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Old 17th October 2005, 05:11 AM   #31
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Quote:
Originally posted by carlosfm



I also heard the Halcros, with the 800Ds.
The source was a Linn CD12 (and this is also important).
The system sounded good to me, but as soon as the Halcros were changed by two (HUGE) top of the range Classé monoblocks, the sound fall apart. Bass was untight, detail vanished.
it was average to my ears... many things will whomp BW in it's price range.... at least this is my experience

the speaker being "picky" only means that in fact amps for most HT usage really are POORLY designed ...

2.8 ohms shouldn't be a problem driving well... realistically from an engineering standpoint anyway...


it's just all these huge Class A's require more transistors etc etc etc... bumps up production costs, heatsinks for really no improvement over a simple A/B amplifier (just my opinion)...

that halcro amps are pretty .... but sound no different than FAR cheaper amplifiers... including my LM4780 chip amp
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Old 17th October 2005, 07:26 AM   #32
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Quote:
Originally posted by Scottmoose
a pair of used Castles
I know where there is a set of used Castles stashed -- don't know which ones. I expect they would be quite reasonable.

I was also going to suggest checking out someone like Alegria Audio (ie Tim Forman) -- a small company selling direct that is pretty much one big step above DIY.

dave
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Old 17th October 2005, 06:18 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally posted by edjosh23
Carlosfm,

I have the 603S3 that I run with my gainclone that has 37.5v rails and the gainclone powers them with no problem. These are actually quite efficient (93db). I don't like them as much as I did originally, before I got into the DIY scene, but I don't have many complaints about them. They were $400 and although I could build better speakers for the money I think they are good enough to defend them. I definately have not listened to as many speakers as you, nor have my ears been training for as long as yours have (I'm 17) but I've listened to the entire B&W line, the McIntosh line, the Difinitive Technologies line, Klipsch, and many others. I have only listened to one pair of Paradigms and they were the same price range as the 602S3s and I thought they were detailed and had better midrange, I preferred the sound and the bass of the B&Ws.

Josh
Those B&Ws with a good 'gainclone' (specially with a good PSU) will probably sing fairly well, and better than MANY amps out there.
Don't underestimate the chipamp!



PS: by 'fairly well' I don't mean perfect, most B&Ws are really current suckers.
Only the smallest (and cheapest) 600 and 601 work fine with most amps. And they are fairly decent speakers for the money.
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Old 17th October 2005, 06:23 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally posted by Audiophilenoob
it was average to my ears... many things will whomp BW in it's price range.... at least this is my experience
Of course we didn't hear the same system.

Quote:
Originally posted by Audiophilenoob
the speaker being "picky" only means that in fact amps for most HT usage really are POORLY designed ...
That's right.

Quote:
Originally posted by Audiophilenoob
2.8 ohms shouldn't be a problem driving well... realistically from an engineering standpoint anyway...
Those 2.8 ohms are the 602S3
I was talking about those.
Now, can you imagine a cheap speaker that demands $$$$ from amplification to sing?
It makes no sense.

Quote:
Originally posted by Audiophilenoob
that halcro amps are pretty .... but sound no different than FAR cheaper amplifiers... including my LM4780 chip amp
Hey, I never compared them!
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Old 17th October 2005, 06:28 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally posted by carlosfm





Hey, I never compared them!

I think this guy would like either the Gallo reference, ML speakers, or maggies...

if he has the power for the maggies that is

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Old 18th October 2005, 11:23 PM   #36
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OKay, so I thought I would chronicle my trip through the stereo store jungle, and a little of what I thought of each speaker. I do feel a teensy bit bad going to stereo stores and taking their time when it is most likely I'll buy used in the end. I use local shops for a huge amount of random supplies and such though, and if something really strikes my fancy I'll defiantely buy from a retail shop.

For reference I use the IASCA car stereo demo disk as a first listening impression. I find the dynamics and transients to be excellent on the disk, even if the detail in the music isn't the end all. Usually I use Damian Rice "O" for vocals and Guitar. Great recording and I know exactly what the image should look like. Cold Play "Rush..." is one of the absolute most horific CD's I've ever heard from a recording standpoint. Mediocre speakers will cover the sound up, and make it okay. Good speakers that will resolve detail show it for what it is, a steaming pile of poo.

Today's mark: Paradigm Studio 60's (they didn't have 100's)

NAD electronics

Nice looking speakers, but not art. They definately do not look high end, and I would expect to see them somewhere like circuit city. We all hate to admit it, but speakers are furtniture too, and need to look good.
The sound was good, but just good. Detail was okay, but everything had a bit of a muffled tone too it. Bass was well defined, but held the note too long, and bloomed too much. Treble was excellent, but did not have the extended shimmer of something with a ribbon tweet. Midrange was quite fluid and the best part of the speaker. Voices resolved nicely and were silky smooth.

The image the speakers projected was accurate within the confines of the speaker. All of the sound came from between the 2 speakers, and from a point just above the tweeter. No recordings seemed to budge from this sonic picture. Hard tracks caused the field to collapse and the sound to move back to the speakers.

Dynamics were very good, but fast transients lacked punch. Knowing a lot of guys in drum corps, and being a long time brass player, I need something with good attack. I never once felt a kick drum, or felt that the attack of a trumpet was hit right on these speakers.

Overall a so so impression of the speakers, but also the first of many that I will seriously review.

Others to come on the list:
B&W from top to bottom (notably the DM640's and other S3 600 series)

Triangle Zerius
Vandersteen
B&G
Used Martin Logans
Maggies if I can find a dealer.
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Old 18th October 2005, 11:50 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally posted by dunderchief
Cold Play "Rush..." is one of the absolute most horific CD's I've ever heard from a recording standpoint. Mediocre speakers will cover the sound up, and make it okay. Good speakers that will resolve detail show it for what it is, a steaming pile of poo.
Absolutely right.
Good speakers will reveal that Colplay make good music and horrendous recordings.
Recommended for heavy EQ fans.

Quote:
Originally posted by dunderchief
Others to come on the list:
B&W from top to bottom (notably the DM640's and other S3 600 series)

Triangle Zerius
Vandersteen
B&G
Used Martin Logans
Maggies if I can find a dealer.
dunderchief, you may give a listen to Energy's Veritas range of speakers.
I've heard the 2.2i and the 2.3i, and they are quite good, if feeded with a good amp and source.
I don't like the flashy looks of Energy speakers, but the Veritas range are a little more 'classical' looking.
Well, anyway, these are the only decent speakers from Energy that I've heard.

http://www.energy-speakers.com/v2/pr...-line.php?id=2
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Old 19th October 2005, 05:09 AM   #38
fazman is offline fazman  Canada
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Dare I suggest a speaker internet direct?
Take a look at AV123.com
I've been diy'ing it for years with a little success but could never muster up the beautiful cabinets that me and my wife desired, so I bought RS750 Signatures. I've been very happy with mine. Quality drivers, cabinets and sound that you don't typically find at their price points and you get a 30 day money back guarantee.
Of course the diy'er in me just had to open them up and replace the capacitors with film and foil!
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