Vifa Xt25 + P13wh + Dayton RS180-8 your thoughts? - diyAudio
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Old 21st April 2005, 05:18 PM   #1
K-amps is offline K-amps  United States
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Thumbs down Vifa Xt25 + P13wh + Dayton RS180-8 your thoughts?

Guys need your input on this planned 3-Way.

I have been going back and forth on driver selection. I ditched the Dayton 2" dome in favor of the P13WH that many on the forum like.

Objectives are having a versatile system that is capable of hi-end sound as well as ability to take abuse from my big SS amps without "poofing" up or blaring. I am ok with F3 of 50Hz at -3db.

So far I have come up with a rudimentary design with MTM with the Vifa and XT25. 2 Vifa's in Parallel will give me 4 ohms same as the Xt25. Crossover will be at 3kHz .

Two Dayton RS180-8's will be paralleled for again 4 ohms and crossed over at 180Hz. Rudimentary box design pic is attached.

Any ideas /thoughts/ comments are appreciated.

K-
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Old 22nd April 2005, 01:43 AM   #2
K-amps is offline K-amps  United States
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ok..... I see everyone is just as clueless as I am
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Old 22nd April 2005, 07:22 AM   #3
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Put the 2nd woofer on the back (or in separate push-push box)... and XO where baffle step starts (you could put the 2nd mid on the back for that matter too....

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Old 22nd April 2005, 12:28 PM   #4
K-amps is offline K-amps  United States
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Thanks Dave,

Speakerbuilder noob here so please share your thoughts on the following:

1) What do you think about the driver selection/ interaction?

2) Putting a mid on the rear would reduce output on the front, it would also lose the D-appolito configuration... obviously you think it does not matter hence your stance... can u explain?

3) Baffle step... for time alignment?

4) Why put woofer on the rear?

5) What is push push? Isnt that the way it is? or Is that where one driver is installed on the rear but cones of both are oriented towards the listener.

Thanksa again!!
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Old 22nd April 2005, 12:38 PM   #5
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Why not go with an RS mid and the new RS tweeter?
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Old 22nd April 2005, 12:43 PM   #6
K-amps is offline K-amps  United States
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I already have a Dayton tweet and when I swapped the XT25, my jaw dropped. It sounded so much better..... so much better, I cannot believe domes could sound so good for the money.

Also many peeps have said that the P13Wh's are excellent mids, I have heard this from members, moderators, speaker designers etc etc.

No need to make a complete RS system.... I don't see the advantage unless I wanted to call it an RS system.

By the way, have your heard the RS mids and tweets, whats your opinion?

thanks!

K-
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Old 22nd April 2005, 02:19 PM   #7
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The only RS series I have heard are the RS125 (5") and the RS150 (6"). Both sound very, very nice to my ears, but do require a steep crossover to avoid the harshness later on in their response.

The RS tweeter just came out and is getting rave reviews over at the Parts Expres Tech Talk forum. Follow this link and scroll down a bit:

http://www.pesupport.com/cgi-bin/config.pl

Also, here's the link to the new RS series tweeters:

http://www.partsexpress.com/webpage....ak=275-130/135

If you already have the XT tweeters, you might as well use them.
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Old 22nd April 2005, 04:29 PM   #8
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I already have the Xt's plus the XT's were cheaper....
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Old 24th July 2008, 11:28 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally posted by mazeroth
Why not go with an RS mid and the new RS tweeter?
Because the RS mids breakup is so nasty Zaph even said said he prefers the cone on the DA175 to the RS: "Honestly, I like the DA175 cone better than the RS180 cone. Much more controlled in the upper midrange, and a less harsh breakup without the twin peaks."

I don't usually like metal cones sound, though there are rare exceptions.

Of he RS drivers I think I would like working with are the RS225 and the RS100 - RS225 for a woofer, crossed over fairly low, and the RS100 looks like it only needs a notch filter to control it's breakup. Oh, and the tweeter looks ok too, but I wonder if it has any advantages over a Seas 27TDFC or TBFC/G? I often also tend not to like metal domes on tweeters, but, I haven't heard most of the better ones yet...

I have a couple of the RS100s to play with.

But I would really like to try the P13 after hearing the P17s I just picked up at the PE tent sale for $14 ea. Can't keep just buying all the drivers I want to try though, until my wife finishes college, or, I get a much better job...

K-amps: what did you end up doing? Did you build a speaker with the P13 and XT25? Seems like that could be a real nice combination, with the XT25 having great potential if you cross it over 2,5Khz, and the beautiful smooth top end of the P13, not to mention, it's excellent sensitivity for the size...

Gainphile even said of the P13WH "Arguably the best midbass in existence."

edit: I was searching for more opinions on the P13, didn't realize how old this thread was, so... I made another reply and tried to answer more thoroughly, to at least make the thread useful, in case the OP is long gone...
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Old 24th July 2008, 11:51 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally posted by K-amps
Thanks Dave,

Speakerbuilder noob here so please share your thoughts on the following:

1) What do you think about the driver selection/ interaction?
The P13 has such a nice extended response and smooth roll off, it should work well with most tweeters, and be an excellent match w/the XT25.
Quote:
2) Putting a mid on the rear would reduce output on the front, it would also lose the D-appolito configuration... obviously you think it does not matter hence your stance... can u explain?
Bipole is an interesting design approach, but, not used nearly as commonly as MTM, TM, etc... We can guess that there must be a reason for that? Though I do advocate placing a tweeter on the rear for more even "power distribution".
Quote:
3) Baffle step... for time alignment?
No, he's not refering to a physically stepped baffle, "baffle step" is something different... Look up "baffle step compensation" or "BSC" - the on axis response will be made uneven by the boost of radiating into "2PI" vs "4PI" space, this boost varies as the frequency changes due to the change in the wavelength of sound corresponding to the size of the baffle affecting directionality of the output.
Quote:
4) Why put woofer on the rear?
To make a bipole configuration, it affects the BSC, you'd probably want to google "bipole" for more info on that.
Quote:
5) What is push push? Isnt that the way it is? or Is that where one driver is installed on the rear but cones of both are oriented towards the listener.
Huh? If one cone was on the rear, then it couldn't be pointed at the listener, but perhaps you mean mounted so that the back of the cone is sticking out? That is one way of doing it. "push push" with one mounted on the rear means that both drivers are in phase, both have their cones "pushing" out or in at the same time. If one cone was mounted with it's front face expose and the other with it's backside exposed, then they would be wired out of phase, but they would still be in phase, because one is reversed. Some people would say that some of the distortion coming from the back of the cone will be different from that coming from the front, and setting them up that way could be slightly superior due to that.

If one cone was mounted on the front and one in the back, except in a "push-pull" configuration then that would be called dipole (I think, is there a more specific term when using two woofers vs open baffle dipole?) though the more common way to do dipole is "open baffle".
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