You have a 1300 cubic ft. room.
Usually, even if it's only a guideline, i like to know the ratio Room's volume V.S. subwoofer's total air displacement.
By exemple, in my case i have a 2300 cu.ft. room with 4x 10W7 for a total of 3.55 liters of potential AD (xmax * Sd, or Vd).
With enough amp power, EQing, etc.. I find it most satisfying from as low as 15-20hz. Perfect for music but also for action movies when good pressurisation is needed. Can't remember how loud i can reach but maybe in the 110-115db at listening spot, starting from about 25hz. Enough to seriously upset the cat.
So, i guess most people would be happy with, say, 1 liter of total air displacement in your room size, but if you want something impressive i'd say around 2 liters. Which is about a pair of Faital Pro 18FH500 or a pair of JL audio 12w6v3...
Hi Charles,
That's quite a high level, and industry would limit exposure to this level for about 7 minutes per day before hearing protection would be required. Please bear this in mind for your ears' wellbeing and continued listening pleasure...
As you are only going down to 40Hz, why not go for sealed boxes to limit the group delay which you wish to keep low? I know they're not as sexy-looking as a big ported box, but they work! I use two 50 litre sealed B&C 18" bass cabs for my PA system for smaller venues. I get some quite disparaging looks when bringing them in which turn to smiles of disbelief when it's cranked up!
Cheers, Carl.
Hi Carl
The speakers are currently run for about 6 hours per week, driven by a 2x700 W amp for the woofer sections just below clipping. But I am not in the room at the same time. They are being driven that way just for running them in before I continue with crossover comparison and fine-tuning. I do that while doing work outside and they reach a comfortable level for background listening with closed windows and doors. I only spend a few minutes per week in that room at these levels. As you might know there are recordings that go insanely loud with little power ( I almost parted my hair with a CD by "Living Color") while others are very-bass heavy ("Yello") and do not hurt your ears that much but sound quite frightening at those levles while there are CDs that are quite dynamic and eat your headroom for breakfast and do not sound unpleasing or loud at all just before clipping.
But the main target was to have a two-way system whose woofers don't visibly move at elevated home-listenig levles. And I can tell you that they do indeed sound very relaxed and pleasant at such listening levels.
I didn't mean that they should only reach 40 Hz (that was just the range for mayx SPL), my target is more in the 30 Hz area. But I haven't EQed the lower end yet. But I can assure you that the bass transient response isn't that bad at all. Here you can listen to a short excerpt. Keep in mind that my mobile phone causes quite some dynamic compression and the room is actually my workshop without any acoustical treatment.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ls-ri-8ZveY
The green LED on the woofer amp lights up when power is over 1 Watt/4Ohm/Channel. The SPL for this video was what I would normally listen at i.e. peaks a little over 100dB with dynamic music. I would not listen at that level for hours and I don't listen with my mobile phone/earbuds all day like many others do.
Regards
Charles
The speakers are currently run for about 6 hours per week, driven by a 2x700 W amp for the woofer sections just below clipping. But I am not in the room at the same time. They are being driven that way just for running them in before I continue with crossover comparison and fine-tuning. I do that while doing work outside and they reach a comfortable level for background listening with closed windows and doors. I only spend a few minutes per week in that room at these levels. As you might know there are recordings that go insanely loud with little power ( I almost parted my hair with a CD by "Living Color") while others are very-bass heavy ("Yello") and do not hurt your ears that much but sound quite frightening at those levles while there are CDs that are quite dynamic and eat your headroom for breakfast and do not sound unpleasing or loud at all just before clipping.
But the main target was to have a two-way system whose woofers don't visibly move at elevated home-listenig levles. And I can tell you that they do indeed sound very relaxed and pleasant at such listening levels.
I didn't mean that they should only reach 40 Hz (that was just the range for mayx SPL), my target is more in the 30 Hz area. But I haven't EQed the lower end yet. But I can assure you that the bass transient response isn't that bad at all. Here you can listen to a short excerpt. Keep in mind that my mobile phone causes quite some dynamic compression and the room is actually my workshop without any acoustical treatment.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ls-ri-8ZveY
The green LED on the woofer amp lights up when power is over 1 Watt/4Ohm/Channel. The SPL for this video was what I would normally listen at i.e. peaks a little over 100dB with dynamic music. I would not listen at that level for hours and I don't listen with my mobile phone/earbuds all day like many others do.
Regards
Charles
These guys will be up against the wall. Is EBS tuning to the fs of the driver? The 12s330 simmed quite well from what I can remember?
Anyways. I'm pretty set on 1x 15 per side and to add another pair when funds allow. They're not too big in twin setups like an 18 and are affordable too. This way I can try ppsl, push push dual opposed, wmtw etc etc!
Faital pro 15fh510 looks nice http://www.faitalpro.com/en/products/LF_Loudspeakers/product_details/datasheet.php?id=151060125
What do you think?
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Thanks Dave,
Checked out the graph.
So what happens when we
make the volume much smaller.
The speakers in question of Frustum type.
That is a pyramid with the top cut off and
the top and bottom are parallel.
Two of the short sides are also parallel,
but this should make much volume difference.
I'll post a pic of the calculations, each speaker
came to 12.1278 liters. Perhaps I should just
start a new thread. "Artemis Revisited".
Checked out the graph.
So what happens when we
make the volume much smaller.
The speakers in question of Frustum type.
That is a pyramid with the top cut off and
the top and bottom are parallel.
Two of the short sides are also parallel,
but this should make much volume difference.
I'll post a pic of the calculations, each speaker
came to 12.1278 liters. Perhaps I should just
start a new thread. "Artemis Revisited".
Last edited:
With a quick ISDonline sim the 15FH510 gives a very useable EBS in about 120-160L tuned to 32-35Hz.
And yes the bass shelf estends to Fs.
With suitable drivers the FR drops 3-6dB below 100Hz and remains at that level down to Fs from where it drops as you would expect from a ported box.
Helps keeping low bass at a sane level when the speakers stand against a wall and most of the time no correction is needed.
And research has shown that the useful bass cut off point is around -10dB (F10) rather than the usually quoted -3dB (F3).
In conclusion and on paper (on electrons?) the 510 looks like a good candidate IMO.
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