I have recently purchased speakers with titanium tweeters.
the system is biamped with a class A amp on the tweets
I am finding it difficult to balance the tweeters with a good presence and a comfortable listening level , They seem harsh
1) will the tweeters break in after a while and mellow out ?
2) can trying a different amp help the problem or is it more a function of the tweeter ?
This is a high end car audio application but i would really like to get the opinion of a speaker expert
jeff
the system is biamped with a class A amp on the tweets
I am finding it difficult to balance the tweeters with a good presence and a comfortable listening level , They seem harsh
1) will the tweeters break in after a while and mellow out ?
2) can trying a different amp help the problem or is it more a function of the tweeter ?
This is a high end car audio application but i would really like to get the opinion of a speaker expert
jeff
If you're particularly sensitive to the sound of titanium tweeters, you'd be better off considering different drivers, rather than hoping for them to mellow out or trying a different amp. I'm in the same boat -- I've tried a variety of speakers at various price points and generally I can't abide the sound of most metal dome tweeters, even with single-ended tube amplification. I can't explain why I find them so harsh (I know I'm in the minority and the psychoacoustic issues are undoutedbly complex) but I understand where you're coming from and the problems will not go away over time or disappear with a better amp.
reality
Great just what i wanted to hear , What I knew deep down in my heart but did not want to except. Well I think I will configure the best i can untill I can replace them . The only thing is I have an old pair of B&W speakers and they have a metal dome tweeter and I LIKE THE SOUND
Jeff
titanium
Great just what i wanted to hear , What I knew deep down in my heart but did not want to except. Well I think I will configure the best i can untill I can replace them . The only thing is I have an old pair of B&W speakers and they have a metal dome tweeter and I LIKE THE SOUND
Jeff
titanium
Re: reality
Titanium is like any other tool: ya gotta use it right.
I suspect what you're hearing is an undamped resonance at the very top of the tweeter's range. I'm betting you're a young guy, right, maybe with ears good for close to 20 kHz?
If you've got some trick test gear, you can try to find the resonance with a swept-sine and a test mike (although inexpensive mikes are themselves not the smoothest up high), or you might even try looking for a wrinkle in the impedance curve. It won't be much - maybe a 5 or 10 % variation over a sixth of an octave or so - but if you find something like that above 10 or 12 kHz it's a pretty good indication of a tweeter resonance.
At that point you can try a notch filter tuned to that frequency and see if it helps any.
Good luck,
Francois.
tenderland said:Great just what i wanted to hear , What I knew deep down in my heart but did not want to except. Well I think I will configure the best i can untill I can replace them . The only thing is I have an old pair of B&W speakers and they have a metal dome tweeter and I LIKE THE SOUND
Jeff
titanium
Titanium is like any other tool: ya gotta use it right.
I suspect what you're hearing is an undamped resonance at the very top of the tweeter's range. I'm betting you're a young guy, right, maybe with ears good for close to 20 kHz?
If you've got some trick test gear, you can try to find the resonance with a swept-sine and a test mike (although inexpensive mikes are themselves not the smoothest up high), or you might even try looking for a wrinkle in the impedance curve. It won't be much - maybe a 5 or 10 % variation over a sixth of an octave or so - but if you find something like that above 10 or 12 kHz it's a pretty good indication of a tweeter resonance.
At that point you can try a notch filter tuned to that frequency and see if it helps any.
Good luck,
Francois.
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i'm actually using Titanium tweeters.
The only model that actually gives good results at my opinion: MBquart.
I knew they where good in car audio (i used MB quart in few installs) but never had the chance to try their home models.
frequency range between 400-37000hz, high detailled and very smooth for metal tweeter.
I have difficulties to find other MB quart home tweeters, but its definitively a good choice.
I did 2 ways DIY speakers using 10" woofer from Klipsch RF-7 and these tweeters.
I would recommend you to adjust your tweeter by using crossover on the frequency that you don't like
i'm actually using Titanium tweeters.
The only model that actually gives good results at my opinion: MBquart.
I knew they where good in car audio (i used MB quart in few installs) but never had the chance to try their home models.
frequency range between 400-37000hz, high detailled and very smooth for metal tweeter.
I have difficulties to find other MB quart home tweeters, but its definitively a good choice.
I did 2 ways DIY speakers using 10" woofer from Klipsch RF-7 and these tweeters.
I would recommend you to adjust your tweeter by using crossover on the frequency that you don't like
Re: reality
Well Jeff if you was me when I did have an interest in some sound in the car better than the stock radio I'd be tossing those B&W's onto the back seat!
tenderland said:The only thing is I have an old pair of B&W speakers and they have a metal dome tweeter and I LIKE THE SOUND
Jeff
titanium
Well Jeff if you was me when I did have an interest in some sound in the car better than the stock radio I'd be tossing those B&W's onto the back seat!
Have you ever been to Ontario?
Anyway, as with all other material choices, there are good and bad in the titanium realm. The question here is really whether this tweeter is fundamentally flawed and uncorrectable, fundamentally flawed and correctable (e.g., the aforementioned notch filter), or just fine but implemented badly. Can you give a manufacture/model or some sort of physical description? (even better, a photo)
SY said:
I have not been to Ontario, California but I have a few good flashlights that were made there. Ever been to Vancouver, Washington or British Columbia? How about London, England or Ontario? People like to re-use allready taken place names all the time for some reason. That is why we have flags to clarify the locations I guess.
If they are the bullet style tweeters with the small horn and bullet plug in the middle, all is not lost. Just take some small pieces of foam rubber about the size of a pencil eraser and stuff them down in the throat uniformly and tune to taste. I use 6 pieces which fills the horn throat about 50%. This dramatically reduces the harshness of these tweeters with losing too much sensitivity and really brings out the detail. This is easily the most effective tweak I've ever come up with or used and it's reversible and super easy to boot.
tweeters
The speakers I am using are MB quart Q SD216
the front stage uses 2 soundstream amps with a Arcaudio
mx1 xover. the tweets are driven with a soundstream Class A 3.0 amp and the tweets are in the lower front corners off the doors. this spot is optimal for imaging.
the OEM xover point on the passive xover is 2.4khz
I am finding as you move the point up from that you loose some presence and vocal quality. I have been trying to tune this sytem for 3 weeks. ( I like the B@W S in the car idea I now i will gut the speaker ,take the tweeter................
Thank you jeff
The speakers I am using are MB quart Q SD216
the front stage uses 2 soundstream amps with a Arcaudio
mx1 xover. the tweets are driven with a soundstream Class A 3.0 amp and the tweets are in the lower front corners off the doors. this spot is optimal for imaging.
the OEM xover point on the passive xover is 2.4khz
I am finding as you move the point up from that you loose some presence and vocal quality. I have been trying to tune this sytem for 3 weeks. ( I like the B@W S in the car idea I now i will gut the speaker ,take the tweeter................
Thank you jeff
try toiletpaper
Try to cover the tweeter with toiletpaper!
Try some different brands,some say that recycled have a sweeter sound in the upper regions,but my personal preference is cleenex (peach scented).Since this is for a car you might also consider hanging wonderbaums dangeling in front of the tweeter to randomly diffuse the harshness.
This migth not improve the actual sound but it will maybe smell better inside the car.
Good luck !
Try to cover the tweeter with toiletpaper!
Try some different brands,some say that recycled have a sweeter sound in the upper regions,but my personal preference is cleenex (peach scented).Since this is for a car you might also consider hanging wonderbaums dangeling in front of the tweeter to randomly diffuse the harshness.
This migth not improve the actual sound but it will maybe smell better inside the car.
Good luck !
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