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Old 26th November 2004, 09:36 AM   #1
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Location: Indiana
Default Please help with design issues for home theater

This is my first post, and I would first like to thank everyone for the valuable information that I have already read on this forum, and I would like to ask for advanced forgiveness of my igorance on some of the subject matter. But, we all have to start somewhere, so here I go.
This is going to be my first project, and I am open to whatever ideas you guys can throw at me. I'm not stuck on a certain speaker, design, or anything, all I want is a set of speakers that sound good and are the best bang for the buck in my budget. I know these type of design questions have been asked hundreds of times by noob's, and I have read what I could find and just can't figure out what will work best for my room situation.

MY OBJECTIVES:

design: I would prefer a tried and true design over my own
design

# of speakers: 3 (left front, center, right front) eventually I would
like to add a sub, unless it is not needed

speaker configuration: open to ideas

budget: under $500

primary usage: 100% movies, 0% music

goals: I currently have a $500 sony htib, which to my tastes
could be a little bit louder and I have much trouble
discerning dialogue on movies (possibly b/c of the shape
of my room?) So, I would like to improve on these areas.

TECHNICAL DATA:

receiver: possibly either a yamaha htr5760 or a pioneer
vsx1014tx-k (I haven't ordered one yet, but these are
my top two choices because of their auto-calibration)

speaker location: all three speakers, will go behind my projector
screen (I plan on using either a screen research
or a da-lite high contrast cinema perf (both are
"acoustically transparent"))
They must fit in a space that is 27"h x 52"w, I
am somewhat flexible on the depth, but would
prefer to be under 12" (again, I am somewhat
flexible)

room size: I will post some pics with descriptions of my room
later in this post, but my total cubic volume
(including adjacent hallways and kitchen) is
approximately 5600 cu ft

main listening area: the area that will be sat in most is 12' away
from the speakers and the center of the
27"h opening is approximately 20" above
ear level



ROOM

PIC #1: http://us.f1f.yahoofs.com/bc/51a455c...ouqpBBH4.m4DQI

This is a side shot of the room from the kitchen side, you can see the open hallway the vaulted ceiling and the hardwood floor

PIC #2
http://us.f1f.yahoofs.com/bc/51a455c...ouqpBBUTXnOMM7

This is a shot from the screen side of the room, here you can see the odd shape of the room and the plant shelf in the upper right hand corner, along with another open hallway

PIC #3
http://us.f1f.yahoofs.com/bc/51a455c...YBrpBBdHXEKFn8

Here is a shot showing the kitchen side of the room

PIC #4
http://us.f1f.yahoofs.com/bc/51a455c...YBrpBBUzlq8DnM

This is the shot of where the screen and speakers will be going, there is also a mantle and fireplace I'm getting ready to put in, which will go under the screen



Well, I think I've given enough info to get started, let me know if I've left anything out. Just to let you know I have some decent experience in woodworking (not extensive, but I'm willing to give anything a try) and I am a residential electrician so reading schematics should not be a problem, and if I have any trouble putting parts together, my dad was a stereo repair guy for a few years way back, so he should be able to help me. Thanks again.
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Old 26th November 2004, 10:21 AM   #2
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Location: NL
Try full range tangband speakers for the center channel it doesn't cost too much. For your front speakers I suggest to go with some tangband Dayton hybrid. e.g. Dayton reference 8" for the bass and tangband for highs. In that case you have the same sound signature for all and true bass performance as a bonus.

You can put the dayton in a 60-70 l cabinet tuned at 22-25 Hz. Cross-over at 300-800 Hz with a tangband unit. Price indication ~$45/each

For the proper tangband unit I would suggest the W3-871S (the one with the metal cone). Price indication ~$25/each

Just a suggestion, if you want more extension on top you need to add a tweeter, but with the 3" TB I doubt it..
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Old 26th November 2004, 01:41 PM   #3
AndrewT is offline AndrewT  Scotland
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Hi, plan for 5.1 channel and include for future rear left & right as well as sub.
I have seen recommended that all speakers should be full range and not just satellites. This also implies that the peak volume from each speaker should be about the same. This applies especially to dolby surround sound (movies) because the loud bits could come from anywhere.
& for best movie sound effect the sub bass should go really low, aim for an octave below music i.e. about 20Hz to 30Hz or lower if quality and budget permit.
From your listening distance it appears that the stereo separation is too narrow. Try; listening distance = left & right distance.
If your decoder cannot cope with time delays then also try to keep listening distance to all speakers about equal.
regards Andrew T.
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Old 26th November 2004, 04:17 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally posted by LaMa
Try full range tangband speakers for the center channel it doesn't cost too much. For your front speakers I suggest to go with some tangband Dayton hybrid. e.g. Dayton reference 8" for the bass and tangband for highs. In that case you have the same sound signature for all and true bass performance as a bonus.
Thanks for the reply, do you know of any established plans that use this set-up and have the design and XO mapped out, b/c I do not own any testing software and I want my first project to be a proven design, so I don't get frustrated building the XO. Sometime in the future, if this project goes well, I may try designing my own.


Quote:
Originally posted by LaMa
You can put the dayton in a 60-70 l cabinet tuned at 22-25 Hz. Cross-over at 300-800 Hz with a tangband unit. Price indication ~$45/each
What are you referring to when you say tune the cabinet at 22-25 Hz?

Quote:
Originally posted by LaMa
For the proper tangband unit I would suggest the W3-871S (the one with the metal cone). Price indication ~$25/each.
I checked up a little bit on this 3" and people seem to be pretty happy, but some have noted a peaking at 17 Khz. Have you noticed this and would it affect me much since I'm using it for ht and not music?


Quote:
Originally posted by AndrewT

From your listening distance it appears that the stereo separation is too narrow. Try; listening distance = left & right distance.
If your decoder cannot cope with time delays then also try to keep listening distance to all speakers about equal.
regards Andrew T.
Thanks for replying, I probably will plan for a 5.1 set-up, but monetary funds are limiting me to just the three speakers for now. As far as the listening distance to the speaker seperation ratio goes, I'm pretty much stuck with what I have to work with, and I'm hoping that the auto-calibration of the receiver will help with this. If I am way off with my assumption, please let me know.
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Old 27th November 2004, 03:56 AM   #5
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Location: Indiana
Any suggestions? Please help!

I forgot to mention in my original post that the speakers will be surrounded by sheetrock on the front, back, and sides. I can leave up to a couple of inches on the top and sides if I need to, but I'm assuming I need a sealed enclosure since there is not much room for venting.

Thanks so far for the help, but please, keep it coming.
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Old 27th November 2004, 05:18 AM   #6
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I have tried several times without success to see the pics but only get an error message. Have others had a problem?
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Old 27th November 2004, 05:50 AM   #7
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Sorry Bill and everyone else, I forgot to make the folder public, so nobody could see it but me. It should be fixed now, so let me know if you are still having trouble. Thanks.

And regarding my last post about the sheetrock, I said that wrong. The sheetrock will be in close proximity to the top, back, and sides, not the front, that would be senseless.
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Old 27th November 2004, 06:11 AM   #8
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First, will the fireplace be used? I don't know about a projection screen above a fire place.

Second, is the screen permanent or will it retract or roll up? Does it have to be flush with the wall or can it be out from the wall a foot or so?

Third, what kind of movies do you like to watch and how loud to you want it to go?

Get me these answers and I'll give you some different options. In the meantime, just forget about any boxes to build. Boxes is the main reason you can't understand the dialogue with what you have now.
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Old 27th November 2004, 06:16 AM   #9
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Still no pix.
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Old 27th November 2004, 06:17 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally posted by johninCR
Boxes is the main reason you can't understand the dialogue with what you have now.
That's a load.
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