Hi folks, I confess that I'm nervous about making this first post. I apologize in advance if I'm repeating a question that has been asked hundreds of times.
I have a pair of 12-year old Paradigm Monitor 7 speakers, from back in the days when I had no kids and the ability to spend money on such things. The left speaker now sounds a bit 'muddy' compared to the right. I'm guessing one of the drivers has blown, but I'm sure it could be any number of things. I noticed that one of the kids had pushed in the cone on one of the two mid-range drivers. I got it to 'pop' back out (sucked it out with a vacuum). That's the only 'cause' I can think of. I haven't been cranking music up or anything.
This issue has led me on a bit of a rabbit chase. I'm a professional woodworker with a full shop (and access to a CNC if need be). I was wondering if, instead of trying to get this speaker repaired, I might get better sound by building a new pair of speakers. I don't know if sound quality in speakers degrades over time or if driver technology has improved greatly in the last 12 years. If the answer to either of those questions is yes, then I'd be willing to give this a shot.
I'm not a true audiophile and a lot of the technical issues with speakers drivers/ crossovers make my eyes glaze over. I love woodworking, but wave science and physics and the number crunching of acoustics are waaaaaay over my head. I enjoy music and was one of those guys who used to go into the overpriced audio stores to drool over all the stuff I couldn't afford.
Are there some good 'kits' or plans out there? If I had around $300-400 to spend for a pair of floor-standing front speakers (other than wood/veneer/mdf or other stuff that I have in my wood shop), are there a couple of 'go to' designs/components where there is consensus among forum members that the results are good? If so, can you steer me towards those kits/plans?
Alternatively, I could just try to repair my Monitor 7's (or maybe replace all the drivers in both speakers??). Or I could just buy a pair of retail speakers. I'm definitely open to suggestions and am really grateful for your help.
Thanks!
John
I have a pair of 12-year old Paradigm Monitor 7 speakers, from back in the days when I had no kids and the ability to spend money on such things. The left speaker now sounds a bit 'muddy' compared to the right. I'm guessing one of the drivers has blown, but I'm sure it could be any number of things. I noticed that one of the kids had pushed in the cone on one of the two mid-range drivers. I got it to 'pop' back out (sucked it out with a vacuum). That's the only 'cause' I can think of. I haven't been cranking music up or anything.
This issue has led me on a bit of a rabbit chase. I'm a professional woodworker with a full shop (and access to a CNC if need be). I was wondering if, instead of trying to get this speaker repaired, I might get better sound by building a new pair of speakers. I don't know if sound quality in speakers degrades over time or if driver technology has improved greatly in the last 12 years. If the answer to either of those questions is yes, then I'd be willing to give this a shot.
I'm not a true audiophile and a lot of the technical issues with speakers drivers/ crossovers make my eyes glaze over. I love woodworking, but wave science and physics and the number crunching of acoustics are waaaaaay over my head. I enjoy music and was one of those guys who used to go into the overpriced audio stores to drool over all the stuff I couldn't afford.
Are there some good 'kits' or plans out there? If I had around $300-400 to spend for a pair of floor-standing front speakers (other than wood/veneer/mdf or other stuff that I have in my wood shop), are there a couple of 'go to' designs/components where there is consensus among forum members that the results are good? If so, can you steer me towards those kits/plans?
Alternatively, I could just try to repair my Monitor 7's (or maybe replace all the drivers in both speakers??). Or I could just buy a pair of retail speakers. I'm definitely open to suggestions and am really grateful for your help.
Thanks!
John
Re:"consensus among forum members " - hahahaha... finding that is all you've got to be nervous about....
Have a look around here: DIY Loudspeakers
& here: Zaph|Audio
Have a look around here: DIY Loudspeakers
& here: Zaph|Audio
here you go
the midwoofers are made in USA if that matters for you, and its designed by well respected designer Jeff B
http://meniscusaudio.com/docero-bare-bones-pair-p-1409.html
http://meniscusaudio.com/images/Docero Box.pdf
the midwoofers are made in USA if that matters for you, and its designed by well respected designer Jeff B
http://meniscusaudio.com/docero-bare-bones-pair-p-1409.html
http://meniscusaudio.com/images/Docero Box.pdf
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Nice kit henry. Here featured with full kit parts.
Also very nice looking drivers, what kinda looks like almost perfect 7'' (6.5) Eclipse W6520R-4 on paper.
Docero Full Kit
http://meniscusaudio.com/images/Docero Box.pdf
More on Eclipse W6520R-4 - Eclipse by Meniscus Audio:
Eclipse, W6520R-4
View topic - Eclipse W6520R-4 (Kokomo) measurements. • Meniscus Audio Forum
Received my W6520R-4 drivers!!
Bagby Design Seminar Meniscus Kit "Docere"
LDSG - ACI/Eclipse/Meniscus recommendations
The Product Line Up at ACI
Also very nice looking drivers, what kinda looks like almost perfect 7'' (6.5) Eclipse W6520R-4 on paper.
Docero Full Kit
http://meniscusaudio.com/images/Docero Box.pdf
More on Eclipse W6520R-4 - Eclipse by Meniscus Audio:
Eclipse, W6520R-4
View topic - Eclipse W6520R-4 (Kokomo) measurements. • Meniscus Audio Forum
Received my W6520R-4 drivers!!
Bagby Design Seminar Meniscus Kit "Docere"
LDSG - ACI/Eclipse/Meniscus recommendations
The Product Line Up at ACI
Attachments
If the OP likes CNC or flat pack panels (different options and prices) he can also get the 2Pi towers with 10" drivers from Pi speakers for ($100.00 kit) Total 200,00 USD. All kits have drawings (Kit Price) or are provided with CNC cut panels (Price) more expensive. They have the Eminence Alpha 10 as a mid-bass driver.
Pi Speakers - Prices, Dimensions and Specifications
Pi Speaker Kits, two Pi tower kit
Pi Speakers - two Pi tower speaker performance data
Pi Speakers - Prices, Dimensions and Specifications
Pi Speaker Kits, two Pi tower kit
Pi Speakers - two Pi tower speaker performance data
Thanks for the initial thoughts, guys. I've just spent an hour or two on troels website, another hour reading about the Meniscus class and Jeff's speakers from it, and an hour reading about the Pi speakers. Talk about drinking from a firehose! I am absolutely overwhelmed.
A couple of thoughts/reactions:
1) I was surprised how small many of the speakers were. I think maybe I've got a 'bigger is better' mindset that might be erroneous. Or maybe going with a bigger, 3-way speaker would be out of my budget so it wasn't suggested.
2) It seemed interesting to me how many people make 'bookshelf' sized speakers and then put them on a floor stand. Since the footprint of doing that is the same as floor-standing speakers, I was curious why they didn't just go with floor-standing speakers in the first place. Maybe it's an aesthetic thing, or maybe a larger enclosure doesn't add as much as I assumed.
3) I kept wanting a, 'this is better than that' comparison. How would the Pi 3 or 4 compare with that Meniscus kit? I have absolutely no idea. And I don't speak 'wave,' so those graphs don't mean anything to me. I also wanted to know, 'will these sound better than my old Paradigms?' I'm guessing they would, even though terms like 'sound better' are subjective and it seems like folks on the forums generally avoid those kinds of statements as primitive or unhelpful.
4) I'm increasingly curious about the answer to my first two questions in the thread: Does sound quality in a pair of speakers degrade over time? (e.g. Will my speakers have 'lost something' in the last 12 years?) And are drivers today 'better' than drivers in the past?
5) Troels made me think about efficiency. I have a budget AV receiver (Denon AVR-E400). I also have a pair of in-wall rear surround speakers (Polk) and a Paradigm center channel (and an inexpensive 10" powered Polk sub). It wouldn't be realistic for me to buy an amp, so I'm wondering if I need to be concerned about having enough horsepower to drive the speakers that I build. If I remember correctly, the Paradigms were notoriously inefficient, and this receiver has plenty of power for them. So maybe it wouldn't be an issue.
6) I think I would need idiot-proof wiring that doesn't need to be dialed-in or adjusted. I'm extremely intimidated by all the crossover diagrams I've seen. I could happily build a complicated wood cabinet, but put a soldering iron in my hand and I turn into a whimpering 4 year old girl.
7) I also think I would need extremely clear, detailed plans. Since I've never done this before and since I don't know what I don't know, I'd need a really good roadmap.
Phew.
John
A couple of thoughts/reactions:
1) I was surprised how small many of the speakers were. I think maybe I've got a 'bigger is better' mindset that might be erroneous. Or maybe going with a bigger, 3-way speaker would be out of my budget so it wasn't suggested.
2) It seemed interesting to me how many people make 'bookshelf' sized speakers and then put them on a floor stand. Since the footprint of doing that is the same as floor-standing speakers, I was curious why they didn't just go with floor-standing speakers in the first place. Maybe it's an aesthetic thing, or maybe a larger enclosure doesn't add as much as I assumed.
3) I kept wanting a, 'this is better than that' comparison. How would the Pi 3 or 4 compare with that Meniscus kit? I have absolutely no idea. And I don't speak 'wave,' so those graphs don't mean anything to me. I also wanted to know, 'will these sound better than my old Paradigms?' I'm guessing they would, even though terms like 'sound better' are subjective and it seems like folks on the forums generally avoid those kinds of statements as primitive or unhelpful.
4) I'm increasingly curious about the answer to my first two questions in the thread: Does sound quality in a pair of speakers degrade over time? (e.g. Will my speakers have 'lost something' in the last 12 years?) And are drivers today 'better' than drivers in the past?
5) Troels made me think about efficiency. I have a budget AV receiver (Denon AVR-E400). I also have a pair of in-wall rear surround speakers (Polk) and a Paradigm center channel (and an inexpensive 10" powered Polk sub). It wouldn't be realistic for me to buy an amp, so I'm wondering if I need to be concerned about having enough horsepower to drive the speakers that I build. If I remember correctly, the Paradigms were notoriously inefficient, and this receiver has plenty of power for them. So maybe it wouldn't be an issue.
6) I think I would need idiot-proof wiring that doesn't need to be dialed-in or adjusted. I'm extremely intimidated by all the crossover diagrams I've seen. I could happily build a complicated wood cabinet, but put a soldering iron in my hand and I turn into a whimpering 4 year old girl.
7) I also think I would need extremely clear, detailed plans. Since I've never done this before and since I don't know what I don't know, I'd need a really good roadmap.
Phew.
John
I'm certainly no expert when it comes to speakers (or electronics in general), but it might help others if you stated what you want the speakers for, primarily. Do you want them mostly for home theater, or for listening to music? Are they to be placed in a large room or a small room? Do the speakers need to be able to produce good bass, or will you be using a subwoofer? Your intended use might help people to better narrow down their suggestions.
Let's check the easy ones first.
It's after the fact that people notice they can have them in the same foot print, meaning stands, but also to place and forget about them in the bookshelfs. Sincerely, I wouldn't mind about the new Sonus Faber Extremas but again who wants a response in frequency that doesn't go lower than 50Hz. You need larger floorstanders for lower (read: higher internal volume) LF extension in frequency/bass.
All the kits have detailed instructions (dummy proof) with draying layouts of crossovers. You might have to hire your kids though, if you don't know how to use an iron...
Hi Phil, valid question. Probably half music, half home theater. Speakers will be in a 16' X 20' living room with wood floors, a couch, love seat, tables, etc. To be honest, I will probably stream some of the music via Pandora, Spotify etc., so the quality of the music itself will be lower than it would in some other formats.
In short, this is not a dedicated listening room where I will be quietly sipping cognac while idly flipping through the most recent issue of Conde Nast. Instead, it is a typical American living room with marginal acoustics, three loud children, and one long-suffering wife. The speakers will be subjected to "I'm a map," by Dora the Explorer as well as the entire libretto from Barney.
Sincerely, I wouldn't mind about the new Sonus Faber Extremas but again who wants a response in frequency that doesn't go lower than 50Hz. You need larger floorstanders for lower (read: higher internal volume) LF extension in frequency/bass.
Inductor, my bias as a woodworker will show here, but I love the use of beautiful solids and veneers as in the Sonus Fabers. Black (and white) speakers make me sad. There's just so much beautiful wood out there... I like the idea of making something that looks good.
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