at ~533 Hz.

GM
GM,

Every Unity will have a different target. To keep things simple, I decided to assign a "bullseye target" in my spreadsheet. It corresponds to John Sheerin's "perfect unity woofer", that's all.

For example, if you went with a BMS4540nd, you'd want a target that's an octave higher (1064hz). This would allow you to extend the high frequency response of the mid, taking some stress off the BMS. Of course it would also limit your low frequency extension!

If you used a monster compression driver like one of the TAD 2001s, you can get away with a target that's a full octave lower (266hz). This is because the TAD can live with a lower xover point. Of course, the $95 BMS is hard to beat in the top octave!

In a nutshell, your "target" will depend on your desired SPL level and your compression driver.

Aren't compromises a b1tch? This demonstrates that even if you spend $1000 for a compression driver, there will still be compromises. I hate to gush, but I think Danley has come up with one of the most elegant ways to mask these compromises. IMHO, a lot of newbies think that you can just throw money at the problem by purchasing the best drivers. This shows that driver selection is more important than the cost of those drivers.

:: PB ::

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Old 20th November 2006, 05:13 AM   #29
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Dear Greg:

Quote:
FWIW, the ones I chose for 'M' before he scored the 'real deal'


Quote:
TD's prototype driver's published specs were ~2*250 Hz/0.99 = 505 Hz
The specifications you are mentioning were for the Audax, not the Real McCoy, correct?

I am working towards a goal of a conically-shaped horn, but my efforts are being slowed by almost constant travel. Did you see my latest attempt: http://people.qualcomm.com/kalousek/index.htm ?

Dear John,

Quote:
I think Danley has come up with one of the most elegant ways to mask these compromises
Since I have been working on different implementations of the Unity concept for a while, I could not help myself from thinking about Tom's thought process while he was designing the first Unity. And, it seems to me, that there are not so many degrees of freedom as it appears.

First, the choice of a cross-over frequency is limited - at the low frequency range by the loading of the compression driver, and at the high frequency range by the physical limitations of the horn structure (e.g., the wall angle) and the dimensions of the mid-frequency drivers (one needs to be at about 1/4 wavelength), as well as the highest frequency that the mid-frequency drivers can reach on the horn.

Additionally, the bandwidth of the mid-frequency drivers is limited, I am afraid that 3 octaves is the maximum, again depending on the horn structure that will affect e.g., loading. This further influences the cross-over frequency choice if one wants a certain bandwidth with only a compression driver and mid-frequency drivers.

Furthermore, the mechanical design presents additional limitation. Not everyone would accept long ports necessitating less compact design.

Please, do not misunderstand me; I think this is an ingenious concept. I just wonder if when Tom decided on performance goals the design did not just logically follow. However, perhaps I am just fooling myself and see the logic using hindsight and experiences of the many smart people who understood and discussed the Unity concept.

Kindest regards,

M
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Old 24th November 2006, 04:50 AM   #30
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The B&C driver will probably take a lot of modifications to hide in the dash but it is the driver closest to the 529Hz value.


Woofer fs qes qms qts (2 * fs)/qes cost

B&C 6MD38 130 0.49 3.70 0.44 530 $78.45
http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showd...number=294-651
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