I`m starting to plan a new speakers system and I will start from the midrange up, which should cover the range from 300 to 5k at least (perhaps in a front horn). These are the candidates
Audax
pr17mo
PHL
1120
B&C
6pe13, 6pev13, 6xt13, 8pe21, 8pl21
Beyma
6ml90
Fostex
f85k, 126, 166, 206
my room is about 20m2 and the the speakers should be able to play at realistic levels. Im looking for quality, detail, dynamics, excelent voice reproduction (female!). Below I`ll have dipole subs, and a slot tweeter (probably a beyma) on top.
I appriciate any commets
Audax
pr17mo
PHL
1120
B&C
6pe13, 6pev13, 6xt13, 8pe21, 8pl21
Beyma
6ml90
Fostex
f85k, 126, 166, 206
my room is about 20m2 and the the speakers should be able to play at realistic levels. Im looking for quality, detail, dynamics, excelent voice reproduction (female!). Below I`ll have dipole subs, and a slot tweeter (probably a beyma) on top.
I appriciate any commets
Timn8ter said:Wow, it's like.....you read my mind or something.
this were i'm supposed to say "great minds think alike"?
Used full-range the 108 is stunning (after 200-300 hrs of break-in), used 200-250, up to 6-10k they would be, well, stunning. Getting a good blend with any tweeter is the biggest challenge, but a horn loaded or waveguide loaded tweeter is going to no doubt give best results.
dave
Have you guys ever used one of the smaller Fostex in a front horn? I would have thought they would be ideal, but none of them seem to have a mass corner (2*Fs/Qts) that is much better than normal hi-fi drivers (ie 400-500Hz). Now, I guess that doesn't mean they won't work, but it means you'll have to do some work to get them flat, and that you'll be giving away much of the efficiency that horn-loading can provide.
However, front horns don't seem to be an exact science in many cases, so maybe they will work better than it would appear from the numbers.
However, front horns don't seem to be an exact science in many cases, so maybe they will work better than it would appear from the numbers.
Aw, geez GM why'd you go and do that. I'm crusing along just fine and you put a stick in my spokes and confuse me. I think you're getting at the crux of a question that I've been wondering about though - exactly how does the mass corner operate?
My understanding of mass corner is that it represents a first-order pole above which total power output from the driver falls at 6dB/octave. I've always assumed that in free space, this was more or less compensated for by falling directivity, keeping the on-axis response flat up to a much higher freq. However, when constrained by a CD horn, you dont get the same collapsing directivity, so you see the on-axis response fall above the mass corner.
So, are you saying that with a mid-horn it's better to take the low mass corner and use eq to achieve flat response, since it results in lower distortion? Or are you saying that I have no clue what I'm talking about, and have to go read more?
My understanding of mass corner is that it represents a first-order pole above which total power output from the driver falls at 6dB/octave. I've always assumed that in free space, this was more or less compensated for by falling directivity, keeping the on-axis response flat up to a much higher freq. However, when constrained by a CD horn, you dont get the same collapsing directivity, so you see the on-axis response fall above the mass corner.
So, are you saying that with a mid-horn it's better to take the low mass corner and use eq to achieve flat response, since it results in lower distortion? Or are you saying that I have no clue what I'm talking about, and have to go read more?
Im fallinng asleep now, but I reply shortly.
Yes I skipped the 108, and it might indeed be a very good candidate. I have not heard a sigma yet.
I listed mostly larger drivers because I am concernd about the not so good dynamics of the smaller ones. I also like the fact that the larger drivers are up to 11dB more efficient.
Two questions:
Do you feel the 108 is (as mid) better that the other fostex drivers I mentioned? From the others the audax really tempts me.
I have been reading that it is really dificullt even to get a DR mid horn from 300 up to 3K. Any comments? I like the controlled directivity of a horn. Would this be the case with a waveguide? Thats something I would have to start reading about.
Yes I skipped the 108, and it might indeed be a very good candidate. I have not heard a sigma yet.
I listed mostly larger drivers because I am concernd about the not so good dynamics of the smaller ones. I also like the fact that the larger drivers are up to 11dB more efficient.
Two questions:
Do you feel the 108 is (as mid) better that the other fostex drivers I mentioned? From the others the audax really tempts me.
I have been reading that it is really dificullt even to get a DR mid horn from 300 up to 3K. Any comments? I like the controlled directivity of a horn. Would this be the case with a waveguide? Thats something I would have to start reading about.
Greets!
It sounds like we have the same understanding of the mass corner, though I don't follow the EQ part. I mean WRT loading FR drivers, the horn lens is the EQ regardless of what the mass corner is, and done right doesn't affect the mass controlled BW, though if too much compression is used then the throat's high acoustic impedance will roll off the top end.
Where efficiency is the prime reason for using a horn to load a FR driver, then to keep compression low a higher Fc should be used. Of course if the efficiency is required due to using a flea power tube amp then its high output impedance will lower the effective mass corner so you're back to where you started design-wise, a point often overlooked in the design, so then they have to tweak it to get the 'bloom' out of it.
GM
It sounds like we have the same understanding of the mass corner, though I don't follow the EQ part. I mean WRT loading FR drivers, the horn lens is the EQ regardless of what the mass corner is, and done right doesn't affect the mass controlled BW, though if too much compression is used then the throat's high acoustic impedance will roll off the top end.
Where efficiency is the prime reason for using a horn to load a FR driver, then to keep compression low a higher Fc should be used. Of course if the efficiency is required due to using a flea power tube amp then its high output impedance will lower the effective mass corner so you're back to where you started design-wise, a point often overlooked in the design, so then they have to tweak it to get the 'bloom' out of it.
GM
- Status
- This old topic is closed. If you want to reopen this topic, contact a moderator using the "Report Post" button.