Go Back   Home > Forums > Loudspeakers > Multi-Way

Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

Please consider donating to help us continue to serve you.

Ads on/off / Custom Title / More PMs / More album space / Advanced printing & mass image saving
Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 2nd April 2005, 05:07 PM   #11
diyAudio Member
 
Bill Fitzpatrick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Eugene, OR
Quote:
[i]
I guess thats your problem, nobody elses[/B]
Somebody hand me a baseball bat.
 
Old 2nd April 2005, 06:43 PM   #12
Nuuk is offline Nuuk  United Kingdom
diyAudio Member
 
Nuuk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Somerset, SW England
I don't know if we will get anybody posting hear in favour of the passive option!

I converted my two-way kit speakers to active and the improvement was not small.

You don't have to spend a lot of money on active crossovers either. The simple DIY crossover that I use is shown here

In fact I am currently 'renovating' my active system using Gainclone amplification. Gainclones remove the only argument against going active, ie, the high cost of the extra amplification!
__________________
The truth need not be veiled, for it veils itself from the eyes of the ignorant.
 
Old 2nd April 2005, 09:50 PM   #13
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: 12km off the alaska highway in northern BC
Quote:
Somebody hand me a baseball bat.
Tsk tsk, a little agressive, aren't we?

The only argument ever for me against aktiv - and I have persued that route in the diy ls building mode since 1989 - was the cost of the amps.

For diy amps - internet makes it easy now to get the parts, but at that time living close to the middle of nowwhere, diy electronics was a pain in the butt. So I stuck with diy ls building and started out with nad, eventually switching to brystons.

Very satisfied with compound loaded subs, and d'appolito sattellites, i am torn between the thor and the orion as my next projects - aktively amped of course; the orion requires that in any case.
 
Old 2nd April 2005, 10:48 PM   #14
diyAudio Member
 
5th element's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: England
Quote:
Originally posted by Bill Fitzpatrick
It's hard for me to justify actively crossing between the mid and tweeter.

But I am eager to learn the error of my ways if someone wants to educate me.
I suppose there is no substitute for entirely active, but it does depend on the design. Im sure you will always be able to tell the difference between semi active and fully active but the amount by which one is better could easily be different from one design to the next.

If you have a three way with a dome mid crossed at say 600hz and 4000hz then it will not handle anywhere near as much information as a mid covering 150-3000hz. In the first instance I bet the change from passive to active would not be as noticeable as the second. In the second, amp clipping is going to be an issue much more then the first, stopping this clipping reaching the tweeter would be audible. This going on a cross at 300hz is like giving half the music to the bass and half to the rest up. The midrange 150-3000 is probably going to have the hardest job in the entire system.
__________________
What the hell are you screamin' for? Every five minutes there's a bomb or somethin'! I'm leavin! bzzzz! Droggon Attack!
 
Old 2nd April 2005, 11:13 PM   #15
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Planet Earth
Don't forget all the little "extras" that the commercial analog active XOs don't supply, like the all-important baffle-step compensation and driver time alignment. Designing an active XO is just as hard as designing a passive one. You either need a DSP solution or an analog active customized just for your particular speakers.

http://www.linkwitzlab.com/filters.htm
 
Old 2nd April 2005, 11:36 PM   #16
Banned
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Australia
why use active crossovers i dont see them having benefits over passive ones and
they just complicate things, i think higher order passive ones do a great job
 
Old 2nd April 2005, 11:51 PM   #17
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: 12km off the alaska highway in northern BC
Quote:
why use active crossovers i dont see them having benefits over passive ones and
ahh - you're here now. Leaving Mr. Pass alone, aren't you?
Maybe you check with your countryman who very clearly describes what the problems are with passive xovers.

http://sound.westhost.com/bi-amp.htm
http://sound.westhost.com/biamp-vs-passive.htm
re: time alignment:
http://sound.westhost.com/ptd.htm

There are more studies on the benefits of active xovers if you know how to google, but I guess this will be good enough for a starter.
 
Old 3rd April 2005, 12:18 AM   #18
diyAudio Member
 
5th element's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: England
Quote:
Originally posted by catapult
Don't forget all the little "extras" that the commercial analog active XOs don't supply, like the all-important baffle-step compensation and driver time alignment. Designing an active XO is just as hard as designing a passive one. You either need a DSP solution or an analog active customized just for your particular speakers.

http://www.linkwitzlab.com/filters.htm
Im glad you mentioned that, I have seen so many times people writing as if plonking a 4th order linkwitz electrical active on both the woofer and tweeter are going to produce a super speaker. Yes the results of a textbook active xover is more predictable then a passive version. But that is where it ends.

Passive xovers and active xovers require specifically designing to the speaker they are going to be used with. Infact passive and active xovers are neither easier or harder then each other to design with. Both require measuring the drivers in the box they are going to be used in and some sort of software to simulate whats going to happen.

The main advantage of the active xover is the flexability it offers you, most of the time with passives you are stuck with a couple of frequencies and slopes that will keep good phase & frequency response. But with an active xover, mainly because of the time delay circuit, you open up whatever frequency or slope you want to use, but still all of this has to be designed for each individual louspeaker.
__________________
What the hell are you screamin' for? Every five minutes there's a bomb or somethin'! I'm leavin! bzzzz! Droggon Attack!
 
Old 3rd April 2005, 03:55 AM   #19
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Illinois
Has anyone used BruteFIR to do an xover, and how exactly do you do it. I have BruteFIR complied.
 
Old 3rd April 2005, 04:31 AM   #20
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Vancouver Island
Another who is firmly on the active bandwagon, but in addition to the cost of amps, I have heard of only one other drawback.

Once calibrated moving the speakers even slightly can necessitate a recalibration.

Hey Bill, those Elliot articles that audio-kraut (nice call on the Thor and Orion, BTW) referenced are pretty persuasive regarding the benefits of actives.

Here's a couple of other proponents:
http://www.linkwitzlab.com/crossovers.htm
http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/ide...um=20&pageNo=1
 

Closed Thread


Hide this!Advertise here!
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
active vs passive xo howard99 Multi-Way 4 25th July 2007 12:55 PM
Active of passive audiobomber Multi-Way 9 31st July 2004 02:31 AM
dB loss by using passive crossovers? Active vs Passive and 1st vs 4th order Hybrid fourdoor Multi-Way 3 11th July 2004 09:16 PM
Passive EQ to active EQ Nuuk Multi-Way 13 24th May 2004 07:59 AM
Passive vs Active I/V HeadSh0T Digital Source 1 7th May 2003 10:12 PM


New To Site? Need Help?

All times are GMT. The time now is 03:56 AM.


vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2014 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright 1999-2014 diyAudio

Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.3.2