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Old 20th February 2002, 01:39 PM   #21
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Mazz,

I wouldn't like to answer your question for anyone else, so here is my take on the subject. All things being equal, and I know they're not, high efficiency speakers have the following advantages.

Speakers.
- lower harmonic, IMD and FM distortion. This all relates to the fact that any given motor assembly is only linear over a certain percentage of it's range. Therefore, for a given volume level the HE speaker will be moving it's diaphram less. It will also sound 'faster', ie more accurately able to track fine dynamic graduations, for the same reason. Swing your hand backwards and forwards quickly for 1' and 1" for an illustration.
- less dynamic compression. As an example, take two speakers rated at 100Wrms, with sensitivities of 85dB and 100dB. The LE speaker will be constantly be working harder to produce the same volume level as the HE speaker, by a factor of 15dB. On large orchestral creshendos, or music with a lot of low frequency energy the LE speaker will quickly run out of headroom and compress the waveform, simply because it running nearer the thermal limits of the driver. Peaks of 12dB (average to peak) are the minumum I would expect to encounter on any reasonable source material. Better to excellent sources can have substantially more. Real live acoustic music can have dynamic graduations of 60dB, so if you want to reproduce as accurately as possible live music, your speakers need to be able to do the same, or as much of the range as is possible. HE speakers have the advantage again.
- T/S parameters vary with signal level and heat, so bass tuning will vary too, and complicate things even more.

Amplifiers.
- it is much easier, simpler and cheaper to make a high quality (linear) low powered amp than a larger one, so to still be able to reproduce realistic peak levels, you can have a lower powered amp with HE speakers.
Note: I mean this to apply to both tube and ss topologies. I personally am not a fan of parallelling devices to increase power. there is usually too much variation in operational dynamic characteristics between individual devices to work correctly. Some lower level information is always lost IME. As always, feel free to have a different view.


After hearing high efficiency speakers, the sense of ease with which they can play the music is relaxing and invigorating at the same time, and much closer to what you hear live. I would not go back to low efficiency distortion generators again. I'd rather listen to my STAX 'phones.

My new speakers will be approx 105dB/W/m, 40Hz to 22kHz, with the 250Hz+ region actually 10dB higher and padded down to match the bass. At 'normal' listening levels, say 80-85dB average, I easily have 40dB+ of headroom in the speakers, and they are loafing along operating as linearly as possible, so giving very, very low distortion at all sensible volumes and peaks. My amplifier for the region 90Hz and up will be low powered <10W and will spend most of it's time operating in it's most linear range, producing mere milliwatts, again giving very low distortion.

Hope that helps.
Cheers
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Old 20th February 2002, 04:21 PM   #22
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Hi,

I remembered that a big Italian 'guru' (*) made a high efficiency speaker (named 'Apocalypse Now'!) using a Stage Accompany ribbon. He is enthousiast about it, and he is not easy to fall in love with a component.

The driver specs looks terrific, I fear the price will be high too...

http://www.stageaccompany.com/cdload.html



(*) Bartolomeo Aloia: one may disagree with his ideas but surely respect them and learn a lot from his work. For instance he designed the sole tube preamp in the world with no caps on the signal path.

Have a look at his 'project for diy'ers', including the apocalypse, here:
http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/8231/ba/

It is an unofficial page, apparently Bart does not like the Net!
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Old 21st February 2002, 09:14 AM   #23
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Hi there...

Many thanks to all of you! This was (/is) my first post on this forum, and let's just say I will stay here!

Brett:
Woaw! Nice analogeties and describing why and how, and in some sence because!

Sandro:
Thank's!


My latest idea...is to try the Lowhter drivers! Thier top of the line units produce som 98dB and are REALLY nice load! If the upper freq range sucks (which was the case with the only wide-band-driver I have listened to) I can alway add an Raven R1 or R3...should be possible to use 1'st order XO if I XO @ lets say 10kHz..well...


Once again
THANK'S
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Old 21st February 2002, 09:48 AM   #24
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Default More info

Quote:
Originally posted by Brett
My new speakers will be approx 105dB/W/m, 40Hz to 22kHz, with the 250Hz+ region actually 10dB higher and padded down to match the bass.... My amplifier for the region 90Hz and up will be low powered <10W
Tell us more.

dave
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Old 21st February 2002, 09:51 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally posted by sandro
Stage Accompany ribbon ... The driver specs looks terrific, I fear the price will be high too...
These are very nice looking units, very well built. And tuff. And heavy -- less expensive than a set of Raven R3s.

dave
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Old 21st February 2002, 12:41 PM   #26
JohnR is offline JohnR  Australia
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Quote:
Therefore, for a given volume level the HE speaker will be moving it's diaphram less
This seems to be a common misconception... All other things being equal (*), a high efficiency driver will move exactly the same distance to produce a given SPL.

(*) ie direct radiator, same effective area, same radiation pattern
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Old 21st February 2002, 02:37 PM   #27
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Default D'oh

JohnR,

Thanks, you are absolutely correct. Volume displacement determines the SPL, so for a given driver size displacement will be the same irrespective of efficiency.
In future I will proofread all my posts so such misinformation does not get through, and I'll not try to type out posts whilst having heated discussions on the phone (about the same subject no less!) to improve coherence.

Cheers
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Old 22nd February 2002, 04:41 PM   #28
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Default 48 STAGE ACCOMPANY RIBBON TWEETER...

Stage Accompany ribbon ... The driver specs looks terrific, I fear the price will be high too...


CUT

These are very nice looking units, very well built. And tuff. And heavy -- less expensive than a set of RavenR3s.

dave

And this is a pro system made by some friends,
there are three Stage Accompany mounted in every box, and they are 16 per channel ;-)

ciao
Filippo
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Old 30th April 2002, 02:11 AM   #29
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take a look at the 1" concave alluminum tweeter by human.mated with a 6 1/2 " midbass by focal.95db a shot good luck
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