A little while ago I started on a project to basically make a 2-piece full range cabinet. The woofers in the cabinets are Dayton Classic 12's. Currently, I have the boxes ported and I like the sound of the bass, but I'm wanting higher SPL. Since these speakers will pull double duty....playin at home and at the occasional party. Here are the Dayton 12's:
http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=295-320
I made the boxes to be able to add an additional 12" woofer. Which direction should I take?:
1. Put another 12" Classic in each box, giving me a total of FOUR 12's.
OR
2. Focus on buying ONE subwoofer, since the Dayton CLassic 12's are not subwoofers.
My main concen the Dayton Classic 12's don't have alot of power handling. (80watts RMS.) and have a low xmax. (4.3 mm) Sealed boxes may assist with power handling, I assume.
Can 4 Dayton Classic 12's give me enough spl bass, even though they aren't subs?
Thanks.
http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=295-320
I made the boxes to be able to add an additional 12" woofer. Which direction should I take?:
1. Put another 12" Classic in each box, giving me a total of FOUR 12's.
OR
2. Focus on buying ONE subwoofer, since the Dayton CLassic 12's are not subwoofers.
My main concen the Dayton Classic 12's don't have alot of power handling. (80watts RMS.) and have a low xmax. (4.3 mm) Sealed boxes may assist with power handling, I assume.
Can 4 Dayton Classic 12's give me enough spl bass, even though they aren't subs?
Thanks.
First off, what kind of crossover are you running? passive, active w/ bi/tri-amp.
Second, can your amp handle a 4 ohm load?
If passive with 4ohm capability adding the second dayton wired in parallel will give you about 6dB boost, 3 dB from doubling cone area, and 3dB from doubling electrical power. However, if the speakers sound good now, then adding another woofer will alter the tonal balance, ie. if you system was all playing at 92dB/W and now you add woofers, the mid and tweeter will still play at that level but the wooferw will play at 98dB/W
Separate woofer will integrate the best, especially with a plate amp, but you would need a fairly bad*** sub to match 4 12's with a sensitivity of 92dB apiece.
If you can work out the sensitivity issue then I would go with the daytons, heck you already have the boxes and half the woofers.
BTW two 12's in series is still 92dB/W, just a 16ohm load and now the woofers will move at half the distance at any given power(compared to a single woofer) and the headroom will be doubled(IIRC).
Second, can your amp handle a 4 ohm load?
If passive with 4ohm capability adding the second dayton wired in parallel will give you about 6dB boost, 3 dB from doubling cone area, and 3dB from doubling electrical power. However, if the speakers sound good now, then adding another woofer will alter the tonal balance, ie. if you system was all playing at 92dB/W and now you add woofers, the mid and tweeter will still play at that level but the wooferw will play at 98dB/W
Separate woofer will integrate the best, especially with a plate amp, but you would need a fairly bad*** sub to match 4 12's with a sensitivity of 92dB apiece.
If you can work out the sensitivity issue then I would go with the daytons, heck you already have the boxes and half the woofers.
BTW two 12's in series is still 92dB/W, just a 16ohm load and now the woofers will move at half the distance at any given power(compared to a single woofer) and the headroom will be doubled(IIRC).
Prerunner
What size box and vent do you have right now?
If you go for a dual woofer with infinite baffle the F3 will be around 50Hz or so with a big 4cu ft box. You should be able to run much higher SPL with this config. tho. If you EQ boost at 40- 50 Hz should sound sweet for you. Try it and add a sub later if you still want more bottom.
What size box and vent do you have right now?
If you go for a dual woofer with infinite baffle the F3 will be around 50Hz or so with a big 4cu ft box. You should be able to run much higher SPL with this config. tho. If you EQ boost at 40- 50 Hz should sound sweet for you. Try it and add a sub later if you still want more bottom.
nunayafb,
It will be a 2nd order x-over w/ a x-over point of 2,000hz. The x-over has a jumper to run an 8-ohm or a 4-ohm woofer. I will probably put a horn tweeter in the box for 2,000hz up. The purpose of the boxes are a full-range box for decent SQ (not excellent), good spl and bass. This is a party speaker set.
My receiver will handle a 4ohm. If the woofers play higher than the tweeter, that's OK. There will will be other speakers around that will have enough high-end to balance it out. The more effiecient the woofers are, the better.
So how will the power thing work out? By running the speakers parallel, then I will be increasing the power to them. The Daytons are 80 watts rms, 4.3mm xmax. Am I going to run into trouble? Or will doubling the woofers reduce the need for higher xmax in one woofer?
FYI, I have two receivers that can handle a 4-ohm load. One is 80x2 at 8ohms. (I don't know what it is at 4-ohm.) The other is 150x2 at 8ohms and 210x2 at 4ohms.
Thanks.
It will be a 2nd order x-over w/ a x-over point of 2,000hz. The x-over has a jumper to run an 8-ohm or a 4-ohm woofer. I will probably put a horn tweeter in the box for 2,000hz up. The purpose of the boxes are a full-range box for decent SQ (not excellent), good spl and bass. This is a party speaker set.
My receiver will handle a 4ohm. If the woofers play higher than the tweeter, that's OK. There will will be other speakers around that will have enough high-end to balance it out. The more effiecient the woofers are, the better.
So how will the power thing work out? By running the speakers parallel, then I will be increasing the power to them. The Daytons are 80 watts rms, 4.3mm xmax. Am I going to run into trouble? Or will doubling the woofers reduce the need for higher xmax in one woofer?
FYI, I have two receivers that can handle a 4-ohm load. One is 80x2 at 8ohms. (I don't know what it is at 4-ohm.) The other is 150x2 at 8ohms and 210x2 at 4ohms.
Thanks.
infinia,
The boxes have an internal volume of 3.35 ft. They have a rear port that's about 3" diameter and 4" length. The boxes are a little small for 2 woofers ported. But if I make the port 4" diameter, it will work well enough and give me some good punch about 50hz. I sacrifice a little extension but get more spl. (accoding to Winsid). I could leave it at 3" diameter, but I may get too much port noise.
If I do a sealed box, then the dimensions are just about right.
Anything else to consider?
Thanks.
The boxes have an internal volume of 3.35 ft. They have a rear port that's about 3" diameter and 4" length. The boxes are a little small for 2 woofers ported. But if I make the port 4" diameter, it will work well enough and give me some good punch about 50hz. I sacrifice a little extension but get more spl. (accoding to Winsid). I could leave it at 3" diameter, but I may get too much port noise.
If I do a sealed box, then the dimensions are just about right.
Anything else to consider?
Thanks.
If you are running these subwoofers using a receiver you could benefit from upgrading to a subwoofer plate amplifier. Typical receivers don't have the power supply to support their claimed output with all channels driven.
I have a 5x100 pioneer receiver that can draw up to 250 watts, and a 2x100 watt amplifier that can draw 600 watts. The receiver could manage 2x100 with no headroom, while the amplifier can manage 2x100 with 6db headroom.
The 250 watt plate amp from PE would be a good choice. The 500 watt would be too much since the extra power would be wasted on the 4 12s.
Dan
I have a 5x100 pioneer receiver that can draw up to 250 watts, and a 2x100 watt amplifier that can draw 600 watts. The receiver could manage 2x100 with no headroom, while the amplifier can manage 2x100 with 6db headroom.
The 250 watt plate amp from PE would be a good choice. The 500 watt would be too much since the extra power would be wasted on the 4 12s.
Dan
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