Yes, in the old times, before the euro, it was exactly like that. That's what happens when you print your currency like in Brasil. Your imports are taxed very high so that you can pay inflation and debt.
As a general rule you mass produce the goods that you are good at. It doesn't matter a lot if they are needed or not. Sometimes you don't have access to those goods (made in Brazil). You have to export for an example 5 millions units of a product, say loudspeaker drivers, and import the same drivers in quantities of 50 or 100. That's economics, not very economic if you ask my opinion, and that's stupid but (people that know it, know) that's how it works.
- "folks in here just don't give a damn." - Yes. Folks here just give a damn, that's another reason things changed, but they (government) always find a way to taxe you more after. They (international survey) asked people how much they wouldn't bother and would agreed to pay to their government for taxes, and in general, the response from we the people was about 11%. And look how much they taxe us: double, triple and more.
Has anybody actually looked at this Dayton Audio RS225-8 woofer that krafty is so keen on?
Flippin heck. I was wondering why it was being implemented with such a complex 4th order filter and such a low crossover in the RS Duet. I just put it down to that peculiar American obsession (Zaph, I'm looking at YOU! LOL) for low crossover. But no, the reason is that it's a metal cone!
Just the sort of thing I would run a mile from.
krafty, read my lips. You are out of your depth with that one. And your chances of aligning it with an 8Khz XO piezo are zero.
Not that I honestly fancy aligning that piezo with anything in the 8" bass range unless the sound of cone breakup is your bag.
Flippin heck. I was wondering why it was being implemented with such a complex 4th order filter and such a low crossover in the RS Duet. I just put it down to that peculiar American obsession (Zaph, I'm looking at YOU! LOL) for low crossover. But no, the reason is that it's a metal cone!
Just the sort of thing I would run a mile from.
krafty, read my lips. You are out of your depth with that one. And your chances of aligning it with an 8Khz XO piezo are zero.
Not that I honestly fancy aligning that piezo with anything in the 8" bass range unless the sound of cone breakup is your bag.
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I would agree with you, this time, on this one 100%.Just the sort of thing I would run a mile from.
Ok, so well pointed out. I couldn't see this one coming.
From these woofers on Meniscus Audio... Which ones would be OK to replace RS-225-8 ? Max US$ 60.00.
DIY Speaker Components | Replacement Speakers | and Speaker kits from Meniscus Audio Group
Guess this Silver Flute is "OK" ?
http://meniscusaudio.com/silver-flute-w20rc388-p-561.html
Oh, when things come with a "GIFT" sign, then THAT IS THE ONE asking for trouble.... GIFTS are definitely for a charge now - they don't believe this trick anymore
From these woofers on Meniscus Audio... Which ones would be OK to replace RS-225-8 ? Max US$ 60.00.
DIY Speaker Components | Replacement Speakers | and Speaker kits from Meniscus Audio Group
Guess this Silver Flute is "OK" ?
http://meniscusaudio.com/silver-flute-w20rc388-p-561.html
Oh, when things come with a "GIFT" sign, then THAT IS THE ONE asking for trouble.... GIFTS are definitely for a charge now - they don't believe this trick anymore
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If I was spending big bucks on a woofer, I might think about this SEAS CA22RNY. That's going to be very easy to filter. Just some slope from a 1.5mH bafflestep coil and a little RC impedance correction, say 6.8R and 4.7uF shunt should do it for a 3.5kHz crossover. I discussed the filter earlier, I think.
So that is what you are looking for really. Forget 4 ohm shelf mounting car woofers.
And yes, that silver Flute Silver Flute W20RC38-08 looks doable. In fact ODougbo did a build with it:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/227018-canned-crossover-design-what-next-14.html#post3440488
So that is what you are looking for really. Forget 4 ohm shelf mounting car woofers.
And yes, that silver Flute Silver Flute W20RC38-08 looks doable. In fact ODougbo did a build with it:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/227018-canned-crossover-design-what-next-14.html#post3440488
The Silver Flute is a nice upgrade from what I have now, Hinor Car Speakers... And 37 USD is affordable. I can tell you that Hinor satisfy me in terms of bass, so I won't be complaining if I get anything better.
I am going to run WinISD on this one, and see the results. Slope 1.5mH ? I want the best value possible because I am ordering from them as well. I will only need 1 coil for this 2-way xover?
Now, if I can get same budget-wise tweeters with those Silver Flutes, I would be glad. Perhaps even order all at once.
I am going to run WinISD on this one, and see the results. Slope 1.5mH ? I want the best value possible because I am ordering from them as well. I will only need 1 coil for this 2-way xover?
Now, if I can get same budget-wise tweeters with those Silver Flutes, I would be glad. Perhaps even order all at once.
krafty, have you read this thread at all?
try this one again http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/254125-recommendation-8-inch-woofer-real-tweeter-2.html#post3882415
Le @ 1kHz 0.92 mH for silver flute. that is your bass coil value. 1mh will do.
apologies for lack of capitals. my keyboard is wet. cup of tea went over it.
try this one again http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/254125-recommendation-8-inch-woofer-real-tweeter-2.html#post3882415
Le @ 1kHz 0.92 mH for silver flute. that is your bass coil value. 1mh will do.
apologies for lack of capitals. my keyboard is wet. cup of tea went over it.
Dayton DA215-8 (datasheet) superior to Silver Flute?
What about DC200-8 (datasheet) ?
I was looking at Silver Flute previously mentioned model... but the enclosure demanded is around 16L, from both manufacturer and WinISD. Even WinISD recommends a smaller enclosure. The RS225-8 was the only option to fit on this 31L/vented. Now these two Daytons are quite affordable!
What about DC200-8 (datasheet) ?
I was looking at Silver Flute previously mentioned model... but the enclosure demanded is around 16L, from both manufacturer and WinISD. Even WinISD recommends a smaller enclosure. The RS225-8 was the only option to fit on this 31L/vented. Now these two Daytons are quite affordable!
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both quite useless. the first is an aluminium cone. the second is a high inductance subwoofer.
neither have a remotely smooth frequency response.
you want something like the SEAS CA22RNy. H1471-08 CA22RNY
i'd have thought there is some sort of reflex alignment for a larger box with the silver flute. ODougbo seemed to make biggish onken boxes.
surely someone in brasil makes a sensible 8 inch woofer, doesn't have to be very grand, just conventional...
neither have a remotely smooth frequency response.
you want something like the SEAS CA22RNy. H1471-08 CA22RNY
i'd have thought there is some sort of reflex alignment for a larger box with the silver flute. ODougbo seemed to make biggish onken boxes.
surely someone in brasil makes a sensible 8 inch woofer, doesn't have to be very grand, just conventional...
No, it's horrible. another subwoofer.
you need something that is flat up to 3.5 khz, then rolls off nicely. this is not hard. most woofers do this. keep looking at the seas ca22rny till you get the idea. you also want 8 ohms nominal, which is usually 6 ohms dc resistance.
here's another one i would take on H1659-08 U22REX/P-SL
this is a cheaper equivalent too http://www.visaton.com/en/chassis_zubehoer/tiefton/w200s_8.html
you need something that is flat up to 3.5 khz, then rolls off nicely. this is not hard. most woofers do this. keep looking at the seas ca22rny till you get the idea. you also want 8 ohms nominal, which is usually 6 ohms dc resistance.
here's another one i would take on H1659-08 U22REX/P-SL
this is a cheaper equivalent too http://www.visaton.com/en/chassis_zubehoer/tiefton/w200s_8.html
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Ok System7, I am getting the idea.
Looked through a few JBL/Selenium Woofers... and no go. No flat curve up to 3.5kHz. Also their resonance is high, like 70Hz, all of them.
I got interested in this Visaton, looks like it is german, right?
I contacted a person from Visaton to tell me about distributors here.
I found the part in Parts-Express for 44 USD. Good.
But as they don't ship to Brazil, no go.
I found also on Solen.ca but it is not the same model:
http://solen.ca/pdf/visaton/w200sc.pdf
What do you think?
The CA22RNY is very good, I see your point. But 136 USD for me, now, it's too much. (Still have many doctors to go to this season: Urologist, Cardiologist, you name it! And they all will prevent me from getting the gems...
)
Looked through a few JBL/Selenium Woofers... and no go. No flat curve up to 3.5kHz. Also their resonance is high, like 70Hz, all of them.
I got interested in this Visaton, looks like it is german, right?
I contacted a person from Visaton to tell me about distributors here.
I found the part in Parts-Express for 44 USD. Good.
But as they don't ship to Brazil, no go.
I found also on Solen.ca but it is not the same model:
http://solen.ca/pdf/visaton/w200sc.pdf
What do you think?
The CA22RNY is very good, I see your point. But 136 USD for me, now, it's too much. (Still have many doctors to go to this season: Urologist, Cardiologist, you name it! And they all will prevent me from getting the gems...
)
You should be looking for a paper or polypropylene 8" cone. They are all similar, rolling off around 3.5kHz. This is a matter of cone geometry.
That Visaton W200SC looks like the magnetically shielded version of the W200S. Should be OK.
This would probably be easy enough in closed box around 30L:
60W 8in Shielded Bass Mid Range Speaker | Maplin
This is a bigger magnet reflex version, I'd think:
80W 8in Shielded Bass Mid Range Speaker | Maplin
Cheap Chinese clones of the Visaton W200S, I'd reckon.
Tweeters like these would be easy enough too:
TW 70 - 8 Ohm
HT-22/8
Look for some local equivalents.
That Visaton W200SC looks like the magnetically shielded version of the W200S. Should be OK.
This would probably be easy enough in closed box around 30L:
60W 8in Shielded Bass Mid Range Speaker | Maplin
This is a bigger magnet reflex version, I'd think:
80W 8in Shielded Bass Mid Range Speaker | Maplin
Cheap Chinese clones of the Visaton W200S, I'd reckon.
Tweeters like these would be easy enough too:
TW 70 - 8 Ohm
HT-22/8
Look for some local equivalents.
What you aren't saying is that a typical 8" will start beaming above 1.2-1.5kHz, and xovering below this problematic region is pretty much a standard fare requirement for 8" 2-way designs.
Like I said back referring to my MAX design when I was building it-
They're not the easiest type of design due to how they have to blend in operation and the complex filters that are likely required. I did 10 variations before I was happy with the xover, and steep slopes were required. You CAN do 8" 2-ways with metal cones, but you have to be persistent, dedicated, and apparently an obsessed glutton for masochistic punishment.
They are indeed plausible,
Wolf
I really don't notice beaming, Wolfie. Perhaps you just toe this sort of speaker into your listening position, but I find it so musically involving I don't really care.
The whole trick on a flat baffle is to wire the tweeter in negative polarity. This is because time alignment sucks.
I grew up with the hugely popular Wharfedale Linton:
Everybody liked this speaker at the price. Every other musical college student owned a pair. The others had the rock oriented Acoustic Research AR-6, IIRC, which is not totally different as it goes. Both had a low 1.2kHz crossover. But they really don't make tweeters like that anymore.
But the current WLM La Scala piqued my interest too.
And Troels is doing something not a million miles away really. TQWT-
TBH, I'm still learning how to get this sort of thing working best, but it's really the most well balanced two way you can build IMO.
The whole trick on a flat baffle is to wire the tweeter in negative polarity. This is because time alignment sucks.
I grew up with the hugely popular Wharfedale Linton:
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Everybody liked this speaker at the price. Every other musical college student owned a pair. The others had the rock oriented Acoustic Research AR-6, IIRC, which is not totally different as it goes. Both had a low 1.2kHz crossover. But they really don't make tweeters like that anymore.
But the current WLM La Scala piqued my interest too.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
And Troels is doing something not a million miles away really. TQWT-
TBH, I'm still learning how to get this sort of thing working best, but it's really the most well balanced two way you can build IMO.
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