Hi everyone,
I would like to use a computer as a digital crossover and add EQ to my subwoofers that way too. I found very contradictive opinions whether it is possible and I have not seen it work.
Equipment used: 1 computer as media center, 1 player with digital volume control, 2 USB ports, 2 different DACs, 2 different amps, 2-way speakers in bi-amping configuration.
I'm not a pro when it comes to media centers but it seems JRiver is capable of applying low and high pass filters to separate channels and link the channels with multilple sound cards (USB DACs). I don't know if I need any plugin or not.
My concerns are about the use of 2 usb ports and different DACs.
Would I be able to apply EQ/DSP to subwoofer channels and make sure both USB ports send the signal at the same time?
Will I be able to apply delay/phase correction?
Will two different DACs have consistent buffer delay?
Free tool called rePhase seems to be able to help with phase correction but can it be used with 2 DACs?
Finally, can I measure the response of the system which includes the whole DSP process?
Thanks for help!
I would like to use a computer as a digital crossover and add EQ to my subwoofers that way too. I found very contradictive opinions whether it is possible and I have not seen it work.
Equipment used: 1 computer as media center, 1 player with digital volume control, 2 USB ports, 2 different DACs, 2 different amps, 2-way speakers in bi-amping configuration.
I'm not a pro when it comes to media centers but it seems JRiver is capable of applying low and high pass filters to separate channels and link the channels with multilple sound cards (USB DACs). I don't know if I need any plugin or not.
My concerns are about the use of 2 usb ports and different DACs.
Would I be able to apply EQ/DSP to subwoofer channels and make sure both USB ports send the signal at the same time?
Will I be able to apply delay/phase correction?
Will two different DACs have consistent buffer delay?
Free tool called rePhase seems to be able to help with phase correction but can it be used with 2 DACs?
Finally, can I measure the response of the system which includes the whole DSP process?
Thanks for help!
I've been using JRiver for a few years now for active xo. It will do everything you want......but I'm not sure if it will be able to be used with separate dac's and keep the timing correct. It would be kind of a goofy setup to have MC playing to two dac's as I'd think you'd need to have 2 zones linked (one for each dac). Even then Idk if that would work. It makes much more sense to me from a technical and ease of use standpoint to have a multi-channel dac.
Edited...
sorry, I noticed that you were talking about subs..
I think that the integration of a sub is always challenging. I would use a software like Audiolense, which will also allow to make room correction. This time domain correction is incredebly valuable for low frequency correction. Everything get fixed: frequency response, time alignment...
Anayway you need a multichannel dac. I think thta there is no way to successfully sync two (tipically consumer) usb dacs with no wordclock circuitry.
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Thanks guys. I'm still hoping there is some way to do it with 2 different DACs. I am currently using a modified DCX2496 as a DAC but it annoys me how quickly it goes into clipping. I have a very good DAC I would like to use for mains and have something cheaper for subs.
My main DAC can output to 2 stereo paths at the same time so in theory I could use something like miniDSP for subs and for mains and do the whole EQ in JRiver but will I get good enough quality from miniDSP to use it with electrostatic speakers? I very much doubt it.
Re Audiolense, as far as I understand it does similar things to rePhase but it has a big bill attached to it.
My main DAC can output to 2 stereo paths at the same time so in theory I could use something like miniDSP for subs and for mains and do the whole EQ in JRiver but will I get good enough quality from miniDSP to use it with electrostatic speakers? I very much doubt it.
Re Audiolense, as far as I understand it does similar things to rePhase but it has a big bill attached to it.
Huh? What are you doing with it? Using a lot of boost? You can use cuts instead, or change your gains to prevent clipping.
I agree...if you're clipping your DCX you're doing something wrong and changing the device won't fix it.
What's your DAC? Have you got the Quads ESL? Just to undesrand what sort (and level) of setup you have...
Anyaway Audiolense is much more than rePhase, but this is off topic...
ASIO4ALL could be the solution, provided that this driver is able to keep some sort of sync during playing.
I'm absolutely sure that ASIO4ALL is not adequate when making time domain measurements using different devices for input and output, but this is an application which require ultra-precise sync; maybe in normal listening it could be no issue at all. Anyway keep in mind that 2 different clocks will drift apart, so if ASIO4ALL doesn't take care of this problem, the drift will sum up and may even starts appearing as a delay after some time.
Look into the free DRC-FIR, not automated for multiple channels but with a bit of work it can be done.
Some assistance can be obtained here: http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full-range/275730-convolution-based-alternative-electrical-loudspeaker-correction-networks.html
I agree getting 2 separate DAC's to work with JRiver will be a challenge.
I am also interested on this topic.
Lets say we would like to DIY a pair of 3 way speakers with active crossovers:
My understanding is that most people use multichannel DACs, proaudio soundcards etc...
I want to have a much more simple system based on o 7.1 AV receiver.
And I want to keep the signal in the digital domain as long as possible; the AV receiver already have a DAC, why have the conversion earlier?
To be able to do what I want, the HDMI connection seems to be the best bet.
I recently purchased a nanoAVR from miniDSP.
nanoAVR allows mapping of channels; so instead of front and rear channels, you can program the HDMI channels to carry the signal to your tweeter, mid and woofer.
I am wondering whether same can be done on a computer: just an HDMI connection between your computer and AV receiver and your receiver powers your 3 way active stereo speakers???
Lets say we would like to DIY a pair of 3 way speakers with active crossovers:
My understanding is that most people use multichannel DACs, proaudio soundcards etc...
I want to have a much more simple system based on o 7.1 AV receiver.
And I want to keep the signal in the digital domain as long as possible; the AV receiver already have a DAC, why have the conversion earlier?
To be able to do what I want, the HDMI connection seems to be the best bet.
I recently purchased a nanoAVR from miniDSP.
nanoAVR allows mapping of channels; so instead of front and rear channels, you can program the HDMI channels to carry the signal to your tweeter, mid and woofer.
I am wondering whether same can be done on a computer: just an HDMI connection between your computer and AV receiver and your receiver powers your 3 way active stereo speakers???
Can you please tell me which dsp software is capable of such routing on HDMI?
And can you please share some links to such systems people have built?
Many people seem to be using DSP in a box type of solutions? A computer and HDMI based solution would be much more elegant and cheaper too...
Because you may find a much better DAC from pro audio.
well actually hdmi path may not take good care of jitter issues... it's not a good way of delivering very high quality audio signal.
Yes, the PC can process audio even much better and with far less constraints and limits. Actually once you have departed from using an AVreceiver as an audio processor(and/or DTS/Dolby tracks decoder), you realize that using it merely as a DAC, is just a source of unnecessary complications.
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JRiver is probably the best software for playing back music and movies, but the latters with some software "help" (look for anydvd and similar products and be aware of what they are...).
JRiver DSP capabilities are simply huge. It has all the stuff one may be interested in for building limitless multiway, multichannel setups.
Anyway I don't think that every AVreceivers, connected via HDMI, can receive processed multichannel PCM audio. It's sure you can bitstream to an AVReceiver, but that would be useless since all processing would be made by the AVR
Don't exactly know what you mean by that last part, JRiver is an excellent movie player for movies with the included MadVR software.
Do you mean for actual disk playback?
I simply mean that JRiver can't "legally" play dvd and blurays. The must be previously "treated" by anydvd..
I say this because is important that everyone fully understands all implications. For example are you sure that JRiver will allow to watch UltraHD movies?
Probably, after some time... but don't take it for granted!P.S.
don't get me wrong
. I love JRiver for movies, and it has allowed me to use a wonderful professional mch DAC that I could have never used if forced into the stupid HDMI standard. Anyway I have to warn people about protection related issues when I suggest them to get rid of their AVRs
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I'm quite surprised that you are surprised. DCX (and DEQ) are awful when it comes to clipping. Sure I could lower the gain but then the music looses its clarity and punch. I don't know why it happens but it is very evident. My output and input gain can be 0dB using digital input and many loudly recorded albums are simply too loud for DCX. I also don't have any amplification in output stage and use only caps so my DCX is very quiet.
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