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Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

12" woofer for SEOS12 build, 12PLB100?
12" woofer for SEOS12 build, 12PLB100?
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Old 16th August 2017, 09:48 PM   #21
EarlK is offline EarlK  Canada
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan_E10 View Post
Thanks Earl. What are L1 and C1 in your diagram? That response looks very good.
Dan
L1 & C1 currently have no fixed value for the purposes of this HF compensation exercise ( they are simply place holders ).

- For the purposes of this XSim prediction, C1 is shorted and L1 is open .

ie; They'll eventually get assigned values and form the HP circuit ( once you choose a driver ) and you fire up your copy of Sound-Easy.

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Old 7th September 2017, 08:08 PM   #22
EarlK is offline EarlK  Canada
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How goes your project Dan?

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Old 10th September 2017, 05:17 PM   #23
Dan_E10 is offline Dan_E10  United States
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Hi Earl,
Thanks for the interest. I was just about to post some more questions when I saw your post.

I just received a pair of 2512 Deltalites along with the components to put together the filter you posted. Hopefully some more measurements will be done soon.

One thing I noticed from the cobbled up testing I did so far was that the acoustic center of the CD on the SEOS was more than a couple inches behind the 8" drivers I had been pairing it to. I suspect the 12" deltalite will have an acoustic center a bit further back than an 8". Any suggestions on what woofer mounting would best match the SEOS12? I was originally planning to flush mount the seos and the deltalites but I noticed the deltalites have front as well as rear mounting gaskets. Using the front gasket and putting a radius on the cutout for the deltalites seems like it could have the possibility to better align the drivers as well as reduce some the the diffraction on the front baffle. But it will really depends on where the 2512s acoustic center ends up.
Dan
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Old 10th September 2017, 10:33 PM   #24
EarlK is offline EarlK  Canada
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Hi Dan,

Bill Waslo ( for his network design ) has good info HERE! ( regarding the mounting plane for the woofer &/or horn ).




BTW, have you choosen an HF driver model yet ?
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Old 11th September 2017, 01:09 AM   #25
Dan_E10 is offline Dan_E10  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EarlK View Post
Hi Dan,

Bill Waslo ( for his network design ) has good info HERE! ( regarding the mounting plane for the woofer &/or horn ).




BTW, have you choosen an HF driver model yet ?
Thanks for the link Earl. Unfortunately it looks like the pictures have broken links. He mentions the 2512 and the seos12 being in the same mounting plane, but it's not clear to me if they are both flush mounted. I'm inclined to go that route for lower diffraction.

I haven't chosen the compression driver yet. I'm going to do some more measuring and listening with the de500s when I cobble up your circuit. I'm also interested to try the dna-360.
Dan
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Old 19th September 2017, 01:21 PM   #26
Dan_E10 is offline Dan_E10  United States
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Default Some new plots

Here are some measurements I took when comparing the DE250 and the DE500:

The first plot shows the DE500 unequalized, then with Earl's HF compensation circuit, and finally with a little extra EQ supplied by the Frequency Allocator DSP for crossing over to the Silverflute in the test setup. You can see pretty good agreement to Earl's sim run on my previous FR data using Autotech's impedance data.
Dan
Attached Images
File Type: jpg DE500_circuits.JPG (149.8 KB, 51 views)

Last edited by Dan_E10; 19th September 2017 at 01:24 PM.
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Old 19th September 2017, 01:28 PM   #27
Dan_E10 is offline Dan_E10  United States
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And here is a comparison between the DE500 and the DE250. The relative levels of the DE250 and DE500 aren't accurate as I had reduced gain on my amp when I started taking the unequalized data.

Out of curiosity, I tried Earl's HF compensation circuit out on the DE250 but you can see it isn't quite as good a match as it was for the DE500.
Dan
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File Type: jpg DE500_DE250_comp.JPG (143.6 KB, 51 views)
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Old 19th September 2017, 03:06 PM   #28
Dan_E10 is offline Dan_E10  United States
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In the end I chose the DE250's over the DE500's. I was able to EQ the DE500 to a very similar response as the DE250 (the EQ'd DE500 response shown above is for a simpler filter that would on the level of complexity I'd be willing to implement in a passive circuit). However, even with the response EQ'd flatter than shown above, the sound was not as subjectively pleasing as from the DE250. I would have liked more time with the DE500's to see if I could get them to give the same subjective performance as the DE250's but unfortunately I ran out of time before they had to go back to Parts Express.

For those interested in sighted subjective impressions:
Perhaps unsurprisingly, there wasn't any noticeable difference in imaging between the two. I would expect the SEOS12 to dominate this aspect rather than the driver. The DE250's had a more relaxed and natural sound to me, especially on strings. Consequently I could listen at louder levels more comfortably. With the DE500's, I felt aware of a slight metallic texture to the sound. It wasn't obnoxious or too objectionable, this coloration just seemed absent on the DE250's. I tried more aggressive EQ on the DE500's which did help somewhat, but the DE250's just sounded right with less effort. The subjective difference to me seemed fairly comparable to a silk vs aluminum dome tweeters I have heard.
Dan

Last edited by Dan_E10; 19th September 2017 at 03:10 PM.
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Old 19th September 2017, 05:45 PM   #29
EarlK is offline EarlK  Canada
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Thanks for the update Dan!

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