hongrn said:
What does baffle step have to do with sibilance?
L-pad only attenuates the signal and does nothing for IM distortion that is sibilance. Once you turn up the volume so that it compensates for the L-pad, sibilance will be right back.
Sibilance in tweeters is best handled by correct crossovers and conjugate filters. Some tweeters with high FS and weak magnets need to be crossed over very high/steep to avoid sibilance.
As to Seas tweeters, the 1313 has a very good rap at low prices.
D.A.R.R.Y.L. said:
Hi Ramon,
What exactly do you mean by "least sibilant"? My 2 guesses are:
1) distortion you get when you cross the tweeter too low, or with a crossover with not enough roll-of. This causes distortion in the signal due to the "too low" signals interfering with proper operation.
2) audible peaks in the output of the tweeter itself. For example, a few of the Focal tweeters have a 6dB peak near 20KHz. But, as sibilance is generally in the 4-8KHz range, you probably aren't going to get this with most SEAS tweeters.
Sibilance is characterised by sound overly produced in the 4k-10k frequency range. This can be totally controlled within the crossover, which is exactly what you should do. It can be a facet of some very badly made tweeters, but not of anything decent.
Most good tweeters will have a pretty flat response curve, which may seem a tad bright to some people.
If you want a tweeter that is less "sibilent", look for something which has a broad dip in the 4k-10k range, or a slope down from 4k.
Also generally avoid metal domes (I said generally, so no biting please) ;-)) and those with a rising response.
Most good tweeters will have a pretty flat response curve, which may seem a tad bright to some people.
If you want a tweeter that is less "sibilent", look for something which has a broad dip in the 4k-10k range, or a slope down from 4k.
Also generally avoid metal domes (I said generally, so no biting please) ;-)) and those with a rising response.
Well I don't know if it applies to dome tweeters, but an L-PAD will definately clear up sibilance on a horn tweeter. The resistance calms the impedance peaks that wreak havoc with a passive crossover.
Works well for me, anyhow. Just try putting the L-PAD before the low pass filter, it won't sound good! But dome tweeters aren't as peaky as horns, so who knows?
Works well for me, anyhow. Just try putting the L-PAD before the low pass filter, it won't sound good! But dome tweeters aren't as peaky as horns, so who knows?
I find the Seas Alu dome very edgy, a particularly bad implementation is the Genelec 1032 monitors where they are mounted in a wave guide and crossed over to a 10" driver far too low, I think part of the problem is them being crossed over to low, the good reviews these tweet have had lead me to believe the 3 implementations I have heard of them have all just been bad speakers, as they have all been very edgy sounding.
Crossovers do not cure sibilance. I find sibilance to be inherent to certain tweeters. I find for instance the ss9500 a sibilant tweeter, even though distortion figures are good and crossover point is near 3kHz. Taming with an L-pad does nothing for sibilance. Sibilance is even present when I purposely have the freq char. drop down from 4k onwards with a few dB's. Maybe I am just sensitive to sibilance, or my audio chain is too revealing (aka high-end) in that it will uncover the bad recordings with no mercy.
IMO there is three kind of sibilance:
1) the natural (eg. Very clear in acoustic opera)
2) distortion inherent in the material (eg http://www.recordingreview.com/arti...With-The-Horrid-quotssssquot-In-Your-Mix.html )
3) distortion in the reproduction (eg tweeter)
1 should not be avoided. 2 can’t be avoided. 3 should be avoided.
The danger is to confuse 3 with 1 and 2 - which is easier than one might think.
1) the natural (eg. Very clear in acoustic opera)
2) distortion inherent in the material (eg http://www.recordingreview.com/arti...With-The-Horrid-quotssssquot-In-Your-Mix.html )
3) distortion in the reproduction (eg tweeter)
1 should not be avoided. 2 can’t be avoided. 3 should be avoided.
The danger is to confuse 3 with 1 and 2 - which is easier than one might think.
Opp, I agree.
Big requiems like Verdi's are prone to sibilance.
Language also plays a major rule: (I am dutch) hence the english language is prone to excessive sibilance.
Second a recording studio can de-ss with high priced gear (often they refuse or implement badly).
And last the tweeter itself. I myself was looking into low distortion and low Fs tweeters in order to avoid sibilance.
Hence my question about the Seas line, because their tweeters have very low distortion and very low Fs.
Big requiems like Verdi's are prone to sibilance.
Language also plays a major rule: (I am dutch) hence the english language is prone to excessive sibilance.
Second a recording studio can de-ss with high priced gear (often they refuse or implement badly).
And last the tweeter itself. I myself was looking into low distortion and low Fs tweeters in order to avoid sibilance.
Hence my question about the Seas line, because their tweeters have very low distortion and very low Fs.
I am using the Seas H1212 Alu (xo 2.1 khz, 24 dB Active, driven by an class A amp) in my new dipole construction - which is not yet fine tuned (level, eq, etc.) - but so far my impression is that when noticeable/excessive sibilance is present on the recording, the tweeter certainly isn’t suppressing it, but otherwise they are very airy and precise.
Personally I have a tendency to overly focus on sibilance when critically assessing a speaker. I am now trying the focus on correct sounding sibilance rather than the amount – but this is difficult.
Personally I have a tendency to overly focus on sibilance when critically assessing a speaker. I am now trying the focus on correct sounding sibilance rather than the amount – but this is difficult.
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