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Old 3rd December 2004, 10:24 AM   #1
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Default Peerless Drive units

Hi,

Ive just bought a pair of Peerless 831 - 531 drive units from ebay these are 10 " .I cant find any info out on them.Does anyone know this drive unit ? Im thinking of making an isobarrik sub woofer.

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Anthony
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Old 3rd December 2004, 01:57 PM   #2
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Hello electroant2 (that is your ebay id right?); perhaps sending a message to the person whom you bought the drivers from may lead to datasheets. I have tried looking to no avail for you, even via the d-s-t website.

If however the seller doesn't have the data-sheets your next bet is to e-mail danish sound technology - peerless and ask them politely for datasheets. It may just be that these drivers are no longer on production/sale (and havent been for a long while).

Looking through the d-s-t website I found similar drivers, 831510, 831709. Since this is a 10" driver the other's are over 245mm even though they begin with 831. If you look in the engineering page you will see that 83xxxx are "woofers". If your's is the first (831510) then it will be a mid-bass driver, otherwise it's a subbass.

I hope this helps a little bit, and I'm sorry I couldn't find the datasheets for you. Good luck!
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Old 3rd December 2004, 05:10 PM   #3
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Hi there,

Thanks for you help i emailed the guy i bought these from and he sent me the TS parameters.

here are the parameters. ohms nom=8 Re=6.1 Le=1.5mh Fs=26.4hz Qms=2.35 Qes=0.52 Qts=0.43 Mms=30.07 Sd=310.0cm2 Vas=160.61litres Bl=7.7 Voice coil diameter =33mm sensitivity 2.83v at 1m =90dB.

Would these units make a good subwoofer ? Ive already got Kef Referance 105.3s with kube but id like to have a sub to handle the lower bass for movies etc im thinking bandpass or and isobarrik design using both of the units.

Cheers

Anthony
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Old 4th December 2004, 12:11 AM   #4
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I wouldn't use this driver in isobarik configuration, as it has a max spl of 87dB. If you use both drivers in a sealed enclosure you will be at 93dB but that won't be near enough for a HT setup.

The frequency response in the lower octaves is quite bad also, -9dB down at 25Hz. These drivers appear to be more useful in a 2-way to n-way system configuration and not a subwoofer.

Hope this helps, Vlad.
4.12.2004
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Old 4th December 2004, 04:37 PM   #5
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Would they make a good subwoofer? It depends what you mean by "good".

I glanced at the Peerless page, plus remembered Peerless models from years past. The 33 mm voice coil was usally 17mm long, Peerless air gaps were 6 or 8 mm long, so to boil it down, linear excursion was about 5.5 mm.

Believe it or not, that was considered pretty long linear travel up until 1990 or so. Now, the heavyweights have travel twice as long and longer.

Still, 5.5 or 6mm is not bad, just not great. And at 90 dB at one watt, the sensitivity is higher than most of those long stroke subs, anyway. So you give a little, you get a little.

They'll go down to 26 Hz in a vented configuration equal to the speaker's Vas. Unfortunately, the speaker's Vas is 160 liters-over five cubic feet. If I'm going to devote 5 cubic feet to a subwoofer, I would certainly use other units than these, although if I had a five cubic foot cabinet hanging around, and the space in my listening area to fit it in, these will acquit themselves pretty well.

In a sealed box, the story improves considerably.

Below are the curves for 3 sealed boxes. These are shown without room gain, which is certain to be present and improve the bass output.


Red is 4 cu ft, Qtc = 0.7
Bue is 2 cu ft, Qtc = 0.9
Green is 1.5 cu ft, Qtc = 1.05


Although these days people are drifting toward Qtc = 0.5, the fact is that ever since the closed box was fully understood, engineers have aimed toward a Qtc that is between 0.7 and 1.0 cu ft. That was considered the high fidelity range,and most commercial loudspeakers are between those numbers.

Qtc = 1.05 can for all intents and purposes be considered Qtc = 1.0.

As you can see, the red line, (2 cu ft) and the green line (1.5 cu ft) give pretty good sub performance. As far as box size goes, I can only point this out: rmemeber the old AR's and Advents that most people had during the seventies? Well, those were 2 cu ft, and most people did not consider them obtrusive. So a box of 2 cu ft and below should fit into most people's listening space without too much trouble.

Of course, since the box is sealed and there is no supplementation from a port, the 5.5 mm linear travel might cut down on super high SPL in the very low ranges, but many might not notice that. And remember-there is considerable extra travel above the linear limit, but with increasing distortion. Your ability to hear distortion goes down in the bass range, however.

I would check to see the sensitivity of your KEF. If the sensitivity is within 2 dB or so, I would recommend picking these up if the price isn't so high. Then I would stick them in a 2 cu ft or 1.5 cu ft box. Unless you are looking for super high SPLs real low, I think they will make a nice subwoofer.

The smallest box will only be 6 dB down from midpoint at 30 dB,and remember, that will be without counting room gain.
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Old 4th December 2004, 05:21 PM   #6
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They seem to perform pretty much like a peerless 850146 in a sealed box, again these dont have sub bass, but what they do have is very nice. The peerless 10" now have about 9mm xmax. I saw these on ebay and they look like 727's which have 9mm too.

OK I just fired up LspCAD and had a look at what drivers it comes with, it seems like the parameters you have there are for the 832531. The 831531 doesnt seem to exist. Email peerless.

Either way, the specs could just be very similar anyway, all peerless 10" seem to have similar specs anyway. Id bet if you plonked it in a 60litre sealed box it would work well.

Either way according to the LspCAD data file these have 4mm xmax which is not quite as good as I thought they could be.

However you do get an f3 of about 45hz and an f12 of 24hz, with room gain this will improve. You will get about 100dB out of it before you hit xmax at 50hz. This not a bad figure for a 10" in a sealed box wit 4mm xmax.
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Old 4th December 2004, 05:25 PM   #7
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Bandpass?

Well, here is a 4 th order bandpass, (sealed on one side, ported on the other).Also, a sealed woofer. both are 2 cu ft, total.



The orange is the 4 th order bandpass. Back chamber is 1 cu ft, sealed. Front chamber is 1 cu ft, ported to 69 Hz.
The blue is 2 cu ft, sealed. Qtc = .9


As you can see, the output of the bandpass is higher, although down around 30 Hz the two tend to meet. However, the group delay-normally allied with distortion, will tell another story.

Here is the frequency response fo rthe bandpass and sealed:
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File Type: gif peerless 831531 bandpass and sealed.gif (4.7 KB, 362 views)
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Old 4th December 2004, 05:32 PM   #8
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And here is the group delay for the two bandpass and sealed, again orange for bandpass and blue for 2 cu ft sealed. the bandpass is considerably higher throughout the range, getting quite high in places.

Group delay is associated with transient response and distortion. The lower the better.

However, if you are going to use this for Home Theater or movies, the group delay might not matter much. The sub will only be there for sound effects, after all, unless you are watching something where the music is important.

Low group delay is important for music.

Both boxes will have the same internal volume, 2 cu ft. for each.
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Old 4th December 2004, 05:44 PM   #9
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By the way, what is the fellow asking for the two Peerlesses?
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Old 4th December 2004, 05:51 PM   #10
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I think he has already bought them.
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