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Heres my current project, its far from done, but thought I'd start sharing. I will continue to updatethis thread only, so that all information remain together.
The speakers will consist of two 3" w3-594s up top. They will not be in an array format, but rather I will cross them over at ~5K (thats my plan so far....simple 6db....). The reason for this is so that 90% of the frequencies being played here are fairly timbre matched. Since this is a beginner project I figured that would help. I know I could easily run one Full range, but taking the bass off of the high end sounds like a nice thing to do . I wanted the drivers to be the same, so I chose the 3" to embrace the high frequencies, rather than the 4" for the extra oomph.
The Dayton 12" will be a side firing driver crossed over at most likey 100Hz (12db). The TB will naturally start to fall off around there, so they should crossover ok even with no high pass on the midrange.
Anyways here are the plans and "modeled" frequency of the Dayton and the lower TB.
Heres my current project, its far from done, but thought I'd start sharing. I will continue to updatethis thread only, so that all information remain together.
The speakers will consist of two 3" w3-594s up top. They will not be in an array format, but rather I will cross them over at ~5K (thats my plan so far....simple 6db....). The reason for this is so that 90% of the frequencies being played here are fairly timbre matched. Since this is a beginner project I figured that would help. I know I could easily run one Full range, but taking the bass off of the high end sounds like a nice thing to do
. I wanted the drivers to be the same, so I chose the 3" to embrace the high frequencies, rather than the 4" for the extra oomph.The Dayton 12" will be a side firing driver crossed over at most likey 100Hz (12db). The TB will naturally start to fall off around there, so they should crossover ok even with no high pass on the midrange.
Anyways here are the plans and "modeled" frequency of the Dayton and the lower TB.
Attachments
Heres the "meat" so far.
BTW I hate how wood isn't actually cut to what the dimensions say they are....I guess they can round up the nearest inch.
Details
Front and back 0.5"x6"x48" Poplar
Side 0.75"x16"x48" Melamine Shelf Board
Tops and Braces 0.75"x6.0" White Pine
Square Braces 0.75"x0.75"x12"
Elmers wood glue, wood screws, and plenty of Liquid Nails
BTW I hate how wood isn't actually cut to what the dimensions say they are....I guess they can round up the nearest inch.
Details
Front and back 0.5"x6"x48" Poplar
Side 0.75"x16"x48" Melamine Shelf Board
Tops and Braces 0.75"x6.0" White Pine
Square Braces 0.75"x0.75"x12"
Elmers wood glue, wood screws, and plenty of Liquid Nails
Attachments
Another design not considering Baffle Step Compensation.
You will need to roll in one mid unit first order at a much lower
frequency, around 500Hz, search the web for further info.
The bass unit needs a 4 to 6dB higher voltage sensitivity than
a single mid/treble unit. Over the range the mid/treble units are
working in parallel voltage sensitivity will be +6dB.
If the bass unit is not the right sensitivity a sub amplifier is an option.
sreten.
You will need to roll in one mid unit first order at a much lower
frequency, around 500Hz, search the web for further info.
The bass unit needs a 4 to 6dB higher voltage sensitivity than
a single mid/treble unit. Over the range the mid/treble units are
working in parallel voltage sensitivity will be +6dB.
If the bass unit is not the right sensitivity a sub amplifier is an option.
sreten.
The reason I like 2.5 ways. What you are essentially doing is mating a 1.5 way system to a low freq driver.
u need a bass driver with most of these small 3-4" widerange drivers. this bass driver can be rolled of as high as 200Hz esp if you are looking at a topology that is similar to yours. if the bass driver is not as close to the fullranges as in a 2.1 system then a lower XO point (which would also mean that one wold have to consider going active in the bass or biamp) would be more desireable. 1 WAY
The one would have to roll off the second TB to avoid interferance/cancelation (above 3.5-4k in your case). that effectively means 1.5 way. Usually 1.5 way sysmtes
now the issue of sensitivity and impedance becomes critical. using this topology you will ineffect be having 3 drivers operating between 20 and 200Hz, 2 between 200 and 4k, and 1 above 4k. If you get any boundry reinforcement you might get too much bass in the sound. One way to reduce is this is to roll the TBs off at 200Hz (or whatever you propose your sub freq. to be). This will also make your amplifier happier.
now you can play with the second TB's roll off (the one that is rolled of at 'bout 4k) and adjust the sound balance to your preference.
BTW which hybrid...
i am still trying to decide how to capture the magic of tube-fullrange combos we heard in the 50s, 60s and early 70s.
there are 3 areas that can be changed..
1. the front end (DVD player, preamp etc...). One idea wouldbe to replace all the electronics with tubes. however since i want my system to double as a HT/AV system I think this would be very diffficult. If one was implmenting a stereo system without dolby decoding it would be a lot easier.
2. the amplification. 5 channels of tube amplification. Given that i live in India (hot and humid) and I want to keep the system discrete I would be limited to a class AB1 PP based EL84 or 6L6 or somethig like this. I am still evaluating the heating issues and other options including non tube ckts that can give the same sound.
3. the speakers. here i am furtner along in my analysis. After a lot of deliberation I am now considering a 2.5 way using 2 4" wide range (fostex, tangband, jordan from 100Hz to over 5000Hz) and a (undecided) tweeter. the bass would be provided by a discrete sub or 2 or 3.
u need a bass driver with most of these small 3-4" widerange drivers. this bass driver can be rolled of as high as 200Hz esp if you are looking at a topology that is similar to yours. if the bass driver is not as close to the fullranges as in a 2.1 system then a lower XO point (which would also mean that one wold have to consider going active in the bass or biamp) would be more desireable. 1 WAY
The one would have to roll off the second TB to avoid interferance/cancelation (above 3.5-4k in your case). that effectively means 1.5 way. Usually 1.5 way sysmtes
now the issue of sensitivity and impedance becomes critical. using this topology you will ineffect be having 3 drivers operating between 20 and 200Hz, 2 between 200 and 4k, and 1 above 4k. If you get any boundry reinforcement you might get too much bass in the sound. One way to reduce is this is to roll the TBs off at 200Hz (or whatever you propose your sub freq. to be). This will also make your amplifier happier.
now you can play with the second TB's roll off (the one that is rolled of at 'bout 4k) and adjust the sound balance to your preference.
BTW which hybrid...
i am still trying to decide how to capture the magic of tube-fullrange combos we heard in the 50s, 60s and early 70s.
there are 3 areas that can be changed..
1. the front end (DVD player, preamp etc...). One idea wouldbe to replace all the electronics with tubes. however since i want my system to double as a HT/AV system I think this would be very diffficult. If one was implmenting a stereo system without dolby decoding it would be a lot easier.
2. the amplification. 5 channels of tube amplification. Given that i live in India (hot and humid) and I want to keep the system discrete I would be limited to a class AB1 PP based EL84 or 6L6 or somethig like this. I am still evaluating the heating issues and other options including non tube ckts that can give the same sound.
3. the speakers. here i am furtner along in my analysis. After a lot of deliberation I am now considering a 2.5 way using 2 4" wide range (fostex, tangband, jordan from 100Hz to over 5000Hz) and a (undecided) tweeter. the bass would be provided by a discrete sub or 2 or 3.
BTW I forget to mention....
the reason i like 1.5 ways is
a. you compensate for baffle step
b. you remove the large inductor usually used for BSC - these large inductors i feel rob the music of dynamics
c. you retain the imaging and improve sensitivy (compared to a single driver) with minimal small XO components.
BTW have u considered push push...but then again you have that side firing woofer handling the bass.
the reason i like 1.5 ways is
a. you compensate for baffle step
b. you remove the large inductor usually used for BSC - these large inductors i feel rob the music of dynamics
c. you retain the imaging and improve sensitivy (compared to a single driver) with minimal small XO components.
BTW have u considered push push...but then again you have that side firing woofer handling the bass.
Well I just ordered all the inards on Saturday from PE. So hopefully in the next week or so I'll get some progress. I'm going to use the red maple vinyl laminate they sell. I'll probably spend a week alone trying to get the surfaces nice and smooth.
So far this is my most expnsive project...a little over $300 now. Those TB's are cheap, but even $30 woofers start to add up quick, and then all the associated stuff too!
This thing is not the most stable (standing up that is), I'd put my MMG's up against them in a stability test. So I'm gonna do that trick alot of poeple do with the horizontal rod ( ) up front for legs and regular feet outback. Hopefully Home Depot has some round 1" hollow aluminum stock. Maybe copper pipe would look better with the red, you can still buy copper piping in the plumbing section right?
Also if I got copper and I sanded it to have a nice brushed look, would I need to put a clear coat on it to protect it from rusting?
So far this is my most expnsive project...a little over $300 now. Those TB's are cheap, but even $30 woofers start to add up quick, and then all the associated stuff too!
This thing is not the most stable (standing up that is), I'd put my MMG's up against them in a stability test. So I'm gonna do that trick alot of poeple do with the horizontal rod (
) up front for legs and regular feet outback. Hopefully Home Depot has some round 1" hollow aluminum stock. Maybe copper pipe would look better with the red, you can still buy copper piping in the plumbing section right?Also if I got copper and I sanded it to have a nice brushed look, would I need to put a clear coat on it to protect it from rusting?
Thanks for all the info navin.
"3. the speakers. here i am furtner along in my analysis. After a lot of deliberation I am now considering a 2.5 way using 2 4" wide range (fostex, tangband, jordan from 100Hz to over 5000Hz) and a (undecided) tweeter. the bass would be provided by a discrete sub or 2 or 3."
Sounds good, do you think either of the TB tweeters would work in a design like yours? (here: http://www.nuera-acoustic.ca/products.html). It would be nice to get all the parts locally, and they are cheap.
btw when I said Hybrid, I meant Hybrid fourdoor
"3. the speakers. here i am furtner along in my analysis. After a lot of deliberation I am now considering a 2.5 way using 2 4" wide range (fostex, tangband, jordan from 100Hz to over 5000Hz) and a (undecided) tweeter. the bass would be provided by a discrete sub or 2 or 3."
Sounds good, do you think either of the TB tweeters would work in a design like yours? (here: http://www.nuera-acoustic.ca/products.html). It would be nice to get all the parts locally, and they are cheap.
btw when I said Hybrid, I meant Hybrid fourdoor
UPDATES!
Heres some updates on the project. Been taking my time here and there, but its coming along so far.
Top chamber is stuffed with fiber.
Middle chamber is stuffed with fiber. A silk screen seperates the middle and bottom chamber so that the fiber wont fall down and hit the driver. Bottom chamber has a 1/4" foam glued to side opposite driver (you can kinda see in picture).
CAT5E wire each for mid and tweet. Crossovers mounted in bottom of chamber for accessability sakes.
Probably gonna take me a while to prep these for finishing.
Heres some updates on the project. Been taking my time here and there, but its coming along so far.
Top chamber is stuffed with fiber.
Middle chamber is stuffed with fiber. A silk screen seperates the middle and bottom chamber so that the fiber wont fall down and hit the driver. Bottom chamber has a 1/4" foam glued to side opposite driver (you can kinda see in picture).
CAT5E wire each for mid and tweet. Crossovers mounted in bottom of chamber for accessability sakes.
Probably gonna take me a while to prep these for finishing.
Attachments
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