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Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

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Old 18th June 2017, 08:02 AM   #411
suzyj is offline suzyj  Australia
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Now that my diyAudio P13WH reference speakers are broken in (ten plus years of daily music's gotta count as broken in, right?) I thought I'd measure them.

First photo shows the measurement setup. The position on my desk is pretty-much as I have them on the bedside tables - about 10cm from the wall.

Next plot is with an AEM6000 derived amp. This thing is flat from 5Hz to 100KHz +/-.1dB, so makes a good reference. The bass is... lacking. It gets much worse when I pull it away from the wall.

Next with my NAD3020B, which has been sitting by my bedside driving these speakers for pretty-much the whole time I've had them. Despite building a pile of super-duper low-distortion, incredibly flat, super low noise MOSFET amps, I've stuck with this one for driving these speakers, despite the hum and hiss.

Now I know why. It's lack of flatness (bass and treble controls are mid-way) EQ these speakers rather well.

The final plot shows a comparison between the two amps.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg IMG_0058.JPG (876.1 KB, 381 views)
File Type: jpg diyAudio P13WH reference - AEM6000.jpg (117.1 KB, 368 views)
File Type: jpg diyAudio P13WH reference - NAD3020.jpg (117.1 KB, 340 views)
File Type: jpg diyAudio P13WH reference - NAD vs AEM.jpg (74.8 KB, 341 views)
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Old 18th June 2017, 08:22 AM   #412
suzyj is offline suzyj  Australia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rabbitz View Post
The Vifa P13 & D27 design I listed must be perfect (hehehehe) as nobody's changed it.
Yes, yes it is.
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Old 18th June 2017, 12:59 PM   #413
Moondog55 is offline Moondog55  Australia
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Default Has it really been that long?

I never actually built them, in the end I used the drivers in a big closed bass 3-way using a P26 woofer.
The big woofer did add the missing bass obviously but I've not found the mid/treble combination lacking.
Now that I have time on my hands and spare drivers on the shelf I really really should build a pair

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Old 19th June 2017, 09:20 AM   #414
rabbitz is offline rabbitz  Australia
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Default Ghost of speakers past

Thanks for posting the measurements Suzy. Not too bad and I'm happy with that as I've seen a lot worse. The xo, with 3 components, seems to be doing it's job. The distortion values are higher than I expected and in particular H3, but you tend to get higher H3 than H2 in speakers. At least there is not huge variations in distortion over the operating range. Yep, bass is MIA. If you need more top end you can always drop the resistor to the next lowest value.

Ted, if you are going to build one of these, use the 9.5 litre design as it has a better tonal balance with more bass. It relies heavily on boundary loading and mine were 40mm from the wall.

The 5.2 litre design is very low on bass and is bettered easily by a little 2.5" PC speaker design I'm doing at the moment using a SB65WBAC25-4 in a 1.4 litre vented enclosure. I'm going to build it in a 100mm PVC pipe 45 elbow and is designed for 5W only as I'm using a T-Amp (DTA-1 or DTA-2). Nearfield, this is plenty loud. I've added a pic of the prototype.

I got into this micro stuff after I was looking at the UE and JBL Bluetooth thingies for the workshop and they sounded terrible. Easily bettered by some small speakers and T-amp hooked up to an iPod.
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File Type: jpg SB65WBAC_test.jpg (88.9 KB, 235 views)
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Last edited by rabbitz; 19th June 2017 at 09:24 AM.
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Old 19th June 2017, 10:51 AM   #415
suzyj is offline suzyj  Australia
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I'm keen on doing a 4" + 3/4" in a TL next. There's a whole flock of nice 4" (120mm flange) midwoofers to choose from, for not a lot of money, and they can be shoved up close to a 19mm dome. Say SB12NRX25 + ND20FB. My experience with the Ariels and with the noisePlank TG9 has me very keen on little drivers with transmission lines. I reckon the 4 + 3/4 TL would be very nice for my desk, and a whole pile stacked on top of one another would be fun.
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Last edited by suzyj; 19th June 2017 at 10:57 AM.
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Old 20th June 2017, 01:29 AM   #416
rabbitz is offline rabbitz  Australia
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The SB12NRX25-4 is a great driver and have used it in 2 speakers. An MTM with a SS S2905 and Jeff Bagby's Soprano with a slightly modified crossover. The bass performance is great for a 4" driver. In fact, SB Acoustics drivers are very good and are now my driver of choice. Great performance for the dollar.

Click the image to open in full size.
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Old 21st June 2017, 09:09 AM   #417
rabbitz is offline rabbitz  Australia
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Suzy

Had a look at your "noisePlank" and very cool. As usual you've done a great job and it's an interesting read.
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