need advice re mtm kits/plans

wharfrat · 16th March 2004, 04:20 PM

I've decided to try my hand at speaker building. Since I am an experienced craftsman but not knowledgable enough to design cabinets or crossovers, I am going to stick to an established design or kit for my first project. My plan is to choose from the variety of available mtm bookshelf projects. I have found that they vary greatly in price, usually based on the price of the drivers. For example, GR Research's AV2 and Wayne J's Dayton III can be built for about $150 each in parts (exclusive of the cabinets). The Seas Odin and Froy projects, using Seas excel drivers, are closer to $500 each in parts. Somewhere in the middle are Vifa's big A/V and Besl's series 2.4 (seas P17Rex and T-25).

My question is this: How much better are the projects with the pricey drivers? I know, you get what you pay for, but then again there is the issue of diminishing marginal returns, and some manufacturers manage to sell products with 97% of the performance of competing products for half the cost. I would appreciate input from anyone who is familiar with these (or similar) kits and who can tell me whether the differences are large or small. I know it is some what subjective, but give it a shot.

By the way, they will initially be powered by a Hafler 220 amp (110 watts/side) with a sub powered by a bridged Hafler 220, but my goal, if the sound good, is to expand them into a home theater system with a reasonaby high powered multichannel amp.

thanks. Larry M

sreten · 16th March 2004, 07:35 PM

You asked for an opinion so your going to get one

I don't like MTM's too much. Their main advantage is good
sensitivity but at the expensive of 4 ohm loading, good for
getting the most juice out of your standard AV receiver.

MTM's (or TMM'S) can be arranged for good bass instead
of good efficiency but with a subwoofer seems pointless.

IMO if you have plenty of power on tap the same money
on a good two way is always better, especially for the
music side of a HT/Music system.
(You can spend twice as much on the single bass/mid)

I can see the point of MTM's using small bass/mid drivers.

And IMO a stand mounting (on good stands) sealed
alignment is all that is needed for use with subwoofers.

But you'll need to be careful with the c/o arrangements of
the eventual HT receiver you use not to muck things up.

IMO you are correct the law of diminishing returns does
apply so I'd go for the mid-priced drivers personally.

IMO the excel drivers and similar belong in really serious
music systems and are not needed for HT as it stands.

sreten.

wharfrat · 17th March 2004, 04:10 AM

Well, maybe you have talked me into a tm configuration, and with the money saved on fewer drivers I can get higher quality drivers.

16th March 2004, 04:20 PM	#1
wharfrat diyAudio Member Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: colorado	need advice re mtm kits/plans I've decided to try my hand at speaker building. Since I am an experienced craftsman but not knowledgable enough to design cabinets or crossovers, I am going to stick to an established design or kit for my first project. My plan is to choose from the variety of available mtm bookshelf projects. I have found that they vary greatly in price, usually based on the price of the drivers. For example, GR Research's AV2 and Wayne J's Dayton III can be built for about $150 each in parts (exclusive of the cabinets). The Seas Odin and Froy projects, using Seas excel drivers, are closer to $500 each in parts. Somewhere in the middle are Vifa's big A/V and Besl's series 2.4 (seas P17Rex and T-25). My question is this: How much better are the projects with the pricey drivers? I know, you get what you pay for, but then again there is the issue of diminishing marginal returns, and some manufacturers manage to sell products with 97% of the performance of competing products for half the cost. I would appreciate input from anyone who is familiar with these (or similar) kits and who can tell me whether the differences are large or small. I know it is some what subjective, but give it a shot. By the way, they will initially be powered by a Hafler 220 amp (110 watts/side) with a sub powered by a bridged Hafler 220, but my goal, if the sound good, is to expand them into a home theater system with a reasonaby high powered multichannel amp. thanks. Larry M

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16th March 2004, 07:35 PM	#2
sreten diyAudio Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Brighton UK	You asked for an opinion so your going to get one I don't like MTM's too much. Their main advantage is good sensitivity but at the expensive of 4 ohm loading, good for getting the most juice out of your standard AV receiver. MTM's (or TMM'S) can be arranged for good bass instead of good efficiency but with a subwoofer seems pointless. IMO if you have plenty of power on tap the same money on a good two way is always better, especially for the music side of a HT/Music system. (You can spend twice as much on the single bass/mid) I can see the point of MTM's using small bass/mid drivers. And IMO a stand mounting (on good stands) sealed alignment is all that is needed for use with subwoofers. But you'll need to be careful with the c/o arrangements of the eventual HT receiver you use not to muck things up. IMO you are correct the law of diminishing returns does apply so I'd go for the mid-priced drivers personally. IMO the excel drivers and similar belong in really serious music systems and are not needed for HT as it stands. sreten.

17th March 2004, 04:10 AM	#3
wharfrat diyAudio Member Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: colorado	Well, maybe you have talked me into a tm configuration, and with the money saved on fewer drivers I can get higher quality drivers.