"Using my old rule of 1:1:4 (which may not be best)"
We will see. I like my own rules... Probably crash and burn, but learn something along the way!, possibly ???
"I wrap thick cotton/nylon thread in blanket stitch to help hold the turns together."
Andrew, must sound good then.
thanks for sharing directions instructions for home brew, self wound. I was feeling alone! Build your own equipment folks and be prepared to learn from mistakes....... Fun.
We will see. I like my own rules... Probably crash and burn, but learn something along the way!, possibly ???
"I wrap thick cotton/nylon thread in blanket stitch to help hold the turns together."
Andrew, must sound good then.
thanks for sharing directions instructions for home brew, self wound. I was feeling alone! Build your own equipment folks and be prepared to learn from mistakes....... Fun.
I measured 2.48mH. I require 2.54mH, so not bad! I need to wind on some more windings.
I had a bad thought that paralleling two inductors in parallel would half the inductance. My theory was luckily incorrect!
Also, DCR is 2Ω per winding. Paralleled up equals 1Ω (measured). This is a tad high. But acceptable as 60L cabinets with 12" drivers is not so good living with neighbors close by... So Z = 8Ω + 1Ω DCR in series. I might have to attenuate mids and tweeter somewhat. As I run .FLACs from my PC, I can use digital eq.
Total weight is just under 300g.
With our 12dB / octave designs, I may have to use thicker wire. I will provide photo of my mates 6 foot high home-wound NZ hardwood speakers and also mine (old Philips ones) at later date.
Thanks.
I had a bad thought that paralleling two inductors in parallel would half the inductance. My theory was luckily incorrect!
Also, DCR is 2Ω per winding. Paralleled up equals 1Ω (measured). This is a tad high. But acceptable as 60L cabinets with 12" drivers is not so good living with neighbors close by... So Z = 8Ω + 1Ω DCR in series. I might have to attenuate mids and tweeter somewhat. As I run .FLACs from my PC, I can use digital eq.
Total weight is just under 300g.
With our 12dB / octave designs, I may have to use thicker wire. I will provide photo of my mates 6 foot high home-wound NZ hardwood speakers and also mine (old Philips ones) at later date.
Thanks.
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Congrats, they look good. Truly DIY.
Must be nice to know you can change them at will, without a 1 wk delay and shipping charges.
Hey DonVK! Thanks. Yes, shipping charges, GST (tax), not made in China (as opposed to NZ!), and My coils are spot on in inductance.
I may have to wind with thicker copper though.
Final dimensions are 27mm former, 35mm wide and 0.8mm copper windings (x 2 to make 1.6mm dia.) are about 14mm deep.
I might mount the board and inductor to a sheet of ply and screw it to inside of cabinet. Finally I am going to line all inside panels with stuffing from an old duvet and use some yellow glass fiber insulation that was installed previously. When I stick my head into the 60L cabinets and yell, there is a $hit load of echo. Hopefully they will sounds good!
I may have to wind with thicker copper though.
Final dimensions are 27mm former, 35mm wide and 0.8mm copper windings (x 2 to make 1.6mm dia.) are about 14mm deep.
I might mount the board and inductor to a sheet of ply and screw it to inside of cabinet. Finally I am going to line all inside panels with stuffing from an old duvet and use some yellow glass fiber insulation that was installed previously. When I stick my head into the 60L cabinets and yell, there is a $hit load of echo. Hopefully they will sounds good!
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I buy sheets of this stuff for proto PCB work. You can cut it to shape, solder to one side and drill it easily for mounted components. The only place I can find large sheets is HK.
This is one sheet cut in half http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/303941-omnidirectional-work-progress.html#post4992538
https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B00HR93IQK/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
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Thanks DonVK, yes Yuor prototype boards are looking good! Loop the legs of heavy components thru the board for extra support... I intend on getting my act together and make circuit boards. I have all them chemicals for photo etching. I just need to buy some lamps and mount inside an old flatbed scanner!
I like the sound of my 6dB board so far. I will build some 12dB ones for myself after completing my mates speakers...
Here is my setup being tested (sort of). Still some work to do. Boy it sounds much better! I want to crank it...
I like the sound of my 6dB board so far. I will build some 12dB ones for myself after completing my mates speakers...
Here is my setup being tested (sort of). Still some work to do. Boy it sounds much better! I want to crank it...
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"Looks like you have some vintage gear. Do you collect? or resourceful"
A bit of both really. I bought the Technics SU-X120 near new back in I think 1995 for $650. This included EQ, Tuner, Single CD player, double tape deck (anyone still use tapes?!). The bloke I bought it off of bought it from new. his misses told Him off for buying it and told Him to sell it! (I wonder who wears the trousers in that relationship?!)
The Technics amp is not standard. I upgraded the mains wiring and also wiring between reservoir caps and trannie (they used $hitty ribon cable!) and between caps and power amplifier IC. I also bypassed all the electros in the audio path and also bypassed all the power rails etc. These mods made a big difference! The amp no longer clips so my speakers are also MUCH happier! DC regulation is much better and more importantly, p/s is of much lower impedance.
The Leak Stereo 20 I got given (!!!) in non working state. i replaced all the caps with film types and upgraded all the resistors (carbon and gone high in R) to film types. I modified with a front end R attenuator to work at line level. Sounds bloody great! Uses all the original Mallard valves too!
Speakers I bought, probably in '94 or '95 for $100. I bought pair of 50W 12" speakers for it (another $120?) and they melted
(I think it was Smashing Pumpkins - Quiet). So I bought some 100W speakers. I upgraded the mids from old computer speakers (resourceful) and bought pair of Fostex FT15H tweeters 2nd hand for $10, I think. I stuck pair (x4) rubber feet beneath speakers.
Cable I bought.
Homemade line level cable using dual-screened Z=50Ω coax + gold RCA's.
Onboard Realtek sound. My Mate said that these chipsets produce spikes at 10KHz? I must use spectrum analyser to see if this is true! I think the older chipsets do. The onboard (software) CODEC sounds good actually! Onboard sound has come a long way.
I also have various Soundblaster Live! and Soundblaster Audigy cards. I prefer onboard codec vs the $400 card!
I use good old Winamp with .FLAC music, which I render from CD source via "fre:ac" software (now featuring FLAC 1.3.2.). My CD's are stored away safely (gathering dust!)
I used to use Mp3HD, but I converted my collection to FLAC (smaller file size and better support these days). 320kbps .mp3 just sounds bad! Mp3HD also uses a 320kbps stream so as to make them compatible with players that don't support Mp3HD. Well, my new $60 smartphone supports FLAC, so I am a happy chappy.
I do collect gear. I also service gear and obviously enjoy modifying gear!
A bit of both really. I bought the Technics SU-X120 near new back in I think 1995 for $650. This included EQ, Tuner, Single CD player, double tape deck (anyone still use tapes?!). The bloke I bought it off of bought it from new. his misses told Him off for buying it and told Him to sell it! (I wonder who wears the trousers in that relationship?!)
The Technics amp is not standard. I upgraded the mains wiring and also wiring between reservoir caps and trannie (they used $hitty ribon cable!) and between caps and power amplifier IC. I also bypassed all the electros in the audio path and also bypassed all the power rails etc. These mods made a big difference! The amp no longer clips so my speakers are also MUCH happier! DC regulation is much better and more importantly, p/s is of much lower impedance.
The Leak Stereo 20 I got given (!!!) in non working state. i replaced all the caps with film types and upgraded all the resistors (carbon and gone high in R) to film types. I modified with a front end R attenuator to work at line level. Sounds bloody great! Uses all the original Mallard valves too!
Speakers I bought, probably in '94 or '95 for $100. I bought pair of 50W 12" speakers for it (another $120?) and they melted
(I think it was Smashing Pumpkins - Quiet). So I bought some 100W speakers. I upgraded the mids from old computer speakers (resourceful) and bought pair of Fostex FT15H tweeters 2nd hand for $10, I think. I stuck pair (x4) rubber feet beneath speakers.Cable I bought.
Homemade line level cable using dual-screened Z=50Ω coax + gold RCA's.
Onboard Realtek sound. My Mate said that these chipsets produce spikes at 10KHz? I must use spectrum analyser to see if this is true! I think the older chipsets do. The onboard (software) CODEC sounds good actually! Onboard sound has come a long way.
I also have various Soundblaster Live! and Soundblaster Audigy cards. I prefer onboard codec vs the $400 card!
I use good old Winamp with .FLAC music, which I render from CD source via "fre:ac" software (now featuring FLAC 1.3.2.). My CD's are stored away safely (gathering dust!)
I used to use Mp3HD, but I converted my collection to FLAC (smaller file size and better support these days). 320kbps .mp3 just sounds bad! Mp3HD also uses a 320kbps stream so as to make them compatible with players that don't support Mp3HD. Well, my new $60 smartphone supports FLAC, so I am a happy chappy.
I do collect gear. I also service gear and obviously enjoy modifying gear!
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Also, My philosophy on sound reproduction is to keep things simple. Keep p/s low impedance. Don't use lots of electronics. Run a PC into an amp!
Music titivates alpha waves and is good to relax / meditate to (for lack of better word).
I don't run out and buy new gear, because I don't like the sound of all that processing!
One day I will modify the Technics and bypass the front PCB that processes bass / treb etc.
I can do processing at source with PC, if required.
Music titivates alpha waves and is good to relax / meditate to (for lack of better word).
I don't run out and buy new gear, because I don't like the sound of all that processing!
One day I will modify the Technics and bypass the front PCB that processes bass / treb etc.
I can do processing at source with PC, if required.
I still listen to an 80's Yamaha AX900 with Paradigm 11SE Mk1 speakers. I have lots of newer equipemnt but that older MOSFET amp is still my favorite. The lower complexity also lasts longer and is more reliable.
Your Yami looks yummy! Separate twin toroidal xformers! I will do some research on your amp.
"Paradigm 11SE Mk1 speakers"
Any chance of a quick photo of your setup DonVK for music (tape / record etc) ?
Yes, MOSFETs low o/p impedance and high i/p impdance is useful. All of my amps use BJTs. Apart from of course the Leak.
And what source do you use DonVK ? I also have a Pioneer PL-88FS that I'd like to "getaroundto" fixing!
My speakers have never sounded so good I realise they are nothing fancy either. Worth the hassle.
"Paradigm 11SE Mk1 speakers"
Any chance of a quick photo of your setup DonVK for music (tape / record etc) ?
Yes, MOSFETs low o/p impedance and high i/p impdance is useful. All of my amps use BJTs. Apart from of course the Leak.
And what source do you use DonVK ? I also have a Pioneer PL-88FS that I'd like to "getaroundto" fixing!
My speakers have never sounded so good
I realise they are nothing fancy either. Worth the hassle.
For my Omni project I use a Yamaha RXV659. I connect a PC to it, using COAX with SPI/DF, sending PCM to the AMP which has 24b DACs. I'll use >256MP3 or FLAC and 16bit @44Khz is sufficient for me. I can barely tell the difference on the higher bit rates or resolutions.
This is my 80's setup. I also have a 90's setup and early 2000's setup. They find there way into different rooms in different configurations as I see the need. I still occasionally use LP or Tape, but mostly it's digital as it's just too convenient now to load a playlist and enjoy. These Paradigms are old but probably my favourite, they are flat +/-1.5db even 30deg off axis. I don't believe you need to spend a lot to get good sound, it just needs to sound good to you. I've seen people spend way too much and it doesn't sound any better to my ear.
In the one picture (beside speaker) there is a grey floor lamp. The 1/2" steel tube from that lamp(s) are used as support posts in my Omni project. Pretty ECO green, eh?
This is my 80's setup. I also have a 90's setup and early 2000's setup. They find there way into different rooms in different configurations as I see the need. I still occasionally use LP or Tape, but mostly it's digital as it's just too convenient now to load a playlist and enjoy. These Paradigms are old but probably my favourite, they are flat +/-1.5db even 30deg off axis. I don't believe you need to spend a lot to get good sound, it just needs to sound good to you. I've seen people spend way too much and it doesn't sound any better to my ear.
In the one picture (beside speaker) there is a grey floor lamp. The 1/2" steel tube from that lamp(s) are used as support posts in my Omni project. Pretty ECO green, eh?
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"COAX with SPI/DF, sending PCM to the AMP which has 24b DACs."
Nice. Basically a 24 bit sound card with no proceeding cables (RCA's)! This was available back in the '80s ? I am not sure if going from 16bit ===> 24bit is worth it? I guess if the 24bit DAC has built in algorithm, this might sound right. Naturally running a 24 bit source of music would be best.
"I'll use >256MP3 or FLAC and 16bit @44Khz is sufficient for me. I can barely tell the difference on the higher bit rates or resolutions."
Yes, I agree. We (I) tried 128kbps back in the day. Encoding time took 20 mins for a 3 min song with my PC! We soon realised the quality was bad, after comparing to original CD recording. My mate used 256bit (to save encoding time and file size compared to 320kbps). I later used 320kbps VBR (Variable Bit Rate) to save time + HD space. Harddrives were expensive back then!
Then came LAME CODEC! I did everything 320kbps constant bit rate.
Then, then! I discovered Mp3HD. Sounded sooo nice. But files were large.
Eventually I settled on FLAC. the latest version (2017!) is very good. Supports 64 bit CPU and processor features (SSE etc). I can encode CD 'on the fly' in less than real time!
Below are links to VERY good software.
https://www.freac.org/
Mp3tag - the universal Tag Editor (ID3v2, MP4, OGG, FLAC, ...)
Winamp ? It really whips the llama's ***!
Did you know that .mp3 cuts off all treble above, I think 15KHz ??? Also, the bass doesn't sound right. Focus (if you will) on treb and bass 'tightness'.
But I digress! I hope that info will help someone...
"but mostly it's digital as it's just too convenient now to load a playlist and enjoy."
Yes I agree.
"These Paradigms are old but probably my favourite, they are flat +/-1.5db even 30deg off axis."
Wow. That sounds real nice. 1.5dB is really good! So, 30 degrees off axis is to do with how they sound when not looking directly at the front of the speakers, right? I am flanked by my speakers currently at my desk. When I sit on the couch, they do sound different.
"I don't believe you need to spend a lot to get good sound, it just needs to sound good to you. I've seen people spend way too much and it doesn't sound any better to my ear."
Yes. There are mods that can be carried out with cheaper amps and speakers that shouldn't cost the world. Spending 4x the money does not yield 4x the quality! More like 5%, maybe. Depending on ones current setup. But having dual toroidal xformers is a good start! Speakers I am still learning about...
"In the one picture (beside speaker) there is a grey floor lamp. The 1/2" steel tube from that lamp(s) are used as support posts in my Omni project. Pretty ECO green, eh?"
Yes! It is a sin to dump rubbish on this Earth. Look at Our waterways people! We drink and breath our own $hit.
Anyhow, in my town there are places where one's rubbish that has been dumped becomes recycled. It is sold back to the willing public and reused! There is also plenty of 2nd hand stores about.
I like to dismantle, scrap and recycle components and metals from electronic goods. Plenty of good parts and also less waste. I am at a loss as to what to do about plastic though. Send it back to oil producing countries, may be? Just my thoughts.
"support posts in my Omni project"
Tell me more! Thanks for providing photos of your '80's setup. I have not yet played about with coaxial (spdif) much personally yet. I understand the benefits!
Oh and just a though. I hear of people "running in" capacitors. How the heck does that work?! Running in one's own ears (brain) perhaps? Thanks.
Nice. Basically a 24 bit sound card with no proceeding cables (RCA's)! This was available back in the '80s ? I am not sure if going from 16bit ===> 24bit is worth it? I guess if the 24bit DAC has built in algorithm, this might sound right. Naturally running a 24 bit source of music would be best.
"I'll use >256MP3 or FLAC and 16bit @44Khz is sufficient for me. I can barely tell the difference on the higher bit rates or resolutions."
Yes, I agree. We (I) tried 128kbps back in the day. Encoding time took 20 mins for a 3 min song with my PC! We soon realised the quality was bad, after comparing to original CD recording. My mate used 256bit (to save encoding time and file size compared to 320kbps). I later used 320kbps VBR (Variable Bit Rate) to save time + HD space. Harddrives were expensive back then!
Then came LAME CODEC! I did everything 320kbps constant bit rate.
Then, then! I discovered Mp3HD. Sounded sooo nice. But files were large.
Eventually I settled on FLAC. the latest version (2017!) is very good. Supports 64 bit CPU and processor features (SSE etc). I can encode CD 'on the fly' in less than real time!
Below are links to VERY good software.
https://www.freac.org/
Mp3tag - the universal Tag Editor (ID3v2, MP4, OGG, FLAC, ...)
Winamp ? It really whips the llama's ***!
Did you know that .mp3 cuts off all treble above, I think 15KHz ??? Also, the bass doesn't sound right. Focus (if you will) on treb and bass 'tightness'.
But I digress! I hope that info will help someone...
"but mostly it's digital as it's just too convenient now to load a playlist and enjoy."
Yes I agree.
"These Paradigms are old but probably my favourite, they are flat +/-1.5db even 30deg off axis."
Wow. That sounds real nice. 1.5dB is really good! So, 30 degrees off axis is to do with how they sound when not looking directly at the front of the speakers, right? I am flanked by my speakers currently at my desk. When I sit on the couch, they do sound different.
"I don't believe you need to spend a lot to get good sound, it just needs to sound good to you. I've seen people spend way too much and it doesn't sound any better to my ear."
Yes. There are mods that can be carried out with cheaper amps and speakers that shouldn't cost the world. Spending 4x the money does not yield 4x the quality! More like 5%, maybe. Depending on ones current setup. But having dual toroidal xformers is a good start! Speakers I am still learning about...
"In the one picture (beside speaker) there is a grey floor lamp. The 1/2" steel tube from that lamp(s) are used as support posts in my Omni project. Pretty ECO green, eh?"
Yes! It is a sin to dump rubbish on this Earth. Look at Our waterways people! We drink and breath our own $hit.
Anyhow, in my town there are places where one's rubbish that has been dumped becomes recycled. It is sold back to the willing public and reused! There is also plenty of 2nd hand stores about.
I like to dismantle, scrap and recycle components and metals from electronic goods. Plenty of good parts and also less waste. I am at a loss as to what to do about plastic though. Send it back to oil producing countries, may be? Just my thoughts.
"support posts in my Omni project"
Tell me more! Thanks for providing photos of your '80's setup. I have not yet played about with coaxial (spdif) much personally yet. I understand the benefits!
Oh and just a though. I hear of people "running in" capacitors. How the heck does that work?! Running in one's own ears (brain) perhaps? Thanks.
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The Yamaha RXV659 is the system I use from the early 2000's. Its part of my 5.1 surround system. It's in the room with large dimensions that I use for my Omni tests. That's why I can connect it to a PC and it has built in DACs.
The 1980's system, pictures that I posted, is fully manual, no remote, no DACs, all RCA jacks and line voltage inputs.
The 1980's system, pictures that I posted, is fully manual, no remote, no DACs, all RCA jacks and line voltage inputs.
Progress. All I have to do is mount the mids in their cardboard pods into the mid holes. Bit tight so I will have to cut them out a bit, which is no problem. Just a bit of a PITA.
You will see my new inductors sitting on my speakers. I have made 1.8mH and 3.6mH ones for my bud's 12db / Octave speakers. Photos of them soon!
You will see my new inductors sitting on my speakers. I have made 1.8mH and 3.6mH ones for my bud's 12db / Octave speakers. Photos of them soon!
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And the rest... Part 2 of 2. Thanks... Just need some 6mm s/s bolts for the inductors. Iron is no good I wound 3 x turns of 0.8mm wire for the series 1.8mH. DC resistance was <1Ω. The shunted (parallel) 3.6mH was wound with 2 x turns of 0.8mm wire with DC resistance of about 1Ω2. Both coils are about the same physical size. Interesting, n squared! Works for me!
The cardboard spools is just 0.8mm wire stock...
I wound 3 x turns of 0.8mm wire for the series 1.8mH. DC resistance was <1Ω. The shunted (parallel) 3.6mH was wound with 2 x turns of 0.8mm wire with DC resistance of about 1Ω2. Both coils are about the same physical size. Interesting, n squared! Works for me!The cardboard spools is just 0.8mm wire stock...
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