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Old 9th February 2013, 01:14 PM   #71
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Originally Posted by tinitus View Post
just half an hour of what you suggest
You probably don't listen to what he suggests. Care to share measurements of the "joyless" configuration you're talking about?
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Old 9th February 2013, 02:14 PM   #72
tinitus is offline tinitus  Europe
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markus76 View Post
You probably don't listen to what he suggests.
maybe it was the opposite
I would be happy with that

Quote:
Originally Posted by markus76 View Post
Care to share measurements of the "joyless" configuration you're talking about?
configuration ?
I never mentioned anything about any 'configuration'

only referring to what happens to your hearing when bombarded with high SPL
or maybe its just my ears that get hurt by high SPL
but my personal ears or 'configuration' was not meant to be the focus of my post

like said, SPL is not the sole point of a subwoofer, even if most go along that route
occationally we have members asking for a musical subwoofer, in high hopes that....but whatever
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Old 9th February 2013, 02:23 PM   #73
DrDyna is offline DrDyna  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tinitus View Post
do you know many hours I listen to music, every day

just half an hour of what you suggest, and my listening joy is gone for the rest of the day

but thats got nothing to do with ' subwoofer or not'
I'm not suggesting you have to do anything special, just put on a track like Go(d)t and put the volume up to a pleasant level (somewhere in the 80db range would be fine), when that gigantic low bass thump starts happening, midbass drivers that are allowed to receive bass that they can't reproduce are still going to be jumping out of their coil gaps.

Try eeet.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...-El5VxY#t=250s
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Last edited by DrDyna; 9th February 2013 at 02:25 PM.
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Old 9th February 2013, 02:27 PM   #74
tinitus is offline tinitus  Europe
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I don't know what kind of music does that

but if I actually had that record, I doubt it would matter enough for me to build a special speaker just for that
cheaper and easier to give that record away ... maybe safer too, from what you say

like said, I do have classical music that could do similar to what you say, but I put it on so rarely, I don't think its important enough
but if I really played big orchestral classical symphonic music all day long, I might think twice about

maybe its just a matter of priorities...and available cash
I don't buy my own air jet just because I go on holliday once a year
but I might consider it if I had the money
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Old 9th February 2013, 02:34 PM   #75
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Originally Posted by tinitus View Post
maybe it was the opposite
I would be happy with that



configuration ?
I never mentioned anything about any 'configuration'

only referring to what happens to your hearing when bombarded with high SPL
"Bombarded"? I don't think this was the point. Our hearing becomes increasingly insensitive towards lower frequencies. Here's the detection threshold for low frequencies:

Click the image to open in full size.

(From Watanabe/Moeller, "Low Frequency Hearing Thresholds in Pressure Field and in Free Field")

Physics prevents smallish woofers from delivering distortion free sound pressure levels.
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Old 9th February 2013, 02:42 PM   #76
DrDyna is offline DrDyna  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tinitus View Post
I don't know what kind of music does that

but if I actually had that record, I doubt it would matter enough for me to build a special speaker just for that
cheaper and easier to give that record away ... maybe safer too, from what you say
Haha, maybe. I've got probably a couple dozen albums in my collection that you'd be missing half of without a good solid arrangement of powerful subs. Everything from jazz to cutting-edge electronica. Live stuff too. If I was at a concert and they let off pyrotechnics, I'd feel it in my chest...and I like chasing that feeling when playing back recordings. Even some stuff you don't even know is there until you hear it and you're like..."wow, where was that note before?" Even at low volumes, I get a lot of enjoyment out of the emotion and visceral feelings that come along with low bass, especially if it's clean and effortless.

I've never been able to get that from just a pair of speakers that are positioned for imaging.

It might not be for everyone.
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Old 9th February 2013, 02:45 PM   #77
tinitus is offline tinitus  Europe
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Originally Posted by markus76 View Post
Physics prevents smallish woofers from delivering distortion free sound pressure levels.
I didn't know my speaker were small
or else I have my bass guitar rig
could put my house flat on the ground
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Old 9th February 2013, 02:52 PM   #78
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Originally Posted by tinitus View Post
I didn't know my speaker were small
or else I have my bass guitar rig
could put my house flat on the ground
I was talking about your speakers? Where and why would I? I don't know them.
I'm gettig frustrated discussing the topic with you. Is there any non-subjective argument you could make against the necessity of subwoofers in music reproduction?
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Old 9th February 2013, 05:01 PM   #79
tinitus is offline tinitus  Europe
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Originally Posted by markus76 View Post
I was talking about your speakers?
3way DIY, 19mm Vifa tweeter, 5" mid Focal mid, 12" Mivoc woofer ...distorts like hell nah, they are ok
no, they are not built to play loud, but neither are my ears, or brain
so what, dont blame my speakers
but if you blame my ears, I won't deny it, no sir

but you ask me to come up with a non-subjective argument against subs, and preferably one measured
how about the money issue that I can measure and prove

yeah, sure, I would like to have a sub, or two, or how many it takes...but not because I need it, or want to play any louder
I have nothing against subs at all, why should I
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Old 9th February 2013, 05:12 PM   #80
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Originally Posted by tinitus View Post
how about the money issue that I can measure...and prove
What does that have to do with it? ... if you can't swing for the extra drivers, etc ... OK ... that alone doesn't make the idea of the sub for music flawed.
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