I'm not sure if the guy ships overseas but if your in the UK then you'll realise that £60 including delivery isn't much for a pair of speakers.
Then consider that you've got an d'appo design featuring 4" Aerogel mid/bass units (not sure on the model no. but looks to prestige series with the phase plug but with the basket design from the standard?). The tweeters are almost certainly TM025-F15.
I couldn't build and finish a pair for £60 so it makes sense to me. The crossover may well be suspect though, we'll see... if it is then a rework should prove fun.
Anyway, I've bought a pair for the shed so I can finally have some background music whist building stuff.
Here's the link:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=9724529393&rd=1&sspagename=STRK:MEWN:IT&rd=1
PS. Sorry but the auction ends in a few hours, I got in late myself and only just spotted them but thought it may benefit someone else looking for dirt cheap speakers using quality components. Maybe for the kitchen/shed/bedroom etc.
BTW I don't have affiliation with the chap selling them, just thought it was good enough value to tell others about.
EDIT:
Pics:
Then consider that you've got an d'appo design featuring 4" Aerogel mid/bass units (not sure on the model no. but looks to prestige series with the phase plug but with the basket design from the standard?). The tweeters are almost certainly TM025-F15.
I couldn't build and finish a pair for £60 so it makes sense to me. The crossover may well be suspect though, we'll see... if it is then a rework should prove fun.
Anyway, I've bought a pair for the shed so I can finally have some background music whist building stuff.
Here's the link:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=9724529393&rd=1&sspagename=STRK:MEWN:IT&rd=1
PS. Sorry but the auction ends in a few hours, I got in late myself and only just spotted them but thought it may benefit someone else looking for dirt cheap speakers using quality components. Maybe for the kitchen/shed/bedroom etc.
BTW I don't have affiliation with the chap selling them, just thought it was good enough value to tell others about.
EDIT:
Pics:
Al, if your out there, do you know what model no. those Audax 4" mid/bass are? Looks like these speakers were in production from 2001 to around 2004. Can't really find much more info about them other than they are manufactured and designed by Videologic of computer speaker fame.
The only thing I can identify is the TM025-F15 tweeter. It looks to have a Fs of ~1100hz and a highish Qts from the old spec sheet I've found.
Hmm... there's two things at odd's here; there's the MTM config which generally sounds better with lower XO point affording reduced off-axis lobing problems and generally improved power response. Although the center-to-center distance between the two mids looks to be around 17cm, which is pretty close in MTM terms.
And then there's the rather average tweeter that will very likely sound rough when crossed at 2khz, pretty efficient at a quoted 94dB thought. An educated guess would suggest the tweeter probably likes to be crossed at around 3Khz. Steeper slopes could help.
Has anyone worked with the Audax TM025-F15 tweeter?
Will be interesting to see what Videologic/Pure did with the XO.
The only thing I can identify is the TM025-F15 tweeter. It looks to have a Fs of ~1100hz and a highish Qts from the old spec sheet I've found.
Hmm... there's two things at odd's here; there's the MTM config which generally sounds better with lower XO point affording reduced off-axis lobing problems and generally improved power response. Although the center-to-center distance between the two mids looks to be around 17cm, which is pretty close in MTM terms.
And then there's the rather average tweeter that will very likely sound rough when crossed at 2khz, pretty efficient at a quoted 94dB thought. An educated guess would suggest the tweeter probably likes to be crossed at around 3Khz. Steeper slopes could help.
Has anyone worked with the Audax TM025-F15 tweeter?
Will be interesting to see what Videologic/Pure did with the XO.
Well, without seeing the backs, it looks like they have the basket and cone of the AP100ZOs with the more conical rubber phase plug of the later HM100Z0s. It's not the HM cone as that is darker and much less shiny. They certainly look like a reasonable deal to me. If you're using them as upright MTMs rather than on their side as centre speakers, then my first thoughts for tweaking are to make them run as a 2 1/2 way, but of course that is always assuming there isn't more going on than we can see.
If you remember/go back to the Maplin/Audax buy out thread, I seem to remember suggesting a phase plug would be a nice improvement, it looks like someone else agreed!
If you remember/go back to the Maplin/Audax buy out thread, I seem to remember suggesting a phase plug would be a nice improvement, it looks like someone else agreed!
ocool_15:
The Audax/Maplin buyout thread seems to suggest that the modelled response of a suitable ported enclosure would yield an F3 of around 55hz so this is feasible but with limited max SPL of around 90dB anechoic using 2 x AP100Z0's.
If these are AP100Z0's with phase plugs then the Qts of 0.65 suggests that best results aren't from porting but a sealed enclosure. Obviously this will result in an F3 of around 80hz but the groupdelay will be *much* better leading to a tighter sounding bass.
Al:
Thanks for the insights. I still don't have them with me yet and I'm just throwing idea's and what-ifs around. TBH I don't know if these are modded AP100Z0's and will have to measure them. I may just leave well alone if they sound OK but where's the fun in that?
There's some oldish Mission 70 series in the house that looks like they suspiciously use Audax units:
Looking at the textile dome and it bears a striking resemblance to the TM025 series. And the cone material on the 6.5 mid/bass looks to be the same as the Audax prestige aerogels, hell even the phase plug looks the same. I presume that these are Audax units? I picked these up a couple of years ago from Richersounds for £70 a pair, absolute bargain because they sound pretty superb for that money.
The Audax/Maplin buyout thread seems to suggest that the modelled response of a suitable ported enclosure would yield an F3 of around 55hz so this is feasible but with limited max SPL of around 90dB anechoic using 2 x AP100Z0's.
If these are AP100Z0's with phase plugs then the Qts of 0.65 suggests that best results aren't from porting but a sealed enclosure. Obviously this will result in an F3 of around 80hz but the groupdelay will be *much* better leading to a tighter sounding bass.
Al:
Thanks for the insights. I still don't have them with me yet and I'm just throwing idea's and what-ifs around. TBH I don't know if these are modded AP100Z0's and will have to measure them. I may just leave well alone if they sound OK but where's the fun in that?
There's some oldish Mission 70 series in the house that looks like they suspiciously use Audax units:
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Looking at the textile dome and it bears a striking resemblance to the TM025 series. And the cone material on the 6.5 mid/bass looks to be the same as the Audax prestige aerogels, hell even the phase plug looks the same. I presume that these are Audax units? I picked these up a couple of years ago from Richersounds for £70 a pair, absolute bargain because they sound pretty superb for that money.
yep lots of mission speakers from around that era used audax drive units, including the 78 series and 75 series. Although when i took the baffles off a pair of 780's the baskets of the woofers are made of plastic and appear to be integrated into the moulded removable baffle bit, so from that point of view they are custom units.
These things are tiny:
The Perceive's that you see in that shot aren't exactly large speakers. And these MTM's are even smaller than my ATC SCM7's and they're pretty small in the grand scheme. Any hopes of even half decent bass seem to be fast dissappearing.
Haven't had a chance to listen but the first impression are OK. Fit and finish is average but they're constructed out of 12mm MDF without bracing and despite being small, a knock on the side reveals that they ring badly compared to the Perceive's which are much larger speakers. So the build quality is a lacking.
I'll open them up after a listen.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
The Perceive's that you see in that shot aren't exactly large speakers. And these MTM's are even smaller than my ATC SCM7's and they're pretty small in the grand scheme. Any hopes of even half decent bass seem to be fast dissappearing.
Haven't had a chance to listen but the first impression are OK. Fit and finish is average but they're constructed out of 12mm MDF without bracing and despite being small, a knock on the side reveals that they ring badly compared to the Perceive's which are much larger speakers. So the build quality is a lacking.
I'll open them up after a listen.
Re: How do they sound?
Still not listened to them yet. Have just finished setting them up though so will post something later.
I don't think its really worth buying them for the mids alone. When Audax used to supply drivers they did a version without the phase plug called the AP100Z0 and they sold for £15 each, and in the end, £5. The AP100Z2's are probably only worth a couple more quid and will sound very similar.
As a DIY'er I'd estimate the driver value at around £40 for all 6 then a tenner for MDF and £20 for the XO's. So all in your looking at £70 to build a pair. These cost £50 and come ready built so it makes sense to save a bit and cut out on labour.
Depth Charge said:How do they sound? Not much bass? Perhaps those drivers would be better suited as midrange drivers in a 3 way. How efficient are they?
If they're any good at that price I may just buy a pair for the mid drivers.
Still not listened to them yet. Have just finished setting them up though so will post something later.
I don't think its really worth buying them for the mids alone. When Audax used to supply drivers they did a version without the phase plug called the AP100Z0 and they sold for £15 each, and in the end, £5. The AP100Z2's are probably only worth a couple more quid and will sound very similar.
As a DIY'er I'd estimate the driver value at around £40 for all 6 then a tenner for MDF and £20 for the XO's. So all in your looking at £70 to build a pair. These cost £50 and come ready built so it makes sense to save a bit and cut out on labour.
If you have a look through the items in the seller's shop, you can see a matching sub. That looks much more interesting to me, though I don't even vaguely recognise the driver!
Banned
Joined 2002
ShinOBIWAN,
I think you need a webpage to show off these beautiful creatures you have built.
I think you need a webpage to show off these beautiful creatures you have built.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
pinkmouse said:If you have a look through the items in the seller's shop, you can see a matching sub. That looks much more interesting to me, though I don't even vaguely recognise the driver!
Lo Al,
Its another Audax unit. I had a pair of the now discontinued Ruark Log Rhythm subs a few years back and they used an identical looking driver but in 12". I remember removed one of the drivers to check it out and it had the Audax branding on the back. Man those could pound, not massively extended but lots of fun.
I've been listening to these for a short while now and they really are nice speakers for the money.
The bass is the weakest part, it rolls off below 75hz and by the time you hit 45hz its all but gone. These are definitely tuned around 75hz. It also plods but I've improved things by sticking some foam in the port, I suspect they only went ported for marketing reasons because these definitely sound better sealed. Bass may improve with running in... we'll see.
Naturally for 4" drivers they have very limited dynamics and the soundstage is slightly claustrophobic. Like most small standmounts, they image well. There's an average amount of detail and the sound is definitely clouded and coloured. Overall the sound is smooth and an easy listen. Its more a background music speaker than an attention grabber. My overall feeling is that I just wish that they'd move up a gear. Unlike the Perceives these just don't sound anything like 'real' (unfair comparison).
I think there's more to be had out of these and I've decided to mod but at the same time keep it as cheap and as sensible as possible. I'm pretty sure that a small amount of response shaping could also bring out that nice midrange and maybe get rid of some of that cloudy quality I was talking about. A series XO may improve the soundstaging... lots of stuff to try.
I've probably made them sound like turds from that description but I'm fairly critical of sound in general and was just telling it how it is overall. However, when you say £50 and then listen to these speakers, all I can say is "bargain!". I imagine that after redoing the XO and a little extra bracing they will sound even better.
Actually these are such good value that I've bought another pair, don't know what I'll do with them yet but at the price I figure these will come in handy at some point. I've got plans for some gainclones with these too; small amps with small speakers
jleaman said:ShinOBIWAN,
I think you need a webpage to show off these beautiful creatures you have built.
Thanks but my web authoring skills are pretty much non existent. If you've seen Greg Balls(Amplifier Guru) website then your in the same Ball park (pun intended - the worst attempt at humour ever)
Banned
Joined 2002
ShinOBIWAN said:
Thanks but my web authoring skills are pretty much non existent. If you've seen Greg Balls(Amplifier Guru) website then your in the same Ball park (pun intended - the worst attempt at humour ever)
If you want ill give you you're own gallery if you like then you can upload your pics any time ?
Jase
jleaman said:
If you want ill give you you're own gallery if you like then you can upload your pics any time ?
Jase
Wow, that's mighty kind of you Jase.
Sounds like a nice idea. If you pass along the details I'll upload some stuff.
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