JORDAN JXR6 in square vs. linear formation - diyAudio
Go Back   Home > Forums > Loudspeakers > Multi-Way

Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

Please consider donating to help us continue to serve you.

Ads on/off / Custom Title / More PMs / More album space / Advanced printing & mass image saving
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 22nd September 2006, 07:16 PM   #1
ark is offline ark  United States
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Arcata, CA
Question JORDAN JXR6 in square vs. linear formation

Hey! Has anybody tried putting the jordan drivers JXR6 or jx53 in a square formation vs. in a linear array formation?

I am really interested in the 4 speaker array.. but don't like the looks of them..

If they were in a square they'd look cooler to my eyes.. but I haven't a clue what that would do to the sound?

would it increase or decrease combing?



seems like a square foramation would give a larger and more dynamic sweet spot for small room, sit down listening?

horn loaded it might look like a micro version of those 4 speaker klangfilm speakers...

any thoughts on this? experience?
thanks!
  Reply With Quote
Old 23rd September 2006, 12:33 PM   #2
bjorno is offline bjorno  Sweden
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Jacobsmountain
Send a message via MSN to bjorno
Quote:

I am really interested in the 4 speaker array.. but don't like the looks of them..
Hi,

Iíve also been interested in 4 speakers (N=4) arrays using small < = 3 inch drivers and know the fact that the vertical far field directivity (Q) is smoother/better behaved and lower, compared to any other number of N > 4 until N is high enough to put a listener in near field and the vertical Q loses its importance for quality performance.

For this case and worth mentioning is that the horizontal dispersion is still as good as for a single driver.

Take a look at the submitted picture.

From this graph the before mentioned conclusion can be drawn:
Using more drivers than 4 in a short column is not a good idea, as for <= 3inch drivers, still puts a listener in the far field.

Only power tapering can restore the off axis performance to be similar to a 4 driver column.

Quality drivers like the Jordanís peaks overall performance and my experience with other 2 and 3inch drivers performed blameless in a 4driver column, in my opinion, too.


Quote:
If they were in a square they'd look cooler to my eyes.. but I haven't a clue what that would do to the sound?

would it increase or decrease combing?
Four drivers in square have deformed and decreased horizontal dispersion if compared with a single driver or a vertical oriented column array using any number of drivers.

At minimum c-c distance about 0.75 wavelengths (about 1700 Hz) the directivity peaks (Q).

The horizontal dispersion is in this case equal to the vertical polar response, thus this formation of drivers makes the sweet spot more narrow compared to a single driver.


Quote:
seems like a square foramation would give a larger and more dynamic sweet spot for small room, sit down listening?

No, on the contrary and e.g. the sharpness of centrally located phantoms will be much dimmer and the location resolution is also worse compared to a 4-driver vertical column array, only the dynamic power capability increases.

For close distances, the only array type that beats the performance of a one row of vertical 4-driver wideband column array (driver less than 3 inch) is a line array operating in the near field using the same drivers.

But if crossed over to a high frequency device(s), and for this case with 3 inch drivers size, if crossed over to a frequency >= 1700 Hz, the only tweeter(s) that will match is a wave guided type, or other types with similar restricted dispersion.


Quote:
horn loaded it might look like a micro version of those 4 speaker klangfilm speakers... any thoughts on this?
Yes, it might look cool in your eyes opposed to what I do, and even can cope with the sonically disaster I imagine. I think the only way to find out, is if you DIY.

B
Attached Images
File Type: gif qshort_array.gif (16.3 KB, 252 views)
  Reply With Quote
Old 23rd September 2006, 01:32 PM   #3
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Tennessee
Ark,

While you might think that a square array would look nice, the reality is that it likely would not sound so nice. As Bjorno's graph depicts bad things happen beyond about a wavelength center to center spacing between drivers. For a square array you'll get you issues in both the horizontal and vertical planes.

The ear is more sensitive to the direction of sound in the horizontal plane (shadowing of the ears by the head helps) but less so in the vertical plane (fewer directional cues). If you place two drivers side by side in the horizontal plane, then you will have sound smear beyond a wavelength center to center spacing between the drivers. As the directional cues are less in the vertical plane, vertically arrayed drivers will cause less audible sound smearing.

As related earlier, a better solution would be to use enough drivers in the line array to create a near field at the listening distance. In that case the sound radiated by the array would have the majority of the sound radiating parallel to the floor and ceiling so no sound smear would be heard in vertical plane.

Best answer in your case is to learn to love the vertical array. It will be significantly better than the square array when used full range.

If you are interested in line arrays, check out my near field line array white paper at the link.

Jim

Near Field Line Array White Paper
  Reply With Quote
Old 23rd September 2006, 09:26 PM   #4
ark is offline ark  United States
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Arcata, CA
thanks both of you for the thoughtful and educational feedback.

i wont invest too much time with this novel idea then and stick with the short array.

Thank a lot. a lot of good reading here.
  Reply With Quote
Old 24th September 2006, 12:01 AM   #5
ark is offline ark  United States
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Arcata, CA
Default more thoughts

so i pose a question to either or both of you..

for a room 16' x 12' (basically most of my studio apartment)..

would a 4 driver array be better than a single driver?

im a low volume listener most of the time.. what i desire most is detail, soundstage and dynamics.

efficiency is not that critical, nor is power handling..

could I mate a single one of these little jordans with say .. a 10" scan speak woofer and make the most of this drivers capablies and character.. or should i use a 4 unit array with a subwoofer like Ted Jordan recommends?

Thanks!

My current speakers are...

Ohm Walsh 2's
Saba green cones on open baffle.
Altec 811b horns with JBL 2226's.

Super T amp... though will likely replace it with whatever the speaker wants.
Eastsound E5 cd player..

Im looking for a smaller speaker that will satisfy me enough to get rid of these others.. that take up a lot of space in a 16x12 apartment! = )
  Reply With Quote
Old 24th September 2006, 12:06 AM   #6
ark is offline ark  United States
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Arcata, CA
Jim.
I read your paper... but my IQ.. suffers... : (
the longer the array.. the better nearfield response?
so a 4 speaker array is not suitable for nearfield?

am i misunderstanding?
  Reply With Quote
Old 13th September 2013, 10:42 AM   #7
graaf is offline graaf  Poland
diyAudio Member
 
graaf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Griffin View Post
bad things happen beyond about a wavelength center to center spacing between drivers.
so if c-t-c spacing is 32 mm then bad things happen beyond 10 750 Hz?
__________________
"high phooey and hystereo" - Yascha Heifetz
  Reply With Quote
Old 13th September 2013, 02:43 PM   #8
Colin is offline Colin  United Kingdom
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Ark - I've heard both the 4 unit JXR6 linear array and the new Jordan Eikona driver, used in a stereo system in the same room. The Eikona has a 4" cone so the overall driver area is similar.

To my ears, the single Eikona was better. The imaging was at least as good but with none of the slight HF loss as I stood up and my ears were above the level of the array.

The power handling of the array may have been better but the low end response of the Eikona was better, going almost half an octave lower. It sounded fine on its own whereas the array needed a sub. The Eikona was in the 6 litre enclosure shown on the Jordan website. The array was more sensitive but amplifier watts are relatively cheap. I don't think the T-Amp would cut it, though.

The same may be true of other make/designs. This was an interesting comparison as so many of the design elements and the general philosophy was the same.

Hope this helps.

Last edited by Colin; 13th September 2013 at 02:44 PM. Reason: spellink.
  Reply With Quote
Old 14th September 2013, 02:31 PM   #9
ark is offline ark  United States
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Arcata, CA
thanks colin. it has been a long time since i thought about this project (2006) but i hadn't hard about the new eikona driver until now. looks promising. : )
  Reply With Quote
Old 14th September 2013, 06:36 PM   #10
Colin is offline Colin  United Kingdom
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
When I was at Ted Jordan's we tried an experiment, running the Eikona as a two way with a JXR6 crossing over around 500 Hz. We couldn't hear any significant improvement over the Eikona on its own.
  Reply With Quote

Reply


Hide this!Advertise here!
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Jordan JXR6 HD Designs PrimaLuna Full Range 89 20th December 2013 10:25 PM
Jordan JXR6 HD vs JX92S oceanic30 Multi-Way 1 25th August 2007 08:54 PM
Jordan JXR6 linear array with JX92s xcortes Full Range 4 20th November 2006 03:44 AM
Using in the Jordan JXR6 HD in an MTM David Gatti Multi-Way 3 7th November 2006 07:52 PM
Partner for the Jordan JXR6 jimbo Full Range 23 13th March 2006 11:41 AM


New To Site? Need Help?

All times are GMT. The time now is 02:29 AM.


vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2014 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright ©1999-2014 diyAudio

Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.3.2