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Old 17th June 2006, 10:53 AM   #11
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NS10 was originally intended to be home hi-fi speaker. And yes, sounds mediocre.
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Old 17th June 2006, 10:20 PM   #12
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thnx , so can i ( or how can i ) use my hi fi audio system as a monitor ?
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Old 18th June 2006, 12:54 AM   #13
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Default Re: studio monitor ...

Quote:
Originally posted by Ahmad_tbp
hi , what s exactly diffrence between an studio monitor and hi fi system ?
As in HiFi vs Studio monitor?

I believe, I stress, that one of you monitor sets in the studio position reveal flat sterile sound. The other set should be lose and fat maybey a big rock speaker with some 10's or 12's in it. You may be able to model your work from balance between the two(small near field and a distant big fat set). It would never hurt to listen to your work while driving in the car and on the cheap radio sitting in the kitchen. This is how you will KNOW that your recording is good. Next go to the doctor and order a perfect set of ear drums! See where this is going? Listen to it with peers even if they are just friends and family. Small children have been known to influence some serious hits. I'm not kidding.

At least two sets of speakers in the studio, three is better and you should be very comfortable understanding the sound from each set. Otherwise you are gambling, and many great records have come from that formula too! If it rocks, it rocks.

Set up a few pairs and a flip switch. If you are going soundtrack digital everything I just said is rubbish. That's a different thing all together. I hope this helps as it comes from experience working with some really good music biz people.

Shawn.
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Old 18th June 2006, 01:45 AM   #14
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Default One more time

How could I forget, a good set of head phones goes a long, long way. Low-mid $$ could be AKG K240's I have gone through two sets of these since 1990 or so. I like them a lot but they are not perfect. You can spend infinite cash on these things.

Shawn.
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Old 18th June 2006, 08:18 AM   #15
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There is another difference not too widely known I think.

Generally, hifi speakers are voiced to sound 'nice'.

Monitors generally ideally, have a flat frequency response. Some of them, by doing this, have heavy cones, and as such need big magnets and voice coils to create the 'B times L' ie magnet flux times voice coil length, to create force to drive the cone, to move the air, and to stop it moving. Also, resitors and co. in the crossover would have to be bigger, too.

This costs big money, hence atc's huge magnets, the most expensive part of the speaker.

Obviously there is more to it, like phase response, and waterfall decay.

And a lot of hifi speakers again try to reach this ideal of a flat response.

The big difference, is that studio monitors generally are more sturdily built, and the voice coils don't compress due to heat quite as much, so you can drive them hard and loud without trouble.

Some of them, in fact aren't quite so 'flat' and are voiced to be a bit soft to ensure long listening without fatigue.

Here's that word again, accurate, if they are all accurate, but different, there really isn't such a thing, as I think of accurate as objective and definitive, and they all can't be that if different.

But in reality, as with amplifiers, there really is no such thing as a studio speaker or a hifi one, hifi is a stupid name dreamt up by marketing people, who try to make you think you are getting somehting different, just like an audiophile amplifier, and a pro amp, there is no difference in the circuit to make it that way, both are just amplifiers and the pro ones generally are much better.

how do you make an audiophile circuit topology?
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Old 18th June 2006, 10:55 AM   #16
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hi everyone and thanks a lot for ur very usefull informations
unfortunatly studio monitors are out of my price range , so i have to stick w my hi fi system .
my kenwood speakers are big and so loud enough for me ( 10" woofer , 4" mid and 1.5" tweeter ) and i use them w a kenwood home hifi system as my audio system for recordin/playin etc , it has 2 tone controls and 14 bands graphic/parametric EQ .
so if i put all tone controls and eqs in flat , and put speakers in a good degree , can i hear a sound near to studio monitors ???
and one thing else , unfortuately i cant buy anythin online from here , so can u propose me any free e-book or any article online bout anything i have to know bout sound in general ! recording , etc ...
thank u all so much ...
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Old 18th June 2006, 11:47 AM   #17
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Studiomonitors vs HiFi? Phew... Difficult topic, as a good hifi system can perform equally well as decent monitors. Though the other way around is not quite so simple.

A whole bunch of studiomonitors are active; they have matching amps built in. The crossover network is active, and can be designed to have the drivers perform their best in the given cabinet, without becoming very large and expensive. The amplifiers are (impedance) matched to the drivers, which ensures optimal performance and efficiency. Furthermore, the more expensive active monitors have protection circuitry built in. This can be anything from a soft-clip limiter to cone excursion protection. Anyhing to protect the drivers from overheating and physical damage caused by abuse.

On the sound side; monitors are generally designed to work in the near field: anywhere to 2 mtrs from the speaker. The engineer in the studio usually won't move far outside the sweetspot being behind the console, so most monitors are designed to sound best just there: in the sweet spot. And all good studio's are acoustically designed or at least optimised. This will greatly affect the monitors' sound on-axis. The purpose of a studiomonitor is to translate everything that's going on in a mix to useable information. In other words, a monitor should not sound "nice" or "fun", but be very accurate and "ruthless", if you will. Ofcourse, in order to be able to work long, efficient hours on it, you should like the monitor's sound, as every speaker has a certain character. But given it's nearfield design and built-in amps, you usually won't have to hassle much or try different amps to get the best possible sound out of the speaker.

To conclude this: it IS possible to do recording and mixing on a (above average) hi-fi. But you **HAVE** to know your system inside and out, and back again. I have mixed a complete album on a NAD T752 with Tannoy Stratford speakers. ([EDIT:] http://www.joshuamorin.com/mp3.shtml (Drunk, Stoned or in love) ) Far from ideal, but with some A/B comparison, it will work. I know an engineer who does all his mixing an Avalon Mixing Monitors, which are sort of "upgraded" hi-fi speakers. They are awesome and cost truckloads of money and need an equally great amp to perform good enough to be useful. On an average amp with average speakers, it's possible to make good mixes, but it would be adviseable to get small (8" max) "mini-monitors" to get best results. Normally large speakers are more fatiguing to work with. But any small speaker with hyped bass and treble will be useless too. You might get the idea the speaker is very revealing, but usually it's just distorting and causing listening fatigue. You don't need enormous bass exention - it's nice and useful, but not mandatory. You DO need, however, smooth and detailed highs and mids (Dynaudio and Adam are very good at this). But first and foremost, you must absolutely KNOW your system. Studiomonitors are not mandatory, just very, very helpful.

On a side note: someone replied here that compression should not be used in mastering. That's not always true. Compression is hardly ever used when mastering classical music, but in pop and expecially rock, compression is extensively used throughout the entire production process. A good compressor can make a recording (or one track in it) soud "bigger" and "fatter", which is exactly what rock music is all about. So to make a good mix even better, you need good mastering. In pop music, mastering is all about clever and subtly EQ-ing and compressing the stereo mix, to make it sound more open and transparent, while increasing RMS level (and decreasing headroom...), which gives a song more "impact".

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Old 18th June 2006, 11:51 AM   #18
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Oh, and by the way; These days there are a bunch of pretty good active monitors on the market, that don't cost much more than a decent amp with speakers. Look for brands like Fostex, Mackie (HR-624), Dynaudio (BM-5a), Yamaha (HS80M), Genelec (8020, 8030), KRK (Rokit series), etc...
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Old 18th June 2006, 07:23 PM   #19
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Well, it's much simpler than that.

Real studio monitors are only a standard accepted speaker. Auratones (aka awful tones), NS-10 and 10M's, JBL 412 or whatever. The JBL's are studio mains, the others are used as near field monitors.

Simply, the engineer needs to hear the same sound if he travels between studios. Everything else is hype. It's really that simple.

-Chris
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Old 18th June 2006, 11:29 PM   #20
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Quote:
Simply, the engineer needs to hear the same sound if he travels between studios. Everything else is hype. It's really that simple.
well i simply disagree ...


functionnality :

Click the image to open in full size.

hype :

http://www.bwspeakers.com/images/Spe...tilus/main.jpg

(i'm not saying that the bw isn't a good speaker. although, it is designed for wide dispersion, and thus is not a studio monitor, or not even a really accurate system as it is a "wide dispersion" system, and doesn't have a constant directivity)



there is a LOT more between hi fi and studio than just a question of "same sound for comparison and work".

sure the NS10, because, as engineers are selling music to people who don't have extremely good speakers, but to people who have cheap boomboxes, like the NS10 is.
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