Hi guys,
I went on my first vintage speaker hunt this morning. It was out of premeditated impulsiveness, but the speakers I purchased amaze me. They sound much better than I expected upon initial impression.
What's so cool about them--They have an upward radiating 5" driver and a forward radiating horn loaded tweeter. Sounds like they were designing for soundstage, right?
They have a spacious, open, and beautiful soundstage--despite a sorta-harsh tweeter on a class D amplifier. (Yet to own a tube amp.)
There are no markings on the outside of the enclosure, so I'm not sure how to identify them without opening them up. I will probably open them up to inspect the crossover network eventually. I suspect the tweeter may sound better with refreshed caps. There is also something loose inside one.
Upon listening it seems the upward radiating driver receives full range. I did an impedance sweep with DATS. The resonate frequency is right at 50hz, and they sound like they have the bass response to back up that correlation.
Any comments or knowledge on these guys? They keep impressing me with their soundstage.
They have RCA terminals lol.
I went on my first vintage speaker hunt this morning. It was out of premeditated impulsiveness, but the speakers I purchased amaze me. They sound much better than I expected upon initial impression.
What's so cool about them--They have an upward radiating 5" driver and a forward radiating horn loaded tweeter. Sounds like they were designing for soundstage, right?
They have a spacious, open, and beautiful soundstage--despite a sorta-harsh tweeter on a class D amplifier. (Yet to own a tube amp.)
There are no markings on the outside of the enclosure, so I'm not sure how to identify them without opening them up. I will probably open them up to inspect the crossover network eventually. I suspect the tweeter may sound better with refreshed caps. There is also something loose inside one.
Upon listening it seems the upward radiating driver receives full range. I did an impedance sweep with DATS. The resonate frequency is right at 50hz, and they sound like they have the bass response to back up that correlation.
Any comments or knowledge on these guys? They keep impressing me with their soundstage.
They have RCA terminals lol.
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I don't know quite how those are designed to be placed! 
Roy Allison did some amazing speakers that put the bass flush against the wall and pointing upwards. The tweeters usually pointed forwards like with the Allison Model 4. This is explained a bit here in a lovely Acoustic Research memoir: http://www.stereophile.com/content/glorious-time-ars-edgar-villchur-and-roy-allison-allison-part-2
I think you could experiment with placement. But I've really no idea what will work best. Even in a corner, who knows? But a fun purchase.
Roy Allison did some amazing speakers that put the bass flush against the wall and pointing upwards. The tweeters usually pointed forwards like with the Allison Model 4. This is explained a bit here in a lovely Acoustic Research memoir: http://www.stereophile.com/content/glorious-time-ars-edgar-villchur-and-roy-allison-allison-part-2
I think you could experiment with placement. But I've really no idea what will work best. Even in a corner, who knows? But a fun purchase.
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Fun indeed!
[monologue]I have been experimenting with placement. They are intended to sit on their feet as they are in the third picture on the shelf. I have yet to conclude they actually sound better in any other position. I get a better sounding frequency response with them on their side, horns angled slightly towards the listener and pistons facing inward toward each other. But the best soundstage is heard in their intended positions--pistons radiating up perpendicular to the ground and horns pointed directly at you in the horizontal plane. They are sitting naturally on my desk, so the horns aren't at ear level. Bringing the horns to ear level has a different effect but is not necessarily better.[/monologue]
The 5" driver looks like it doesn't have a surround! This makes me nervous about keeping them on their sides. I attempted to get a look at it through the grill cloth with a bright light. I can make out enough to be confident it is paper, but I can also clearly see a metal frame with expected frame vent holes very much like Cal's picture there, only I am looking from the front on the driver past the edge of the cone where the surround should be!
I did manage to take a picture of the diaphragm of the tweeter through the long, long very long neck of the horn. It is weird also. It has 4 intentional holes in it.
I tried to open the enclosure by removing screws on the bottom panel, but it seems to be glued in place. Does my only choice of opening them now involve sawdust?
Edit: I have them on a class AB amp now. Sound is slightly different. Bass is different, not quite as defined/tight. I have experienced this with these amps on other speakers, however. Treble isn't as harsh though.
[monologue]I have been experimenting with placement. They are intended to sit on their feet as they are in the third picture on the shelf. I have yet to conclude they actually sound better in any other position. I get a better sounding frequency response with them on their side, horns angled slightly towards the listener and pistons facing inward toward each other. But the best soundstage is heard in their intended positions--pistons radiating up perpendicular to the ground and horns pointed directly at you in the horizontal plane. They are sitting naturally on my desk, so the horns aren't at ear level. Bringing the horns to ear level has a different effect but is not necessarily better.[/monologue]
The 5" driver looks like it doesn't have a surround! This makes me nervous about keeping them on their sides. I attempted to get a look at it through the grill cloth with a bright light. I can make out enough to be confident it is paper, but I can also clearly see a metal frame with expected frame vent holes very much like Cal's picture there, only I am looking from the front on the driver past the edge of the cone where the surround should be!
I did manage to take a picture of the diaphragm of the tweeter through the long, long very long neck of the horn. It is weird also. It has 4 intentional holes in it.
I tried to open the enclosure by removing screws on the bottom panel, but it seems to be glued in place. Does my only choice of opening them now involve sawdust?
Edit: I have them on a class AB amp now. Sound is slightly different. Bass is different, not quite as defined/tight. I have experienced this with these amps on other speakers, however. Treble isn't as harsh though.
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Mmm, smells like a really old box.
Your advice was good phivates! I used a screw 3 sizes larger and a screwdriver and wala! This had occurred to me before, but I previously hesitated for various trivial excuses.
I knew I didn't see a surround. I feared what I heard "loose" in there was the surround. It was.
These drivers are impressive, still decent low frequency extension with no surround.
The horn is metal. The cap-part (excuse my technical terms) at the end is styrofoam.
The white you see on the rear plate of the speaker, as well as nuts and terminal flange, is actually a powder. I have no idea what kind of white powder this is.
Any advice on speakers with no surround? Is re-surrounding it possible/advisable?
Your advice was good phivates! I used a screw 3 sizes larger and a screwdriver and wala! This had occurred to me before, but I previously hesitated for various trivial excuses.
I knew I didn't see a surround. I feared what I heard "loose" in there was the surround. It was.
These drivers are impressive, still decent low frequency extension with no surround.
The horn is metal. The cap-part (excuse my technical terms) at the end is styrofoam.
The white you see on the rear plate of the speaker, as well as nuts and terminal flange, is actually a powder. I have no idea what kind of white powder this is.
Any advice on speakers with no surround? Is re-surrounding it possible/advisable?
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Not to be alarmist, but I'd advise caution re. the white powder. Best to err on the side of safety and clean that up with care. Start with a thorough vacuuming while brushing all the surfaces in there. (Your vac. should have a good fine-particle disposable filter in it.) Akin to the common use of lead in paints back then, some platings or chemical conversion coatings involved the use of cadmium, chromates, and the like, which you really don't want to be inhaling or dispersing to your surroundings!
(Disclaimer: I am not an expert in chemistry, metallurgy, or industrial hygiene - the above is just based on my anecdotal experience.)
(Disclaimer: I am not an expert in chemistry, metallurgy, or industrial hygiene - the above is just based on my anecdotal experience.)
Too bad about the surrounds. Might be worth getting replacement drivers if you like the box and the tweeters are also to your liking.
They look larger. Check, maybe mine will work in yours. They have a cloth surround.
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Based on crude tape measures, it seems like they are on 6" diagonal centers. That makes sense right, it wouldn't be six and one thirty second or anything too crazy.
Also, I can't tell what the capacitor is to replace it. It says
TEMPLE
034-020300
2 MFD 25 VNP
85c 6920
Any idea? It measures 2.5812 microfarads with DATS.
Attached is the sweep of the tweet. Looks like it shouldn't be crossed below 4khz.
Edit: If it's anything like resistors, does 2 MFD 25 VNP mean 2.25uf?
Also, I can't tell what the capacitor is to replace it. It says
TEMPLE
034-020300
2 MFD 25 VNP
85c 6920
Any idea? It measures 2.5812 microfarads with DATS.
Attached is the sweep of the tweet. Looks like it shouldn't be crossed below 4khz.
Edit: If it's anything like resistors, does 2 MFD 25 VNP mean 2.25uf?
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It's a 6.5 inch mid bass, entirely generic, I have many variations on that theme. A little surprised to see foam with the horn but it must be from the end of the line time wise, since under the polystyrene cap on the horn is an alnico motor. You're high end collectable on your first try. Admiral? Silvertone?? Maggie???
I may be missing something, you lost me on the latter half. How do you know it's an alnico motor?
I am?
These are collectible and high end even? That's awesome! I mean, I knew they sounded good for being so old.Thanks!
I really enjoy the sound of the drivers, I can tell they are special. It feels like a shame to discard them, really. If replacing the surrounds is possible I definitely want to investigate.
I have too much of this kind of stuff. Your horns are Jensen copies. Any of the refoam vendors can supply kits to restore what you have. Unless you are a total klutz it is quite doable and satisfying to bring a good thing back to life. I prefer the old school approach of removing the dust cap and shimming the voice coil; unless you are patience challenged I'd say do it. You'll like it.
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