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Old 14th December 2004, 08:55 PM   #41
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Very stupid of Bose to use 1ohm drivers and wire them in series. You'll NEVER get good and well defined bassreproduction when wiring loudspeakers in series. Only if the units are manufactured with minimal tolerances, I mean really minimal you'll get great results. Allways wire parallel!!!!
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Old 14th December 2004, 11:19 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally posted by bombardon73
Very stupid of Bose to use 1ohm drivers and wire them in series. You'll NEVER get good and well defined bassreproduction when wiring loudspeakers in series. Only if the units are manufactured with minimal tolerances, I mean really minimal you'll get great results. Allways wire parallel!!!!
Totally untrue.
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Old 15th December 2004, 12:23 AM   #43
sam9 is offline sam9  United States
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I bought into the "never wire in series" position until not long ago. Then an article appeared in AudioExpress a few months back in which the proposition was tested not by a theoretical thought experiment or even a simulation but by actual experimentation using measurments.

Unfortunately I didn't keep a copy of the issue or I would provide the citation. Anyway, speakers having such a wide range of characteristics I don't think the article was proof to the contrary with regard to ALL speakers, under ALL circumstances, but it was enough to convince me that I cannot contuinue hold the position as an inviolable rule.
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Old 15th December 2004, 12:26 AM   #44
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And speaking of the 901's
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Old 15th December 2004, 12:48 AM   #45
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Bill, about wiring in series, this certainly IS true. When running speakers parallel the differences in resistance e.g. won't affect eachother as much as when you would when run them in series.
I 1st thought that it wouldn't matter, but an article in a german speakerbuild magazine proves it DOES matter.
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Old 15th December 2004, 01:58 AM   #46
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Quote:
Originally posted by bombardon73
Bill, about wiring in series, this certainly IS true. When running speakers parallel the differences in resistance e.g. won't affect eachother as much as when you would when run them in series.
Well then, let's rephrase that.

It's fine to run speakers in series IF they are the same make and model and are enclosed in the same volume. If they are different, then it shouldn't be done.
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Old 15th December 2004, 02:02 AM   #47
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I've heard arguments both pro and con about wiring drivers in series. My feeling is that series is bad, in that the other drivers destroy any damping factor that you might have had, thus control at low frequencies. In a case like this, where you're using drivers "full range" and with drastic EQ, that could be critical. The counter argument involved something about the back EMF from the other drivers making up the difference. It's been a while. The reasoning was actually somewhat logical, but I remember leaving with the feeling that it would take a little bit more to convince me.
Speaking of non sequiturs, I think I've detected one in the statement that dispersion makes up for lack of dynamics. Clearly we have a True Believer on our hands. I find it fascinating that people still fall for the direct/reflecting advertising hoopla--it was debunked years ago. 'Life-like' it isn't. Adding ambience from unpredictable listening room acoustics to those of the original recording doesn't reproduce anything accurately, unless your goal is the acoustic equivalent of a funhouse mirror. Might as well go to a mall and listen to the ceiling speakers. It's the same effect--widely dispersed sound, poor frequency response, and lots and lots of ambience from all those nice, acoustically reflective walls and floors. Unfortunately, it's not in the same ballpark as high fidelity; it's just, for want of a better term, a special effect. The predictable sour grapes sentiment comes in the follow-up post: Oh well, can't have good sound anyway...might as well goof up the sound some more.
I don't know what the max SPL of the 901 was, but there was a black cabinet version sold for several years in the '70s for PA use. I don't remember the nomenclature, but it was nothing more than a standard 901 played 'backwards,' i.e. with the drivers facing the audience rather than the wall, and without the wood veneer. I played in a band once that used them. Always thought they sounded pretty poor. When we got a chance at a larger outdoor gig, we jumped at the chance to play through another band's PA system. What a relief.

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Old 15th December 2004, 02:22 AM   #48
jmikes is offline jmikes  Canada
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Quote:
Originally posted by GRollins
Speaking of non sequiturs, I think I've detected one in the statement that dispersion makes up for lack of dynamics. Clearly we have a True Believer on our hands. I find it fascinating that people still fall for the direct/reflecting advertising hoopla--it was debunked years ago. 'Life-like' it isn't. Adding ambience from unpredictable listening room acoustics to those of the original recording doesn't reproduce anything accurately, unless your goal is the acoustic equivalent of a funhouse mirror. Might as well go to a mall and listen to the ceiling speakers.

Grey

You need to brush up on both your reading and your listening skills. I never said dispersion compensates for the loss of dynamics in a recording. Neither did I say that a dispersion speaker is "life-like." What I did say is that the dispersion theory is an attempt to compensate for the dynamic loss by increasing the amount of sound waves in the listening environment, and by doing so be more life-like than a standard speaker arrangement. That it can do so is a fact to those who have adequately explored it. It's only been "debunked" by the tin-eared or those who haven't adequately explored the concept.

One thing you don't need to improve is your arrogance, which it seems grows out of both your ignorance and your acceptance of only one way to appreciate sound. Whatever trips your trigger.
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Old 15th December 2004, 03:10 AM   #49
Bose(o) is offline Bose(o)  Canada
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That Bose PA system was the Bose 800, it included 8 Bose drivers and all were in sealed enclsoures. I could only see it being used as a mid-high section for small PA applications.

I can't bring any reflection based speaker names, but I believe I read on tnt-audio a speaker that relies on the wide reflection of sound to provide the listener with the reproduction of the recording. As with all reflection based speakers, proper setup was a crucial fact of getting the right sound from the system.

The reviewer was left as a converted, all sound must be direct and very little, if any reflected believer.
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Old 15th December 2004, 03:59 AM   #50
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Quick question: how long does this kind of job take? Keep in mind I've never cracked these speakers open before, much less done a refoam job on them.
While all you guys puss and moan about whether Bose speakers are any good, I'll answer the question.

Figure about 4 hours apiece. But most of it is waiting for glue to dry. I used the rims of glasses to apply pressure to the foam for attachment to the frame. Because of the angles, you can only do four at once, then the other four, and finally the one. This is "work" for in front of the TV on a Sunday afternoon, not real work. This is not brain science or rocket surgery. The only tools might be a sharp piece of flint or sharpened bone... relax.

Ignore the comments about not being able to reproduce the original FR. That's most likely an improvement. In the true DIY spirit, you can tell people that you rebuilt them. If you don't like them, f'em and grab some jing on Ebay.
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