KLIPSCH RF-3 35 25 and ZEN's?

Status
This old topic is closed. If you want to reopen this topic, contact a moderator using the "Report Post" button.
Does anyone have opinions of these high efficiency speakers. They seem as if they might be good with ZEN amps.
The prices are low enough that they might be good tweaking fodder for upgraded crossovers, dampening, bracing, etc.
97-98 db eff. $600 - $750/pair.
 
Yep. USA. I have auditioned the RF-35's and for exactly 724 at ecoustics one can have 2 8" anodized aluminum drivers per box and a 6" square horn loaded tweeter in a reasonably attractive box with bi-wire capability, real bass at rock levels, clean dynamic mids, and recessed but clean higs. with some tweaks I think they could be 98 db efficient killers. I'm sure Klipsch had to cut corners in the crossover, bracing, dampening, and perhaps some other intentional (ahem) quality measures so not to detract from the higher priced speakers. Show me another high efficiency speaker - DIY or not with this sound. The RF-7's sounded very good at 800 bucks but with probably more care in the design and implementation of them, and had 102 db efficiency. 2A3's would drive them.
 
Dshortt9,

Sorry it took so long, i didnt see you your question at the bottom of my mail only a link to the general forum

I have extended the horns because i believe there is a mistake in the cross
over frequency at 1950 hz because the horn is a little too small . They have
moved this up to 2200 in the RF-3 II. I have not heard this one or the rf-35
Furthermore i have replaced the wiring and "matrass" foam on the inside and done bracing and some damping of the sides ans used deflex panels on the inside instead
This Smoothed out the sound quite a bit and you gain detail.

Regards,

Coolin
 
Sorry to dredge up such an old thread, but I just purchased a used pair of Klipsch RF-3 speakers and would like to try taming their 'edgy' sound. They seem to have a lot of potential...

Dshortt9,

I have extended the horns because i believe there is a mistake in the cross
over frequency at 1950 hz because the horn is a little too small . They have
moved this up to 2200 in the RF-3 II. I have not heard this one or the rf-35

Can you give me a little more detail on what you did with those speakers? Did you keep them, or are they long gone?

- How did you alter the crossover?
- You don't have the schematic, do you?

I was thinking of replacing any low quality capacitors with better ones (probably Axon polypro from Zalytron in NY).


Furthermore ...i have replaced the wiring and "matrass" foam on the inside and done bracing and some damping of the sides ans used deflex panels on the inside instead
This Smoothed out the sound quite a bit and you gain detail.

Regards,

Coolin


- How did you brace and damp the sides?
- Where did you put the deflex panels on the inside?



Thanks!
 
I got the schematic. For the record, here it is:
Klipsch RF-3 crossover schematic

I've got a pair of RF-3 (not II version, not RF-3.5), and found that they are extremely detailed, but a bit harsh in the upper mids. They're really exciting sounding, but get fatiguing after a while. It was a relief to go back to my much mellower sounding Tannoy T185's.

BUT... I think the Klipsch RF-3's sound like they have some potential. If I could just tame that harsh upper mid thing (or possibly find a frequency response spike that I think is up around 9kHz or so), they could be great high-efficiency speakers for not much money.

Does anyone know what quality of capacitors were used in Klipsch "Reference" series speakers back around the year 2000? I was thinking of replacing the 4.5uF and 12uF caps with film-in-oil or maybe even old paper-in-oil capacitors. Something "darker" sounding than the usual metallized mylar or polypropylene. Or can someone recommend a "dark" sounding capacitor that might tone these beasts down a little?

Has anybody played around with reducing the level of the horn tweeter? Perhaps raising the 2-ohm series resistor on the tweeter to 2.7 ohms?

I'm thinking of removing the crossover from the inside and putting it outside the cabinet so I can experiment on it easily. Problems with that?

I'm using a push-pull 2A3 amp to drive these. The amp doesn't sound particularly zingy, so I really don't think the problem is the amp. But I could be wrong. I have a Sansui AU-719 I can test the speakers with. Maybe I can do that this evening...

-=|=-
 
RF3 mods

Rongon,
I'd be really interested in whatever mods you do to the rf3's. I have a set of rf3 ii's. I really have enjoyed them for the past 10 years, but they are definitely on the sharp side for sure, and that fact has become more evident to me over the years.

Anyway, I've thought about doing some minor changes to a major overhaul, but lack the knowledge to pioneer the effort.

I'll play the observer for the moment.
 
Last edited:
you might want to slap some rope caulk on the walls of the horn and see what results you get. Might make a nice improvement. Best regards Moray James.

Any idea if "rope caulk" = Mortite? I've found that Mortite dries out after years, so I was thinking of using Duct Seal instead.

Anchan -- Interesting that you hear what I hear in the RF-3. There's lots of potential in that speaker, but there's something aggravating about the sound, sort of "metallic" in the highs. I love the low end, though, and I love the incredibly detailed soundstage. Just hate the excess "zing." Hopefully I can mellow it out a little, and it would be a really nice speaker then.

-=|=-
 
I tried to remove the tweeter from the RC-3 cab, but failed. Removed the wood screws, but the horn housing is flush-mounted with a sticky gasket of some kind. I couldn't get enough of a grip on the horn to pull it out of the cabinet. Will try again.

In the meantime, I also found a pair of older Klipsch KG4.5 2-way floorstanders. The drivers are a cinch to remove from these, so I removed the tweeter horn from one. Wow, what a surprise. The horn is made of really cheap-feeling black plastic. The driver doesn't look all that impressive either.

I applied a layer of Duct Seal to the back of one of the tweeter horns, and then listened in comparison to the untreated one. There is a definite tightening and smoothing of the upper mids gained from the Duct Seal dampening. Dampened the second tweeter horn, reinstalled and have been listening to the stereo pair for a few days. Clarity is most definitely improved, but the highest upper frequencies now sound more recessed, more typical of a horn loaded 2-way. In other words, no "air" to the sound. I think the Klipsch folks may have used the extra "zing" from the undamped horn to make bells and cymbals "sing."

My next step will be to remove the woofers and coat the stamped steel frames with a layer of Duct Seal, or maybe Mortite since it's easier to work with. I'm hoping that will clean up the mids around 500 Hz. I hopefully can do that tonight.

--
 
OK, I did it. In the KG4.5's, Duct Seal is now applied to both the back of the tweeter horn and the woofer's stamped steel basket.

Damping the woofer basket makes a huge difference. Mids around 500 Hz are much cleaner and less muddy. The biggest surprise was immediately apparent while listening to an announcer's voice on the radio (the first thing I played). The excessive sibilance on 's' and 't' sounds is just about gone. Jazz ride cymbal is no longer spitty. The speakers sound like they have a warmer tonal balance. It seems to me that these speakers really need their woofer baskets damped to sound acceptable. Why damping the woofer frames improves the sound of the tweeter is a mystery to me, but I'll take it!

Before Duct Seal, the tweeters had a nice way of making orchestral bells and upper notes on the piano "pop" out to the front of the mix. After Duct Seal, the tweeters sound more like other good cone 'n dome speakers I've heard, and the orchestral bells no longer have that "pop" to the sound. On the other hand, jazz ride cymbal sounds pretty good after Duct Seal, but was spitty and harsh before Duct Seal. My hunch is that the Duct Seal treatment has tamed a resonance that used to make the horn tweeter sound more exciting and "impressive," but caused fatigue after more extended listening.

So I suspect that most cheaper Klipsch speakers can be improved with Duct Seal. I'll get to the RF-3's asap. First thing I'll have to figure out is how to get the drivers out without damaging anything.


-=|=-


PS - The dynamics from these speakers are amazing. A drum solo becomes a real drama. Very exciting, sort of like in real life. High efficiency speakers sure are fun!
 
Last edited:
Thanks Moray. I checked around and can't find any KLF-20 for sale locally (I don't want to deal with shipping for something that large). 100dB sensitivity (probably "only" 96 or 97dB anechoic) and low-value inductors sounds like it would make an easy load for a weenie tube amp... and that's exactly what I'm looking for.

How different is KLF-20 from RF-3? A totally different sound?

--
 
Found a pair of KLF-20, gave a listen...

Just a follow-up on this thread. Moray James suggested I listen to a pair of Klipsch KLF-20. I found a pair for sale for reasonable money, and went to take a listen. I brought some favorite CD's that I'm familiar with. To tell you the truth, the KLF-20's sounded almost exactly like Heresy's but with more bass. I did not like them, and I did not buy them.

I sold the RF-3's to a friend. He uses them for home theater, and for that I think they are fantastic. I was never able to get the drivers out of the baffle because I didn't want to damage anything (that pair is very clean). Everything fits super-tight in those speakers.

I still have the KG4.5's, but I think they will become a sort of Econowave-like project (Eminence B102 woofers, Fastlane Circletrac horn, Selenium D220ti's to start). I got the KG4.5's to sound "musical," but they are definitely not "high resolution." A pair of Tannoy System 8 NFM easily beats them for revealing details in a recording, and the Tannoys are only a slight bit less efficient.

I found a pair of Snell Type C (old version) and they sound great with the PP 2A3 amp (and nasty with anything else I have). Fantastic speakers.

In the end, I think Klipsch 3-way's are really problematic. I've given up on them.

--
 
Status
This old topic is closed. If you want to reopen this topic, contact a moderator using the "Report Post" button.