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Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

8 in woofer -  SB Acoustics SB23NRXS45-8 or  Seas CA22RNY 8
8 in woofer -  SB Acoustics SB23NRXS45-8 or  Seas CA22RNY 8
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Old 13th September 2017, 09:36 PM   #1
andy2 is offline andy2  United States
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Default 8 in woofer - SB Acoustics SB23NRXS45-8 or Seas CA22RNY 8

Which one would be "better" overall? I know it's hard to tell but what would be your preference?
The SB seems to have better low end extension but the SEAS has better high frequency roll off. The SEAS has better QTS which may or may not be an advantage and it depends on the box size. The SB has the reed paper coating which probably has slightly better detail, but as the results probably is a little ragged on the high frequency response. I plan to either use one of these in a three way speakers. I'll be using 1st order xover so the high freq. of the SEAS may be good but the SB is not that bad either.
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File Type: png sb_8.png (223.1 KB, 259 views)
File Type: png seas.png (251.7 KB, 253 views)
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Old 14th September 2017, 12:03 AM   #2
PeteMcK is offline PeteMcK
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The SB needs 2nd order to deal with those peaks..... an excellent woofer;
However, if there was a local supplier, I'd go for the SEAS - more efficient, slightly smaller box, & a bit better behaved in the breakup region
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Old 14th September 2017, 01:07 AM   #3
Andersonix is offline Andersonix  Sweden
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8 in woofer -  SB Acoustics SB23NRXS45-8 or  Seas CA22RNY 8
I would want a metal cone. Also would settle for a woven cone. But paper? Doesn't it sound different on a rainy day, or after 10^10 cycles?
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Old 14th September 2017, 04:35 AM   #4
system7 is offline system7  United Kingdom
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You simply wouldn't use a first order filter with a well-behaved bass in a 3 way.
SEAS-3-Way-Classic

I don't suppose the CA22RNX and CA22RNY would be much different in practise. And the SB would be fine on a second order crossed around 500Hz too.

In a two way, you could use a simple coil with the SEAS units for a natural 3kHz rolloff. But in practise, I'd always add a bit of impedance correction (say, 8.2R and 4.7uF) to the shunt. Sounds better IMO. As does a third order tweeter.

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Old 14th September 2017, 05:12 AM   #5
fatmarley is offline fatmarley  England
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I only have experience of the smaller 5" SB15NRX and the Seas CA15RLY. The SB had much better bass IMO.
I'd choose the SB but with a steeper slope.
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Old 14th September 2017, 04:21 PM   #6
system7 is offline system7  United Kingdom
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I think Troels used the CA22RNY in his second version of the 3-way classic. More of a low Qts bassy, big magnet reflex driver than the CA22RNX, and better behaved at the 3kHz breakup point. Which is the nasty bit you have to deal with for a clean sound.

There is a school of thought that high Qms (low mechanical loss) is a good thing with drivers. The 8'' SB23NRXS45-8 :: SB Acoustics does much better on that.

Back in the day, simple bass filters were common. But we now have a theory of integrating a three way that works like a charm thanks to Steen Duelund. Phase just works. It's mathematical.

Bit of a master class from Troels here in updating an old SEAS 503 design for lower distortion. SEAS Kit 503. See the original simple bass filter let too much breakup through.

IMO, his 3 way classic design is extremely adaptable to almost any drivers. Perhaps the weak link is the 4" mid when you go loud. Wharfedale doubled them in the E70, wired in series to improve the dynamics. Genius IMO.
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File Type: jpg Aequal4_Steen_Duelund_filter.JPG (36.1 KB, 161 views)
File Type: png SEAS Classic Kit 503 Troels Gravesen.PNG (13.8 KB, 42 views)
File Type: png 3 way classic by Troels Gravesen.PNG (20.6 KB, 40 views)
File Type: jpg Wharrfedale E70.JPG (47.3 KB, 116 views)
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Old 15th September 2017, 04:00 PM   #7
gornir is offline gornir  Sweden
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8 in woofer -  SB Acoustics SB23NRXS45-8 or  Seas CA22RNY 8
Hi,

The SB23NRXS45-8 is a really nice woofer and could actually potentially work as a large 2-way speaker.

A LR4 topology (acoustical) with a x-over frequency of 2kHz only needs a coil and a cap. See attached picture!

Rgds

/G
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File Type: jpg SB23NRXS45-8 -- 2kHz LR4.jpg (209.8 KB, 63 views)
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Old 15th September 2017, 05:15 PM   #8
andy2 is offline andy2  United States
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It seems like the SB has the better low end performance while the SEAS has a better high frequency roll off. I will use 1st order xover so the SEAS probably is a better candidate. I already have the SEAS 8in RNX at home, but it could use a little bit more low end extension. That is why I plan to purchase the RNY which not only has as good or better hf roll off but better low end extension and more efficient too.
Maybe the SB can be use with low order xover with a notch filter to tame the break up.
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Old 15th September 2017, 11:46 PM   #9
mordikai is offline mordikai  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by andy2 View Post
I already have the SEAS 8in RNX at home, but it could use a little bit more low end extension. That is why I plan to purchase the RNY which not only has as good or better hf roll off but better low end extension and more efficient too.
I don't think this is correct. While the RNY is smoother and more efficient I don't think it offers more extension than the RNX.
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