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Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

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Old 17th May 2002, 10:20 PM   #1
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Talking i need some openions....please give me feed back...speaker design...

well as you guys probly know i build my first diy sub and now i am hard core into speaker building.....
i am going to be moving in a few years and i am going to have a studio grade room dedicated to home theater and music!

i am going to drive my speakers with 5 Crown Audio CE2000 power amps! these babies put out 400w RMS @ 8ohms X2!

i was selecting drivers for building my speakers and i was wondering if this setup would be ok for my main's?
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crossover: DAYTON 3-WAY PRO CROSSOVER 500/1,600 Hz
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tweeters: 2x 75w RMS - titanium mid/tweeter compression driver with what ever horn lense i want....
Frequency responce: 1,000hz-20,000hz
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mids: 2x 50w RMS - Pioneer FB12EU14-51F 5 1/4" poly cone midrange driver
Frequency responce: 500hz-6000hz
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woofers: 2x VIFA P17WJ-00 6 1/2" poly woofer....
Frequency responce: 37hz-5000hz
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all drivers are 8 ohm
will 400w rms be enought to power the speakers proporly?

please tell me what you think.....

thanks
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Old 17th May 2002, 10:41 PM   #2
JoeBob is offline JoeBob  Canada
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400w will be more then enough for any speaker system, don't worry about that. 500Hz seems like a pretty low crossover point for your mids. I'd go with a mid that can go lower, and then choose a bigger woofer that can go lower. Unless cost is the limiting factor, but you could probably get very good results in a 2-way configuration if you're going to crossover at 1600Hz.

But when I think of it 1600Hz seems pretty low to crossover your tweeter, a higher crossover frequency would be better.
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Old 17th May 2002, 11:36 PM   #3
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i dont know much about crossovers and i was wondering what you would sugest?

what should they crossover at?

where can i get pro sound crossovers for high power aplucations?

my main are going to be 3-way and thats that but i am open to crossover help as well as driver selection feed back.....

thanks
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Old 18th May 2002, 03:57 AM   #4
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PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP! PLEASE HELP!

I REALY NEED IT.......
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Old 18th May 2002, 04:05 AM   #5
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Crossovers are the critical part of a multi-way speaker. It's performance is dependant on the driver, the box you put them in and the room you put the box in. An off-the-shelf XO as you suggested has only a slightly greater then ZERO chance of working well. What you should be doing is out scoring the net for proven designs that you can clone or use as a starting point.

dave

And i won't go into what i think of Crown amps...
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Old 18th May 2002, 04:52 AM   #6
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Those horn tweeters you're talking about are low-fi and designed for extremely high spls. You would use tweeters like that in a nightclub, not in your studio room. Spend some money and get some good quality hifi tweeters. Efficiency is not an issue, you have 400 watts! If you want to be able to play them loud without risk of damage, cross them over at a higher frequency.
Now for your mids and lows. It seems silly to me to have a 5 inch and a 6 inch woofer in the same speaker system. Do a two-way with a 6.5" woofer and a 1" tweeter. You will have subs for 80 Hz and below, 6.5" (the vifa is a excellent choice) doing 80 to 2.5kHz, and a 1" tweeter doing 2.5kHz and above. A 6.5 inch with a -3 dB point of 80 Hz should satisfy your needs for high spl w/out distortion. A two-way crossover is much easier to design than a 3 way, which you will be doing with our help. Don't buy a ready made xover, it's so easy to make one. Think about which drivers you are going to choose, and we will go from there.
-andy
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Old 18th May 2002, 06:52 AM   #7
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well i would like to know where i can get some good pre-maid high power handling crossovers......

and what is wrong with CROWN?
they have good reviews a good warentee and are THX certified....
what else could i want?

and a question.... shouldn't the power-rating watts RMS match the speakers watts rms raighting? what does rms mean?
and will the speakers preform well with 400W even though their watts RMS rating is more?

please comment....
thanks,
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Old 18th May 2002, 07:11 AM   #8
CHRIS8 is offline CHRIS8  United States
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I too, can not recommend premade passive crossovers. They WILL NOT provide good slopes, as they are designed for ideal response only into a resistive, constant aplitude load in mind. This is not reall life, and the actual results wil be sub par. However, if you MUST get them, buy at www.partsexpress.com

Since you are so amp happy, you can get much much better results using a prebuilt active crossover. I won't even reference diy sites for them, as you seem to be set on purchiasing premade units. I would recommend something such as a behringer 3400, rane, ashly, etc as an affordable crossover with good quality. You should use drivers that have little to no resonance problems, and flat frequency response for at least one octave after fc(frequency cutoff), in order to get somewhat predictable results. Of course, even with this....ideally you should fine tune q, notch resonances, etc. in sensitive ranges(approx. 300 hz and up). So use drivers with smooth rolloff characteristics. The vifa you recommend is certainly qualified.

FYI, THX certification is merely window dressing. Has no real relevance, however it does mean you are paying extra for a useless badge.

You don't have to match the speaker's power rating, that is only in cases where you NEED to be able to extract the full SPL capablilities of a driver, and many times the rated power of a speaker is actually optimistic, as they will usually exceed excursion first.

-Chris
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Old 18th May 2002, 09:16 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally posted by slicemaster101
and what is wrong with CROWN?
Big amp built for pro use to produce large quantities of power as efficiently as possible with low measured distortion cheaply -- they have little care about how they actually sound.

Today at the regular HiFi circle coffee klatch we were just discussing how it seems that, in general, the quality of an amp is inversely proportional to how much power it outputs. There are some very nice big amps, i don't think the crown counts in this number.

You would be better to build a system that has synergy. I think of all the money spent on those amps & think much better could be had -- maybe not bigger, but better -- if you are looking for the magic you are on a path that will not lead you there.

dave
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Old 18th May 2002, 07:39 PM   #10
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well i have read the manual for the crown ce2000 and it have prity good specs.....
the amp features all the standard stuff.....
it is actualy better then the amps in the reciver i was thinking of getting......

thanks,

note:
i know nothing about crossovers and thats why i was going to go with a prebuild unit.....
when you guy talk crossover talk i know not what you are saying.... could you try to discribe it in lamemen terns....
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