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Old 19th December 2014, 03:42 PM   #1
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Default my speaker sounds different with different amplifier :(

Hello... I'm new here
I hope someone here can help me to solve my problem .

I have a surround speakers that sounds oke (at least according to my ear ) when I use my old AVR for 12 years.

Two weeks ago the AVR was broken, so I bought a new one.
I hate the sounds which produced from this new AVR, because to my ear :

1. it sounds hollow (like using a very small amount of reverb effect). Watching movies in my room is just like watching in an old Movie Theater with bad acoustic

2. From the picture :
Click the image to open in full size.

Fig.A is what I feel the sound produced from the new AVR.
I think this causes the dialogues in center speaker seems come out from everywhere (unnatural).

Fig.B is what I feel the sound produced from the old AVR.
It is focused. I feel the dialogue from center speaker is natural.

3. By the time the surround sounds active in all speakers, the sounds like "fighting" each other. It's loud, just like listening from a very bad quality speakers. (but I think it is because a bad quality AVR).

As I'm not a technical guy at all, my question is :
Will it be possible to put "something" (I don't know, maybe a resistor? a capacitor?) in between the cable before it's going into the speaker's box to at least reduce those unnatural sound ?

Any kind of responds will be greatly appreciated.
Thank you in advanced, and please forgive me for my broken English.

regards.
Front : Wharfedale Diamond IV (2 way - 100 watt - 8 ohm)
Center + Rear : Kenwood CRS15 (C : 100 watt, R : 40 watt ... 8 ohm)
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Old 19th December 2014, 04:24 PM   #2
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most AV receivers have a DSP digital sound processor chip. There are many options with the DSP chip to change the sound depending on the source material. You can create a suround sound experience from a stereo source, a stadium effect, concert hall, various dolby and THX processing options, night time, dramatic, various equalizer effects etc etc including no processing at all. Some AV receivers have an automatic room equalizer as well. Your older receiver may not have had as many options so it sounds different. Carefully read the manual and try all the options, it may take several hours if not days.
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Old 19th December 2014, 04:38 PM   #3
kevinkr is offline kevinkr  United States
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Perhaps after some investigation if the results are still bad, return the receiver and get something else?
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Old 19th December 2014, 05:00 PM   #4
chrisb is offline chrisb  Canada
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Quote:
Originally Posted by multisync View Post
Carefully read the manual and try all the options, it may take several hours if not days.

manual for my most recent AV Receiver - Onkyo TX NR818 is 156 pages in English only - and once you start playing with advanced speaker set up / manual EQ adjustments AFTER the automated Audyssey process (which is a dream to use), all bets as to your sanity are off

well, maybe that's slightly hyperbolic - but due to, or in spite of, the multi-tiered on screen menus, it's sure easy for an infrequent user to get lost


what is the make / model of the new unit?

I almost entirely abandoned the idea of true surround after struggling with my first Denon AVR1600 or some such number about 10yrs ago - but after upgrading to first a newer Denon, and now the Onkyo, both with the Audyssey system, the initial and any changes to speaker set up are a breeze - just plug in the supplied mike, and the system takes over. No doubt there are other similar utilities available such as the Anthem, etc, but this is definitely the way to go for the non-professional installer.
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Last edited by chrisb; 19th December 2014 at 05:07 PM.
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Old 19th December 2014, 05:31 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by multisync View Post
most AV receivers have a DSP digital sound processor chip. There are many options with the DSP chip to change the sound depending on the source material. You can create a suround sound experience from a stereo source, a stadium effect, concert hall, various dolby and THX processing options, night time, dramatic, various equalizer effects etc etc including no processing at all. Some AV receivers have an automatic room equalizer as well. Your older receiver may not have had as many options so it sounds different. Carefully read the manual and try all the options, it may take several hours if not days.
Hi multisync... I put the "pure direct" mode of the AVR. So, there are no effect there... no processing at all .

Quote:
Originally Posted by kevinkr View Post
Perhaps after some investigation if the results are still bad, return the receiver and get something else?
I think to get something else it's not possible - because I bought from the vendor that sells only this brand (Pioneer). To buy the upper model (which is more bells and whistles rather than the quality) - it's way too expensive for me, kevinkr .

I just hope this is a defected product (which I don;t think so), so then I can return it and get the change with the same model.

Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisb View Post
manual for my most recent AV Receiver - Onkyo TX NR818 is 156 pages in English only - and once you start playing with advanced speaker set up / manual EQ adjustments AFTER the automated Audyssey process (which is a dream to use), all bets as to your sanity are off
My new AVR setup is pretty simple since I prefer to listen the movie's audio in "direct/pure direct" mode .

Quote:
what is the make / model of the new unit?
it's Pioneer VSX-329, chrisb.

Quote:
just plug in the supplied mike, and the system takes over
too bad, I have the lowest model of this Pioneer. The upper model have the mic to automatic setup .

I'm just thinking that this kind of sound problem can be solved/reduced with a connection in series of capacitor/resistor to the speaker. Maybe to reduce the midrange sound ?

Thank you guys for all kind of your responds.

regards.
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Old 20th December 2014, 12:06 PM   #6
AllenB is offline AllenB  Australia
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Not sure where you're from but in Australia we can return things without giving a reason.. within a reasonable time period, for a cash refund.
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Old 20th December 2014, 02:02 PM   #7
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no, a capacitor or resistor will not fix your problem.

Does your Pioneer receiver have a test to check each of the channels. ie left rear, left front, center, right front and right rear?

when you use pure direct mode on FM radio is the sound only left and right channels and nothing else?

Is there a display on your receiver and does it say what mode it is in when you change different sources? Mine will say stereo or 5.1 depending on the source material. When I switch tv channels for example some are in 5.1 and some in stereo. The display on the receiver changes to reflect the source change.

Even if you have direct pure setting I am pretty sure direct pure can be modified to suit tastes.

Is there a speaker size setting or a sub wooffer setting on/off?

You have double checked your speaker wiring and connections to the terminals on the receiver.
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Old 20th December 2014, 02:08 PM   #8
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occasionally my wife will accidentally change something on the AV receiver and I have to dig out the manual to get things back the way they were. The last resort is to RTFM. Read The F'ng Manual which is what I used to say to the service reps working under me.

Sometimes what you think the manual says is not what it means.
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Old 20th December 2014, 02:53 PM   #9
kevinkr is offline kevinkr  United States
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I'll definitely second the comment on the speaking wiring, make sure all of the speakers are phased correctly.
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Old 20th December 2014, 04:26 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AllenB View Post
Not sure where you're from but in Australia we can return things without giving a reason.. within a reasonable time period, for a cash refund.
Too bad it's not happen in Australia neighbor country (Bali), Allen. .

Quote:
Originally Posted by multisync View Post
no, a capacitor or resistor will not fix your problem.
col (crying out loud)

Quote:
Does your Pioneer receiver have a test to check each of the channels. ie left rear, left front, center, right front and right rear?
Yes it has. Just like my old AVR. In the test is OK, multisync.

Quote:
when you use pure direct mode on FM radio is the sound only left and right channels and nothing else?
the direct mode is only when connected to HDMI and/or Optical cable. When I choose "tuner", it automatically change to Analog and sound comes from Front R/L speakers. But I can "tweak" it with the listen mode in DSP option (such as cinema/stage/hall etc) so the sound comes out from all 5 speakers.

Quote:
Is there a display on your receiver and does it say what mode it is in when you change different sources? Mine will say stereo or 5.1 depending on the source material.
Yes, though it doesn't tell me like the old AVR if the input is DolbyDigital stereo or 5.1 ... still it show if the input is analog, dts, dts-HD, dd, dd-HD. And if the analog is "simulated" the display show "pro logic II"

Quote:
Even if you have direct pure setting I am pretty sure direct pure can be modified to suit tastes.
the only thing I can modified is the speaker setup : small/large Front and Center, sub on/off, volume for F/R/C/Lfe, distance, how much Khz to go to sub-woofer which I don't understand at all of this ... I can't do treble/bass control - can not choose listen mode such as cinema/stage/hall, etc.

In dts audio, I can not choose midnight mode. I need to change from pure-direct to auto-surround to get in midnight mode. But all those are nothing new... it's just the same like my 12 years old AVR. Can't do much in pure direct mode.

Quote:
Is there a speaker size setting or a sub wooffer setting on/off?
tried back and forth ... :
Sub : on - off
Front : large / small
Rear : large / small
Distance : any kind of combination
Triple checking the wiring connection from the AVR to each speakers .

Today I just found out from the internet, a guy talking about fixing an audio - but he's talking only for the center speaker problem (while mine, all F/R/C speakers sound too open midrange (nasal?).... loud (loud in negative sense) and just like listening audio with a very liiiittle reverb effect but there is no effect.

I disconnect all the wiring to Front and Center, listen to only Rear (either one speaker only or both R/L) the feel of a hollow sound is there. Hearing hundreds of audience clapping hands (applaus) in my old AVR sounds "dry" ... new AVR sounds "wet". Oh my... it's very difficult for me on how to describe the sound ... lol

anyway, he say like this :
Quote:
There is a simple answer to all of this, if you do have a centre speaker that's a bit 'boomy' or 'heavy in the nasal passages',you can use this trick.

To do this is quite simple, wire 'in series' with the loudspeaker a capacitor of a value that has a reactance equal to the nominal impedance of the loudspeaker itself.

This provides a 6db/Octave slope from the cutoff frequency. If the cutoff frequency is 320 cycles/sec. and the nominal impedance of the speaker is 8 ohms then a series capacitor of 62.5 microfarads will be correct Audio Tips and Tricks - Archives - AV Forum Australia - The leading audio visual and home theatre forum
As I know English language not much, I wonder if the article above is talking about the same audio/sounds problem which I have ?

Thank you for all your kind responds, guys.

regards.
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