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Old 4th July 2002, 01:25 AM   #1
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Default "mass added to cone" I'm confused about it's meaning

I want to buy the woofers at this link http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/ebayISAPI.dll...gephotohosting , but when I plug in the specs into WinISD (and others) I get a vented box with strange box calculations. Vbox = 3.5 liter, Tuning freq. = 57 Hz., Vent is 2 meters long. Is it because there's no place to put in the "mass added to cone" spec? I know I've seen a program that has a place to plug in this spec, but I forget which one it is. Does anybody know of any? What do you think? Are they just bad subwoofers?
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Old 4th July 2002, 01:42 AM   #2
jleaman is offline jleaman  Belgium
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Well the dust cap is large and the 3 layer spider is abonus at least in its hi travel it wont rip off the v.c
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Old 5th July 2002, 01:14 AM   #3
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The speaker seems to have many of the same characteristics of the Peerless XLS 10". Only the company is not well-known like Peerless. The Peerless XLS 10 is something like $130 each.

The Peerless XLS series is basically designed for those who want to put a decent sized driver inside a very small box and get high output in the bass down to 50 Hz or so.

Below is a graph of the auctioned speaker, in red,and the Peerless XLS 10", in green. The box for both is a one half cubic foot enclosure, (14 liters), tuned to 42 Hz. Note the similarity, with the Peerless just edging out the auction speaker. The auction speaker dips just a little in the low range, but other wise holds it's own down to 42 hz-the lowest note the bass guitar normally plays, (with normal tuning).

In short, this is meant for a car where you want low but not necessarily super low bass in a small enclosure. And lots of it.

Normally, a 3" port is sufficient for a 10 inch speaker. Noisewise, a flared 2" port is roughly equivalent to a 3 inch port. A 2" port will tune a one half cubic foot box down to 42 Hz if it is 8" long.

I haven't used flared ports. Posters who have say that you should add an extra inch for the flares. So make that 9 inches with a 2 inch flared port.

Flares are available from Parts Express or Madisound, among aother places.

Here is the graph:
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File Type: gif auction speaker.gif (4.9 KB, 251 views)
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Old 5th July 2002, 04:23 AM   #4
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Thanks for the help. I think the subwoofer/speaker design programs that I used to design this speaker give me suggestions that seem to put the speaker in a box where it has the flatest frequency response. From the graph that you made and that I made later using WinISD (looks the same) the box for that wooker needs to be bigger (14 liter per woofer), with a lower tuning frequency (42 Hz). I don't think that I'll be going with a vented woofer in my car, I like sealed enclosures much better.
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Old 5th July 2002, 04:29 AM   #5
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Yes, the graph I printed out was from Win ISD. That is the program I usually use.

Sealed would be tough for this woofer. You would start rolling off below 100 Hz.

Look for a speaker with a higher Qts for sealed. Or a very very low Fs.
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Old 6th July 2002, 02:28 PM   #6
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Want a nice 10 inch subwoofer for your car in that price range? One that works okay in a small sealed box?

Try the Peerless CSX 10".

I don't know if you know about Qtc-what the Q of a woofer is while in the box-but in a one half cubic foot box, the CSX 10" has a Qtc of 1.18. In a three quarters cubic foot box, (21 liters), it has a Qtc of .98.

Optimum Qtc is between .7 and 1.0. So the three quarter cubic foot box is within optimum range, the half cubic foot box is a little less than optimum-but still workable. Some might find it a bit boomy, most would find it all right.

In these compact boxes, don't forget to leave a little space for the space the speaker itself occupies. In these small boxes, that makes a difference.

About $60 each from Parts Express and Madisound, if you are in the US.

Available also in the UK and Australia.

Red is the half cubic foot, green is the three quarters cubic foot. box.
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File Type: gif peerless csx 10 inch comp.gif (4.8 KB, 205 views)
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Old 6th July 2002, 03:41 PM   #7
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Oops. Forgot to mention that the CSX is 8 ohm. Most car amps are 4 ohm. A 4 ohm amp can only deliver half it's maximum power into an 8 ohm speaker.

Still not a bad choice. But before you buy you might want to look around to see if you can find anything like it in a 4 ohm version.

Actually, I have something in mind but I gotta run. I'll check it out and be back to you later.
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Old 7th July 2002, 12:16 AM   #8
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Thanks for your help. Two 8 ohm subs is good thing. I might buy 2 used eclipse 8712.8 subwoofers (although I don't like to buy used woofers), but they seem to be nice woofers and they're a good match for my Soundstream 702 (700 watts @ 2/4 ohms). I don't understand why that amp puts out the same ammount of power at 2 and 4 ohms, but soundstream says it does. What was your idea?
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Old 8th July 2002, 12:30 AM   #9
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The two I had in mind were the Blaupunkt PC 10 wi, available at Parts Express for $80, and the Blueprint 1001 for $81.

Of the two, the Blueprint is much the better, with a one way excursion of an inch. That is heavy duty air moving-and the more air is moved, the more bass can be produced. The Blaupunkt is not puny in the excursion department-a quarter inch, which used to tbe considered very good-but it is nowhere near Blueprint's class.

I personally have not tried the Blueprint drivers yet, but they are highly recommended by others on this website.

Blueprints are available here:
http://www.missiondigital.net/

Here is a picture of the Blueprint in a one half cubic foot sealed box. With the Blueprint's excursion, your big amp and normal cabin gain, you should be able to pump out big bass to below 30 Hz.
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File Type: gif blueprint 1001 one half cubic foot.gif (5.2 KB, 153 views)
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Old 8th July 2002, 12:59 AM   #10
Bose(o) is offline Bose(o)  Canada
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but why would a larger Xmax make a driver better? With the driver moving further from it's original position, drum kicks would come later, more distortion is caused because the driver has to move so far, in so little time (Compared to others).
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