High SPL compact monitor for home theater / party - diyAudio
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Old 4th May 2004, 12:07 AM   #1
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Default High SPL compact monitor for home theater / party

Looking for a compact 2-way that could be used for home theater by day and party by night. Six of them with 100W of power crossed over at 100Hz.

Would a HE8.1 work? HE10.1? Something better?

In party mode, two of them would be moved to the adjacent dining room while four would be positioned around the living room which is 15 x 25 with 9 foot ceilings.

Small size is appreciated from an aesthetic as well as practical point of view. Should be hi-fi at normal listening levels and robust and not too harsh at party levels.

Thanks.
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Old 4th May 2004, 09:21 AM   #2
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When working only down to 100 Hz, it is quite easy to get them to handle 100 watts. You may get 200 watts out of a midbass driver if the bass is filtered out depending on the slope of the filter. An 8" midbass driver can give you increased efficiency and power handling and thus more output. I have seen a review of the He10 that wasn't very favourable. If you could live with the size of it, I'd go with a 2 way with an 8" ... seas, peerless and vifa are a good place to start.

Here's an example with Vifa drivers:

Click the image to open in full size.

And here is the site it came from if interested

In your case I'd say you could make them smaller - say an aperiodic design or a sealed box. I'd say you could get away with half the volume in this case.

With the tweeter you may wish to padd it for your intended use. Speakers with a flat response can be fatigueing especially when played loud. If you padd the tweeter by 2 or 3 db to give a drooping response it will be more listenable at louder levels.
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Old 4th May 2004, 12:33 PM   #3
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hi

i think it would be best to go for 8.1 , best would suited be pro audio 8 inch transducers

when going in for your woofers - check for a large roll m surround or accordian surround woofers - rcf s (lab series) are very good and well suited for this - above 100 w atleast - for high spl

construct small compact ported cabinets with ply - power the drive units well - i think you shpuld be able to blast it well

also try and put in a tweeter like the jbl 2412 i 1/2 inch titaniums to match - high spl s without compression

best of luck - have fun as i know these will sound much better than mellow sounding hi fi weanies

suranjan

transducer design engineer
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Old 4th May 2004, 05:30 PM   #4
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Thank you both for some excellent food for thought.

We'd like to have these made by mid June so I don't have the time to research, procure, test, tweek, test, etc a new design so I was looking for an existing one.

I've heard glowing and not so glowing reviews of the HE10.1. PE article of Feb 2003 was not a useful review especially considering the background of authors.

The only reference to 2412 tweeter was as part of a built monitor. I couldn't find it as an individual part.

What factors indicate a woofer or tweeter will be good at high SPL? Look for high efficiency and power handling? I've generally ignored power handling.
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Old 4th May 2004, 05:53 PM   #5
sreten is offline sreten  United Kingdom
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Hmmm..... impedance requirements are not given, 4 ohm OK ?

Presumably with a AV receiver and using internal c/o functions.

Crossing over at 100Hz means compact sealed boxes are your
best bet, reflexing will not really help here and require much
bigger boxes.

TBH I think a 4 ohm MTM 2x6.5"/1" (dayton D3's or similar)
in 15 to 20 litre sealed boxes would be fine and would give
good sensitivity, over 90dB albiet being a 4 ohm speaker.

sreten.
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Old 4th May 2004, 07:32 PM   #6
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Default Compact 2-way

Conventional 2-way
Seas CB17RCY/P woofer with Morel MDT 33 tweeter (costly)
or Vifa XT tweeter

The Seas looks very good from the viewpoint of even response
and needs only about a 10" x 8" x 6" sealed box.
Two of these units(4 ohm) with the Morel might really sing.

The Morel is said to be very good sounding, though more efficient than the Seas. I have used Morel tweeters years ago, and they are bullet-proof with 200 watts power handling in the midband.
One could substitute a less costly Vifa XT 25 or 19 series with no loss in fidelty from what I've read.

Some distance needed from the TV screen - no shieding.

Non-Conventional

B&C Coaxial 8 CX T which handles power, 94 dB efficient, and is said to be very nice sounding. More expensive, but possibly worth it. Needs about 15 watts to run you out of the room.
Good to 75 Hz. Available at Zalytron. No shielding.

Tim
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Old 4th May 2004, 07:48 PM   #7
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Did you check out the monitor Adire had in their warehouse or would that be overkill?
http://www.adireaudio.com/pro_services/hurricane.htm

Yeah, that's probably too much.
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Old 4th May 2004, 08:45 PM   #8
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sreten, Currently we are using a low end receiver that I am loaning to him partly to see what it can do. It has the TI Equibit digital amplifier board with six 100W channels but only recommends 6ohm. He may could up with a receiver but if he needs to run 4ohm loads he will go separates. We are starting with speakers.

TimM, interested in anything that works. Not concerned with conventional v. unconventional. Proven design means I can just order parts and start building.

Timn8ter, I saw them but didn't get a chance to listen to them. But that gave me the idea to consider the HE10.1. The Hurricane's size is the problem.

I'm wondering how I can determine in general whether a speaker would be decent at high SPL and not melt. At this point, I'm not even sure what SPL we were running this weekend but my friend is convinced he needs 110dB. Personally, I won't be in the room if he runs it that loud. He can pack in excess of a 100 people in his house so I guess we wants to make sure all of them suffer some form of hearing loss.
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Old 4th May 2004, 10:19 PM   #9
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Default Output

Ultrachrome,
The B&C would probably work well.
If you want that kind of output, I'd stick with something that can handle some power, and the bass unit is 400 watt capable, and although you don't have that currently, tomorrow is another day.

Cost is $175 ea, plus crossovers (and box). You can build them from their schematics, or Zalytron can for $100 each.

You'll also need an enclosure, but plans should be part of the package.

www.zalytron.com/

Click on B&C, then the 8 CX T. Drop down tabs will give you all the pertinent info.

There are cheaper ways to go, probably something with smoother response, too, but right off, I can't think of a better sounding, more durable solution with serious output capabilities for the money. Pro sound origin, yet everyone that's had them liked them, so no discouraging words.

Tim
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Old 4th May 2004, 10:36 PM   #10
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I looked at them and was turned off by the $275 per speaker cost. I also was concerned by all the frequency response peaks and valleys. I don't know what that will sound like exactly but I'd prefer to hear them before dropping that much money.
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