I want to respond to some comments on my youtube vids i posted here.
I am using only the main module of the Anat speaker from YG. I have the woofers for the bottom section but I have chosen NOT to use them as I live in a apt and the extended bass would annoy my neighbors. I have swept the speaker and the freq response goes down to 100hz pretty flat which honestly is pretty good. Sure I wont be able to listen to rap or organ music and I might miss some of the deep boom from U571 depth charges, but I am happy with the response.
SURE I would love to do the woofers. BUT 2 things stop me. 1, the neighbor compalints. 2. The effort. To make the box for the woofers would make me crazy as I would want to make them as stiff as metal, this would require who knows how much bracing. Its a insane amount of work.
These are kinda bigger bookshelf speakers, not full range 20-20k. I never intended them to do low bass..
That said. Down to 100hz they are fast, tight, detailed and effortless. 2 5.5" do equal 11" but in my mind with more control then a 10". Im using them primarily as a 2 channel movie system.
All that said.. Yea.. I will have to build the woofer.. Just not right away...
I am using only the main module of the Anat speaker from YG. I have the woofers for the bottom section but I have chosen NOT to use them as I live in a apt and the extended bass would annoy my neighbors. I have swept the speaker and the freq response goes down to 100hz pretty flat which honestly is pretty good. Sure I wont be able to listen to rap or organ music and I might miss some of the deep boom from U571 depth charges, but I am happy with the response.
SURE I would love to do the woofers. BUT 2 things stop me. 1, the neighbor compalints. 2. The effort. To make the box for the woofers would make me crazy as I would want to make them as stiff as metal, this would require who knows how much bracing. Its a insane amount of work.
These are kinda bigger bookshelf speakers, not full range 20-20k. I never intended them to do low bass..
That said. Down to 100hz they are fast, tight, detailed and effortless. 2 5.5" do equal 11" but in my mind with more control then a 10". Im using them primarily as a 2 channel movie system.
All that said.. Yea.. I will have to build the woofer.. Just not right away...
An Interview with Yoav Geva of YG Acoustics - The Columns - Dagogo
There are some Yoav Geva design insights in this interview.
There are some Yoav Geva design insights in this interview.
Interesting article. Of course putting these drivers and crossover into a MDF cabinet really is a long way from Aluminum.
This article did answer one of my pressing questions. Why there was nothing behind the mid-woof but metal. QL, Airflow. Im glad I did not put anything in there and kept the exact dimensions with no obstructions or bracing in that area.
I think the crossover is a very key part of his design. As I mentioned before, its not normal. The part quality is really good and it seems to be a complex design. I think a lot of magic for these speakers is in the crossover..
The crossovers for the Sonja's and the passive bass module option for the Anat / Kipod's is amazing in its parts.
I attached pics of the mid-woof and tweeter crossovers. As I mentioned before they are separate boards and I feed them with separate amps.
This article did answer one of my pressing questions. Why there was nothing behind the mid-woof but metal. QL, Airflow. Im glad I did not put anything in there and kept the exact dimensions with no obstructions or bracing in that area.
I think the crossover is a very key part of his design. As I mentioned before, its not normal. The part quality is really good and it seems to be a complex design. I think a lot of magic for these speakers is in the crossover..
The crossovers for the Sonja's and the passive bass module option for the Anat / Kipod's is amazing in its parts.
I attached pics of the mid-woof and tweeter crossovers. As I mentioned before they are separate boards and I feed them with separate amps.
Attachments
Just a reminder that quality of bass and depth of bass do not necessarily equal loud overbearing bass.
There is an old saying (just made it up), if you can heard the subwoofer, you've done something wrong. Any lower bass, if done right, should be seamlessly blended into the rest of the system.
Can we assume the Bass Driver is from the single bass Studio version? Can you tell us how big the driver is (diameter - edge to edge)?
There are ways you can control the bass. Likely in a sealed cabinet, the bass roll off would start earlier and fade slower than a ported cabinet.
Even good basic 6" bookshelf speakers go down into the 40hz to 50hz range.
It's just a thought.
Steve/bluewizard
There is an old saying (just made it up), if you can heard the subwoofer, you've done something wrong. Any lower bass, if done right, should be seamlessly blended into the rest of the system.
Can we assume the Bass Driver is from the single bass Studio version? Can you tell us how big the driver is (diameter - edge to edge)?
There are ways you can control the bass. Likely in a sealed cabinet, the bass roll off would start earlier and fade slower than a ported cabinet.
Even good basic 6" bookshelf speakers go down into the 40hz to 50hz range.
It's just a thought.
Steve/bluewizard
Yes i think the xover is limiting the low freq response to 100hz. The roll off seems too sharp to be natural. Again, im really good with 100hz. My use is primarily movies. The woofers in a Anat Bass Studio are Scan Speak 26W/8861T01 Not sure what the T01 is, but the T00 is here http://www.scan-speak.dk/datasheet/pdf/26w-8861t00.pdf I have 5 of these. Yes I would love to implement some insane cabinet and use these, but at the moment im still wore out from constructing the current cabinets ! Not to mention that really low bass will penetrate the apartment walls even more then the 100hz does now. I grabbed one of these woofers to look up its model number,,, and I must say,, its a sexy beast. It does make me want to use it. My other issue would be I would need to power it, and that would make for tri-amping. I would need more channels of amp then I have now. I dont like the YG amp. They have now gone pure passive BTW. Yea too many issues for me to start on a bass module right away. I will save it for a fun project in the future.
Yea a quick check shows im down about 5db at 70hz. Below that its a cliff. This response is just great for my use. I also think using 2 5.5" gives faster, better control. But I know there is debate on that subject. Im very happy with the quality of the bass. Is it as good as a YG Sonja ? no of course not, Is it as good as a Wilson XLF, of course not, but its perfect for me and the price was right 
E.g: A reasonable 8, 10 or 12" driver can sound good beyond 1kHz, so with a 100Hz crossover the performance will be more similar than not.
The 8531k looks good and I used to own a pair of 8545k. Good clean performers but a little power hungry. They could be pushed quite hard without too much complaint but were very good at moderate levels working well in almost any enclosure, including horns.
Actually, no TWO 5.5 inch drivers do not equal an 11" driver. The rate of expansion of circles in not linear. So, as the diameter increases, the surface area massively increases. Think of it this way, there is more surface area in the outer 1" than in the inner 1".
A 5.5" circle has an area of 23.76 in².
An 11" circle has an area of 95.03 in².
So, it takes 3.9995, might as well say FOUR, 5.5" drivers to equal one 11" driver.
Two 5.5" drivers are actually equal to about one 8" bass driver which has a circular area of 50.27 in².
Just a little side note ... for what it is worth.
Steve/bluewizard
A update on my speaker project..
They came out great.
I filled them with a fine graded sand. I decided to do something kinda crazy. The compartment behind the tweeter is sealed off from everything else and I decided to just pour sand right in on the tweeter and fill that entire compartment. The tweeter is 100% sealed, so why not I figured. I could feel very small resonaces in mid rage on the back case of the tweeter, so I figured sand right on it would be good to dissapate those. Also the back of the metal tweeter focusing lens is also in direct contact with sand now too. This really removed resonance from the tweeter focusing lens.
The center compartment is perfect for putting sand in as its center of the speaker and can act on both mid-woofs.
I also put sand in the small compartments behind the main mid-woof compartments.
This added like 50 lbs to each speaker. They are now like handling a solid block of concrete - they are that heavy.
I also put sand in the speaker stands. The stands now are on tri-point very adjustable spikes. Using the adjustable spikes I was able to get them matched in all 3 dimensions to 1/16" in all planes to each other. Very precision alignment.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d5f6c_RZQJE
I used 200 lbs of sand total. The "bookshelf" speakers now weigh around 175lbs each with stands.
The cabinet again, 3/4 MDF, lots of cross bracing, 90 2" brass deck screws per speaker, lots of locktight paneling adhesive, every interior surface covered with Sonic Barrier Vinyl, Mid--woof drivers held in place with 1/4" allens with T-Nuts held in place with JB Weld, Tweeter held on metal acoustic lens with JB Weld. Wireworld Mini Eclipse 7 wire soldered to drivers with the crossover external to cabinet to keep it away from vibration. Bi-amping using a Proceed Amp-5 which I took apart and seriously modified and improved. I feed the proceed from a Oppo BDP-83 2-ch output via 3/4M Wireworld Silver Eclispe 7 Y cables. No preamp. Its all very short wire runs. My main use is BluRay movies, but music works well too. The Oppo has a volume control.
The result from the sand was awesome. Focused imaging, tightened bass, made the upper octaves more natural. I gained detail, resolution and precision. Sand really is a miracle material. Knocking on the cabinet is now like knocking on stone.
A vid from 2 weeks back after i finished the first one. Its on the stand. You can see the spaces in the back where I put sand. You can also see the huge mess I created making these !
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-WaFt1_JkeM
A better view inside the cabinet where the sand went behind the tweeter.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fBPjov3LWb8
Still left to do. My bass rolls off a little early for a number of reasons. I would like to gain about 3 db at 50hz with about a 3-6db/oct slope. The crossover is too perfect to fool with so im going to do this with a line level active filter on the mid-woof amp sections. The speaker is great to like 80hz tho. A line level boost tho will need to be VERY good. I need super good quality. I will have to look at what op-amp or transistor gain stage I want to use. Gotta use metal foil resistors and really good caps.
At some point in the future I might use the scanspeak 26W/8861T01 drivers I have to make a woofer section for these. Its just a huge project and I will need more amp channels as I would tri-amp. The cabinet for the woofs would have to be extreme and man im not looking forward to building that.. Or maybe I am
They came out great.
I filled them with a fine graded sand. I decided to do something kinda crazy. The compartment behind the tweeter is sealed off from everything else and I decided to just pour sand right in on the tweeter and fill that entire compartment. The tweeter is 100% sealed, so why not I figured. I could feel very small resonaces in mid rage on the back case of the tweeter, so I figured sand right on it would be good to dissapate those. Also the back of the metal tweeter focusing lens is also in direct contact with sand now too. This really removed resonance from the tweeter focusing lens.
The center compartment is perfect for putting sand in as its center of the speaker and can act on both mid-woofs.
I also put sand in the small compartments behind the main mid-woof compartments.
This added like 50 lbs to each speaker. They are now like handling a solid block of concrete - they are that heavy.
I also put sand in the speaker stands. The stands now are on tri-point very adjustable spikes. Using the adjustable spikes I was able to get them matched in all 3 dimensions to 1/16" in all planes to each other. Very precision alignment.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d5f6c_RZQJE
I used 200 lbs of sand total. The "bookshelf" speakers now weigh around 175lbs each with stands.
The cabinet again, 3/4 MDF, lots of cross bracing, 90 2" brass deck screws per speaker, lots of locktight paneling adhesive, every interior surface covered with Sonic Barrier Vinyl, Mid--woof drivers held in place with 1/4" allens with T-Nuts held in place with JB Weld, Tweeter held on metal acoustic lens with JB Weld. Wireworld Mini Eclipse 7 wire soldered to drivers with the crossover external to cabinet to keep it away from vibration. Bi-amping using a Proceed Amp-5 which I took apart and seriously modified and improved. I feed the proceed from a Oppo BDP-83 2-ch output via 3/4M Wireworld Silver Eclispe 7 Y cables. No preamp. Its all very short wire runs. My main use is BluRay movies, but music works well too. The Oppo has a volume control.
The result from the sand was awesome. Focused imaging, tightened bass, made the upper octaves more natural. I gained detail, resolution and precision. Sand really is a miracle material. Knocking on the cabinet is now like knocking on stone.
A vid from 2 weeks back after i finished the first one. Its on the stand. You can see the spaces in the back where I put sand. You can also see the huge mess I created making these !
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-WaFt1_JkeM
A better view inside the cabinet where the sand went behind the tweeter.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fBPjov3LWb8
Still left to do. My bass rolls off a little early for a number of reasons. I would like to gain about 3 db at 50hz with about a 3-6db/oct slope. The crossover is too perfect to fool with so im going to do this with a line level active filter on the mid-woof amp sections. The speaker is great to like 80hz tho. A line level boost tho will need to be VERY good. I need super good quality. I will have to look at what op-amp or transistor gain stage I want to use. Gotta use metal foil resistors and really good caps.
At some point in the future I might use the scanspeak 26W/8861T01 drivers I have to make a woofer section for these. Its just a huge project and I will need more amp channels as I would tri-amp. The cabinet for the woofs would have to be extreme and man im not looking forward to building that.. Or maybe I am
I had someone wanting to copy what i did. He needed dimensions for the cabinet.
I used AutoCAD to do it. I am posting a link to the PDF for this cad design. Whats NOT in the CAD is how I recessed the woofers into the front by routering away enough for them to go in flush.
I mever intended this to be something someone else does. The xover for the tweeter assumes the use of the tweeter metal focusing lens so if you make this without the lens I dont know how it will sound. Also I filled all the back cavities with sand, you will need to do that. I used Wireworld mini Eclispe 7 wire. The crossover is external to the speaker.
I used the YG tweeter lens which is a big hunk of metal. So if you use something else you will need to figure that out..
If you used a smaller diameter tweeter assembly then I would move the mid-woofs closer to the tweeter which would cause redesign of the box.
THIS SPEAKER HAS LITTLE RESPONSE BELOW 100hz. So you should add a woofer module. I did not want/need this as I am in a apt and did not want the low bass. I do not have the specs for a passive crossover for this bass module. The YG used a ScanSpeak 26W/8861T01
PDF
If you want to tweak the design and you have AutoCAD below is the DWG file
Right Click Save As AutoCAD DWG
I used AutoCAD to do it. I am posting a link to the PDF for this cad design. Whats NOT in the CAD is how I recessed the woofers into the front by routering away enough for them to go in flush.
I mever intended this to be something someone else does. The xover for the tweeter assumes the use of the tweeter metal focusing lens so if you make this without the lens I dont know how it will sound. Also I filled all the back cavities with sand, you will need to do that. I used Wireworld mini Eclispe 7 wire. The crossover is external to the speaker.
I used the YG tweeter lens which is a big hunk of metal. So if you use something else you will need to figure that out..
If you used a smaller diameter tweeter assembly then I would move the mid-woofs closer to the tweeter which would cause redesign of the box.
THIS SPEAKER HAS LITTLE RESPONSE BELOW 100hz. So you should add a woofer module. I did not want/need this as I am in a apt and did not want the low bass. I do not have the specs for a passive crossover for this bass module. The YG used a ScanSpeak 26W/8861T01
If you want to tweak the design and you have AutoCAD below is the DWG file
Right Click Save As AutoCAD DWG
xymox1, I also have a full set of drivers from an anat II, including the bass modules. I have subwoofer amplifiers which I lifted from some high-end subs to run the bass section, and obviously I have the original mid/trebble crossovers.
Just wondering how you got hold of the original yg tweeter lens, as I don't have them!
Just wondering how you got hold of the original yg tweeter lens, as I don't have them!
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