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Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

High sensitivity 8 ohm drivers?
High sensitivity 8 ohm drivers?
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Old 16th July 2018, 01:41 PM   #1
Bill poster is offline Bill poster  Thailand
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Default High sensitivity 8 ohm drivers?

I bought a low powered valve amp, around 14 watts, so now thinking of a build to suit. The speakers cd be large or small, 2 or 3 way. But drivers no bigger than 8" and no less than 6ohm.
So far I see a few tangband FRs and faitals for mids. Peerless nomex 8" for bass unit perhaps.
Or 2 way, visaton b200, satori mw19p-4..
Any other suggestions?

Last edited by Bill poster; 16th July 2018 at 01:58 PM.
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Old 16th July 2018, 02:17 PM   #2
marco_gea is offline marco_gea  Italy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill poster View Post
I bought a low powered valve amp, around 14 watts, so now thinking of a build to suit.
Sorry to break it to you, but it appears to me you are approaching the problem from the wrong angle.

The speakers are responsible for 90+ % of the overall sound quality.

One should always choose the speakers first, and then look for the most suitable amp(s) to drive them, not vice versa.

IMO, with your 14Wpc valve amp, you'd really want at least 96dB/W(m) speakers to avoid major clipping on musical transients (> compression and DISTORTION).
AND, you must also ensure a pretty flat speaker impedance across the board, to avoid frequency response deviations induced by the amp's own output impedance.

Alas, there are NO real world 8" woofers that can get you there and still produce real bass (any commercial manufacturer claiming differently is just lying).

The only half-viable option would be an 8" wide-range driver in a back-loaded horn.
If that's not what you want or are willing to put up with, then you're out of luck, I'm afraid.

Last edited by marco_gea; 16th July 2018 at 02:20 PM.
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Old 16th July 2018, 03:27 PM   #3
hottattoo is offline hottattoo  United States
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I totally agree with marco. You are deliberately limiting your speaker choices but it can be done---almost !! You can get a nice 2" compression driver and horn along with something like a Fostex tweeter using a simple crossover. For the woofer section I would biamp with a plate amplifier ( cheap and lots of choices ) or a better amplifier if your budget permits. Lots of factors come into play like room size, loudness level expected, lowest frequencies desired, overall sonic expectations. Good luck.
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Old 16th July 2018, 03:48 PM   #4
system7 is offline system7  United Kingdom
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I can't see a problem at all, TBH.

My good friend marco_gea has built some splendid high efficiency speakers:

Click the image to open in full size.

Classic monitor designs?

That is a 92dB Mivoc 8". You can get a similar Eminence closed box driver at Parts Express at the moment.

I usually get loud enough with a 20wpc solid state. And the splendid old Radford STA25 valve amplifiers were not much more.

I think this sort of Visaton W200S-8 plus TW70 thing (my current toy... LOL) ought to work:

Click the image to open in full size.

Probably lose the reflex port, because valves can't control reflex, flatten the impedance and cross at 3.5kHz. Maybe make the box big too, which is good for efficiency. The SEAS U22 woofer and DXT tweeter gets to much the same place too. Joachim Gerhard said they were easy to filter.
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Old 16th July 2018, 04:48 PM   #5
nigelwright7557 is offline nigelwright7557  United Kingdom
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I would go for a high efficiency 12 inch full ranger to keep it simple.
Something like a Fane 12-250TC which goes up to 17KHz.
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Old 16th July 2018, 05:45 PM   #6
Galu is offline Galu  Scotland
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14W is an uncertain quantity. The actual rms power could be much smaller, or the 14W may only be achievable at a high level of distortion.

A high sensitivity loudspeaker system is therefore advisable.

Steve mentioned Eminence - what about this combination?

Alpha - 8A (8"; 8 ohm; 94dB/W woofer)

APT:80 (102dB horn loaded supertweeter)

PXB2:3K5 (assembled crossover which matches the above drivers)
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Old 16th July 2018, 10:55 PM   #7
sony6060 is online now sony6060  United States
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If you decide not to build, Omega makes sensitive speakers in the 95dB and higher range. I was looking at the Omega, but bought Revel M22s as a person compared them and stated the Revel were better sounding. Boy was he right, unbelievable sounding speakers. I would have to likely jump up to $4000+ for better sounding. The Revel M22 are 86.5dB sensitive.


I have a 12 watt per channel tube amp. Did not know if the amp could drive the speakers. The power seems fine for the speakers at listening volumes I use. But, I just bought a 35 watt per channel tube amp and will upgrade it for best sound. I shall find out if higher power is better.


I bought speakers as first priority and then find a suitable amp to drive the speakers. 35 watts with more reserve power may be better. Speakers first, amp next in line. Not the other way around.

Last edited by sony6060; 16th July 2018 at 10:58 PM.
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Old 16th July 2018, 11:21 PM   #8
phivates is offline phivates  United States
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It IS the other way around, because the OP says so. Respect the thread for what it is people, and contribute. Now then...96 db/watt systems are not as simple a challenge as they should be, since LF driver specs often quote the peak output in the mid band, not overall. The big Fane full rangers are definitely in the conversation. Something big most likely...
OOPS I should pay more attention to post #1

Last edited by phivates; 16th July 2018 at 11:34 PM. Reason: attention deficit
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Old 17th July 2018, 12:01 AM   #9
Bill poster is offline Bill poster  Thailand
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Double post

Last edited by Bill poster; 17th July 2018 at 12:10 AM.
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Old 17th July 2018, 12:02 AM   #10
Bill poster is offline Bill poster  Thailand
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I'll be straight up, the amp was bought to support a friend who has a small business making valve amps in Thailand. This system is in a small condo where I can't crank it up. I feel it's equivalent to 20-25 watt SS amp, it's around half volume for normal listening with the fairly inefficient speakers I'm using now.

Thanks for your suggestions, maybe an old school wide baffle 2 way? Something based on an existing diy design is fine

Last edited by Bill poster; 17th July 2018 at 12:09 AM.
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