Just prejudice or based on what?
If a very flexible unit is wanted - try the behringer dcx 2498 - search in this forum for evaluation. I have one that replaced a marchand kit xover of very good quality (not only my opinion) that i had for 8 years in different configurations - and find no sound degradation.
my speaker is a 3 way design, that crosses over @ 300 hz, and 3500 hz. I need a 2-way crossover: i'll leave the passive crossover at 3500hz in place, just to be sure not to blow the tweeter when switching on the poweramp.
I'm not sure, but i think the passive crossover in my speaker is a 3rd-order filter. Most active crossovers are 1st-order, though.
would an active 1st-order filter not be better than a 3rd-order?
Isn't the main reason speakermanufacturers use 3rd- or even 4th-order filters, that those are cheaper?
I'm not sure, but i think the passive crossover in my speaker is a 3rd-order filter. Most active crossovers are 1st-order, though.
would an active 1st-order filter not be better than a 3rd-order?
Isn't the main reason speakermanufacturers use 3rd- or even 4th-order filters, that those are cheaper?
Hi,
I have found that most commercial active xovers ar either 2pole or 4 pole, with either Butterworth or Linkwitz Reilly cutoff. I bought a subtractive LR many years ago and hated it. Some time later I was able to measure the cutoff slopes and much was revealed!
The behringer can do all of these and a few (lot) more.
Big down side with behringer is the almost fixed output level after the filters. You need to add some kind of analogue attenuation before the power amps.
BTW most speaker manufacturers avoid 4 pole passive xovers because of the excessive cost. The cheap ones use just mechanical rolloff and single pole. Ugh.
regards Andrew T.
I have found that most commercial active xovers ar either 2pole or 4 pole, with either Butterworth or Linkwitz Reilly cutoff. I bought a subtractive LR many years ago and hated it. Some time later I was able to measure the cutoff slopes and much was revealed!
The behringer can do all of these and a few (lot) more.
Big down side with behringer is the almost fixed output level after the filters. You need to add some kind of analogue attenuation before the power amps.
BTW most speaker manufacturers avoid 4 pole passive xovers because of the excessive cost. The cheap ones use just mechanical rolloff and single pole. Ugh.
regards Andrew T.
You can attenuate input and output levels - only to within =/- 15 db's
and it is rather cumbersome. But - if you run your source signal to a preamp, and then to the dcx - you do not need that.
The problem might be that you then work in the digital domain with a non optimal input signal level.
Don't know if that could cause signal degradation.
I just run two six gang potis (available through "thel" in germany at a decent price, but they do not ship overseas - needs agerman adress) between the dcx out and the amps.
and it is rather cumbersome. But - if you run your source signal to a preamp, and then to the dcx - you do not need that.
The problem might be that you then work in the digital domain with a non optimal input signal level.
Don't know if that could cause signal degradation.
I just run two six gang potis (available through "thel" in germany at a decent price, but they do not ship overseas - needs agerman adress) between the dcx out and the amps.
You will now need the woofer and midrange leads from the X-over attached to the midrange unless you are keeping the Xover point the same. The passive is needed to protect the tweeter full time not just at start-up.keyser said:
Incorrect
That depends but not usually
No, quite the opposite. 1st order is a 6dB per octave, 2nd is 12, 3rd is 18 etc. The steeper the slope, the more parts are required.
Why not snap a pic of your Xover and post it for us?
Cal
WHOOPS, i was mistaking about the order of filters and their steepness. thought about it the other way around
(first order being a 24db filter)
posting a pic of the crossover is a good idea. i'll do that soon.
my speakers are Canton RC-L. throught google you'll find a lot (atleast i do here in the netherlands)
It is my intention to set the active X-over @ 300 hertz (same frequencie as it is now). send the signals to 2 different poweramps.
connect the outputs of the <\= 300hz (bass) amp directly to the terminals of the twin woofers.
connect the output of the >\= 300hz (mid\high) amp to the mid\high terminals on my bi-wirable speakers.
is this the right way? I said previously that most active x-overs are 1st order, but i meant 4th-order ofcourse.
so: would an active 4th-order filter not be best?
(first order being a 24db filter)posting a pic of the crossover is a good idea. i'll do that soon.
my speakers are Canton RC-L. throught google you'll find a lot (atleast i do here in the netherlands)
It is my intention to set the active X-over @ 300 hertz (same frequencie as it is now). send the signals to 2 different poweramps.
connect the outputs of the <\= 300hz (bass) amp directly to the terminals of the twin woofers.
connect the output of the >\= 300hz (mid\high) amp to the mid\high terminals on my bi-wirable speakers.
is this the right way? I said previously that most active x-overs are 1st order, but i meant 4th-order ofcourse.
so: would an active 4th-order filter not be best?
keyser,
as long as you are dealing with an ANALOG active x-over (I use Behringer CX 2300) you can do exactly as you proposed. My amplifiers are NAD, that can be split between pre- and poweramp.
If you want to use a DIGITAL active x-over (like the Behringer Ultracurve), you have to look for the best way to attenuate sound levels. It´s no good idea to do that before the x-over.
as long as you are dealing with an ANALOG active x-over (I use Behringer CX 2300) you can do exactly as you proposed. My amplifiers are NAD, that can be split between pre- and poweramp.
If you want to use a DIGITAL active x-over (like the Behringer Ultracurve), you have to look for the best way to attenuate sound levels. It´s no good idea to do that before the x-over.
Thanks Rudolf,
I bought a Behringer 2310 through e-bay. Guess that's the follow up of your 2300. What loudspeakers do you have, and how does the 24db/oct. alter the sound? Is the sound still coherent?
Do you know which parts of the passive crossover in my speakers I should disconnect?
I guess i should remove the filter that sits before the woofers. And as the Behringer already has a high-pass (I think I'll cross @ 300 hertz for my Canton RC-L's), I think I could also remove the High pass for the midrange driver and the tweeter.
Then the only passive parts I'll still be using are the bandpass for the midrange driver, and the high pass for the tweeter. Right?
I bought a Behringer 2310 through e-bay. Guess that's the follow up of your 2300. What loudspeakers do you have, and how does the 24db/oct. alter the sound? Is the sound still coherent?
Do you know which parts of the passive crossover in my speakers I should disconnect?
I guess i should remove the filter that sits before the woofers. And as the Behringer already has a high-pass (I think I'll cross @ 300 hertz for my Canton RC-L's), I think I could also remove the High pass for the midrange driver and the tweeter.
Then the only passive parts I'll still be using are the bandpass for the midrange driver, and the high pass for the tweeter. Right?
keyser
sorry for the typo - my Behringer is a 2310 too. I´m crossing between Visaton W250 woofers(http://www.visaton.de/english/artikel/art_645_1_19.html) in H-dipoles and Veravox 3 FR speakers (http://www.cantare-as.de/templates/images/veravox3.jpg). x-over is @200hz, which is right in the middle of the H-baffle resonance and one oct above fs of the veravox. I never had a passive x-over for this combination, so can´t compare. But with the modest speaker values in mind (~110 Euro per side), imaging, coherence and disappearence of the speakers is quite impressive.
Regarding your passive x-overs you should try to post the schematics here. There are people more knowledgeable than me on this forum to decide about that.
Rudolf
sorry for the typo - my Behringer is a 2310 too. I´m crossing between Visaton W250 woofers(http://www.visaton.de/english/artikel/art_645_1_19.html) in H-dipoles and Veravox 3 FR speakers (http://www.cantare-as.de/templates/images/veravox3.jpg). x-over is @200hz, which is right in the middle of the H-baffle resonance and one oct above fs of the veravox. I never had a passive x-over for this combination, so can´t compare. But with the modest speaker values in mind (~110 Euro per side), imaging, coherence and disappearence of the speakers is quite impressive.
Regarding your passive x-overs you should try to post the schematics here. There are people more knowledgeable than me on this forum to decide about that.
Rudolf
- Status
- This old topic is closed. If you want to reopen this topic, contact a moderator using the "Report Post" button.