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Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

Pushing the limits of small speakers - The Reference Mini build thread
Pushing the limits of small speakers - The Reference Mini build thread
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Old 15th March 2017, 03:46 PM   #21
bcodemz is offline bcodemz  Canada
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stocktrader200 View Post
why not use a really good 2 - 3" fullrange for 500 - 20000 Hz
90 db and point source
Because a full range driver is full of compromises (no pun intended) that makes it unsuitable in a reference system. The 10F is considered to be a great full range driver, but it simply can't touch the sound quality of a top tier tweeter.

Plus, this speaker is point source. It's the best of both worlds. Read my first post.

Last edited by bcodemz; 15th March 2017 at 03:57 PM.
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Old 15th March 2017, 03:49 PM   #22
bcodemz is offline bcodemz  Canada
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Originally Posted by Jonhny View Post
Two woofers in one 4L box?
Traditionally that looks like 100Hz extension in my Hornresponse simulation. The passive radiators gives you around 1dB extra output compared to a sealed enclosure in my simulation, so my guess is that they will barely be moving.

What is your plan there?
Am I misunderstanding something?
Lots of LT bass boost and amplifier power to get 35Hz extension and push the drivers to its limits. PR's used to reduce excursion on main woofers to reduce distortion and increase max power handling and bass output. Limiter used to protect the speaker from overloading and distortion and too much power.

Last edited by bcodemz; 15th March 2017 at 03:57 PM.
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Old 4th April 2017, 08:35 AM   #23
Zvu is offline Zvu  Serbia
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Is there any progress with this project.

I quite like this concept.
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Old 28th April 2017, 02:41 AM   #24
bcodemz is offline bcodemz  Canada
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Originally Posted by Zvu View Post
Is there any progress with this project.

I quite like this concept.
I haven't been updating because of the lack of interest, but since you asked, here's the progress.

The woofer has been upgraded to a custom spec'd Audio Technology woofer that greatly improved thermal handling for higher output and better sound quality over the Wavecor woofer.

The DSP has been switched over to a PC DSP system that allows for far more flexibility, power, and features over the miniDSP 2x4 HD that will enhance this speaker's sound quality quite a bit. It also cut down the wiring clutter dramatically compared to using 4 miniDSP's.

Experimentation on equal loudness curves, ambiance enhancers, and bass harmonic synthesis for <40Hz (below system tuning) and after excursion limit is reached, harmonics will fill in as the woofer output is clamped by the limiter.

This cabinet is a ton of work to make, and I'm still working on it. Additionally, the cabinet will have an automotive gloss finish that will look really nice.

Last edited by bcodemz; 28th April 2017 at 02:45 AM.
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Old 28th April 2017, 03:34 AM   #25
theaudiopath is offline theaudiopath  Australia
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Hi Bcodemz.
Wish you every success with your project. The Wavecor is available readily here in Aust. Thankfully you moved to Audio Technology which should yield lower Distortion in the 40 to 100 Hz Bass. Wavecor good Audio Technolgy better & better set up to custom optimize. Expensive but with an all out no (less) compromise effort like this worth it.
Have you purchased the ICE modules yet? If not may I suggest the Hypex. Reason is they come reccomended by a mastering studio in QLD that purchased my Tannoy studio Monitors. From what I can gather accordig to studio mastering engineer Paul's tech they are simpler in circuit design and less colored than the ICE in sound. His techs assessment not mine. They are using the UCD 180 modules with Hypex PSU. Also which PC based DSP are you running?
Cheers Mark
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Old 28th April 2017, 03:53 AM   #26
bcodemz is offline bcodemz  Canada
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Originally Posted by theaudiopath View Post
Hi Bcodemz.
Wish you every success with your project. The Wavecor is available readily here in Aust. Thankfully you moved to Audio Technology which should yield lower Distortion in the 40 to 100 Hz Bass. Wavecor good Audio Technolgy better & better set up to custom optimize. Expensive but with an all out no (less) compromise effort like this worth it.
Have you purchased the ICE modules yet? If not may I suggest the Hypex. Reason is they come reccomended by a mastering studio in QLD that purchased my Tannoy studio Monitors. From what I can gather accordig to studio mastering engineer Paul's tech they are simpler in circuit design and less colored than the ICE in sound. His techs assessment not mine. They are using the UCD 180 modules with Hypex PSU. Also which PC based DSP are you running?
Cheers Mark
Thank you! And yes I did get the ICEpower amps. I could not physically fit 4 NCores and a power supply in the speaker. Plus, I'm not picky about amps, certainly not picky enough to pay $3500 for 8 NCores and 2 PSU's. I also suspect a lot of the sound quality advantages over the ICEpower will disappear when powering drivers directly rather than powering passive speakers with many, many crossover components in between.

I am using JRiver as the PC DSP.

Last edited by bcodemz; 28th April 2017 at 03:58 AM.
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Old 28th April 2017, 04:00 AM   #27
theaudiopath is offline theaudiopath  Australia
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True enough but like I said this guy is using the UCD 180 modules not the N Cores that were less than $1000 + PSU including enclosures for a stereo amp imported to Aust. Mute point now I guess.
BTW as I asked before if you don't mind saying which PC based DSP are you running?

Last edited by theaudiopath; 28th April 2017 at 04:04 AM.
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Old 28th April 2017, 04:23 AM   #28
bcodemz is offline bcodemz  Canada
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Originally Posted by theaudiopath View Post
True enough but like I said this guy is using the UCD 180 modules not the N Cores that were less than $1000 + PSU including enclosures for a stereo amp imported to Aust. Mute point now I guess.
BTW as I asked before if you don't mind saying which PC based DSP are you running?
Well I still can't fit UCD's inside the speaker! This is a travel speaker. I don't want to deal with external amps. Amps are tough... I need full power on the woofers, but I don't need 100+ watts on a midrange and tweeter. I wish they would make really small high quality amps that did like 10-20W for midrange and tweeter use, but unfortunately amp companies aren't as obsessed about small size as I am

I answered in my previous post on the PC DSP. I'm using JRiver as the DSP platform. It is quite unknown that JRiver can not only act as a DSP, but a really powerful one, probably because it is an absolute pain to use with many stupid quirks, but these are things that can be overcome by finding various solutions and hacks.
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Old 28th April 2017, 04:51 AM   #29
theaudiopath is offline theaudiopath  Australia
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Cheers for that. Amps for active are an issue if you have to buy off the shelf. "Difficult it is" as Yoda would say. Sorry only skimmed through the post & missed the bit about the software. All I can say is I wish you all the best and hope the vision you have in your mind correlates to the reality you in the end create.
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Old 28th April 2017, 08:34 AM   #30
sebbyp is offline sebbyp  United Kingdom
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I would definitely look at Acourate for as your next evolution on the PC DSP side. Some benefits such as speaker linearisation etc that I have found to have a singificant impact on speakers I have built
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