Go Back   Home > Forums > Loudspeakers > Multi-Way

Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

Please consider donating to help us continue to serve you.

Ads on/off / Custom Title / More PMs / More album space / Advanced printing & mass image saving
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 15th February 2013, 09:25 AM   #291
Juhazi is offline Juhazi  Finland
diyAudio Member
 
Juhazi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Jyväskylä
I must continue...
The adio system we are suing, most of of the speakers should be producing frequencies below our signal with minimal distorsion! Earl Geddes speaks strongly for this and I agree.

In principle bass reflex or other physically band-limited speakers are no-no! IB or huge closed woofers for the lowest bass for me, thank you! I am sorry to say that my present equipment does not fulfill my new criteria, but I have started a journey...
__________________
AES Associate Member / My DIY speaker history: -74 Philips 3-way, -82 Hifi 85B, -07 Zaph L18, XLS10+PR/Hypex, -08 CSS125FR, -08 Hifitalo AW-7, -08 TangBand FR, -09 MarkK ER18DXT, -13 PPSL470, -13 AINOgradient
  Reply With Quote
Old 15th February 2013, 09:56 AM   #292
Banned
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Switzerland
Quote:
Originally Posted by Juhazi View Post
When listening to music I get the best "sound" if the source material is high-passed / doesn't contain <30Hz at all. I might be missing something but I also avoid a lot of problems!
This is simply a sign that your speaker-room system isn't correctly set up. I agree that it's probably better to not reproduce very low frequencies if secondary priorities prevent setting up a decent listening room but please don't call this HiFi.
  Reply With Quote
Old 15th February 2013, 10:01 AM   #293
tinitus is offline tinitus  Europe
diyAudio Moderator
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Quote:
Originally Posted by Juhazi View Post
.... speakers should be producing frequencies below our signal
nothing new, thats how it have always been

Quote:
Originally Posted by Juhazi View Post
In principle bass reflex or other physically band-limited speakers are no-no!
maybe, maybe not
new knowledge and technology might have changed that 'issue'

Quote:
Originally Posted by Juhazi View Post
IB or huge closed woofers for the lowest bass for me, thank you!

I am sorry to say that my present equipment does not fulfill my new criteria, but I have started a journey...
I might say +1 to that.....but how can you know....
but now you mention IB
they were really hot a few years ago
but barely even mentioned these days

personally, I try to stay 'open minded', and be less categorical or 'bandlimited'

man, at times it almost sounds like there is some kind patent on low bass, and as if noone else have given it any thought at all
  Reply With Quote
Old 15th February 2013, 10:52 AM   #294
Juhazi is offline Juhazi  Finland
diyAudio Member
 
Juhazi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Jyväskylä
Guys, doesn't this discussion emphasize the undisclosed "bass in a room" problem?

Will there ever be a final solution? I doubt that. There are infinite number of rooms/listening environments and personal preferences.

What is my present "ideology and solution" is just that My present. I do not advice anybody to copy it but aren't we discussing the topic here?

Many people here have a professional level of education and experience of audio - I don't. I am just a hobbyist, but because of my academic education and general curiosity, I tend to think and process information in a systematical way: theory/measured data/analysis/conclusions. Then there might be some practical procedures. But I am also a bit crazy, because this is just a hobby - Sometimes I try something radical that doesn't suit my paradigm.
__________________
AES Associate Member / My DIY speaker history: -74 Philips 3-way, -82 Hifi 85B, -07 Zaph L18, XLS10+PR/Hypex, -08 CSS125FR, -08 Hifitalo AW-7, -08 TangBand FR, -09 MarkK ER18DXT, -13 PPSL470, -13 AINOgradient
  Reply With Quote
Old 15th February 2013, 11:03 AM   #295
tinitus is offline tinitus  Europe
diyAudio Moderator
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Quote:
Originally Posted by Juhazi View Post
But I am also a bit crazy, because this is just a hobby - Sometimes I try something radical that doesn't suit my paradigm.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Juhazi View Post
.... huge closed woofers for the lowest bass
.... a journey...
sounds perfect to me...and not crazy at all only problem is to find the right woofer would like to try a big mono sub with a Mach5 woofer
  Reply With Quote
Old 15th February 2013, 11:20 AM   #296
Banned
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Switzerland
It's a logical fallacy to think of sound reproduction as being subject to personal preference. Music production (creation) is, music reproduction is not.
Is there anybody seriously discussing that a TV or projection screen is subject to personal preference when it comes to calibration? There is exactly one way to get high fidelity. It's the same with audio reproduction. There's only one way to true HiFi.

The problem we're facing in music reproduction is the lack of proper standards which makes it virtually impossible to get calibration right because now there's a multitude of calibration targets. But make no mistake, there's only one way to do it right (for each recording).

Now does this allow for personal preference? Yes it does but don't conflate HiFi with personal preference ("I wish the guitar on Sgt. Pepper's would sound like what I have in mind.").
  Reply With Quote
Old 15th February 2013, 11:58 AM   #297
tinitus is offline tinitus  Europe
diyAudio Moderator
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
oh, it will be there, one day
maybe sooner than you expect
just plug it in, and we all hear the same

basicly you don't even know the potential of the latest digital technology yet
I think its based on the known voice and tune machines , combined with new search engines, etc etc
computer software is very close to become intelligent
it will an excellent and perfect room eq

basicly its a bit like the old days turntable speed control
but now it can pick single tunes or instrument, and change only them
some of the same technology might have been used to convert black and white movies to color
way more advanced than the way you do eq now, wheer you still change the whole part of a certain frequency
tomorrow you will be able to change just one instrument playing that frequency, without effecting any other instruments
and I think its also able to recreate what have been lost or removed, and restore to original condition
so its pretty advanced recording studio technology right now, but will be simpler tomorrow

personally, I sure hope there will still be some room for other stuff, like building tube amps etc ... but being realistic, I doubt it
  Reply With Quote
Old 15th February 2013, 12:13 PM   #298
DrDyna is offline DrDyna  United States
diyAudio Member
 
DrDyna's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Blog Entries: 3
Quote:
Originally Posted by murillollirum View Post
I think this post is going to a totally different direction, the question is not: what is the lowest frequency we need for playing music in general? the question is simple: SUBWOOFERS, ARE THEY REALLY NECESSARY FOR HOME AUDIO?
Lets make it simple:

1) Yes.
2) No. only for movies
3) it depends... of what music you like
4) No. If your main speakers go low as 20Hz
5) No. If your main speakers go low as 30Hz
6) No. Because I don;t like deep bass.
7) Prefer to not answer.
This seems to be pretty much what's going on. 2. I would consider wrong because it doesn't offer any type of qualification. 4 and 5 should be considered wrong as well because no main speaker will do that, unless we use 3 or 4 of them and position them around the room ala Geddes, which is imagine would make for a miserable experience as far as everything else in the spectrum.

Really, only 1, 3 and 6 are the only logical answers that don't require a person to make some type of patently false claim about their subjective listening or musical style preference being the only thing that should be considered.

With they types of music I listen to...everything from classical and jazz to heavy metal and hard dub step and electronics, not having proper powerful bass robs me of half the enjoyment I get out of a system.

I do occasionally listen to music sitting up here in the living room where I have a pair of medium sized speakers that can hit the high 30s, but if I really want to appreciate most music, I visit the media room downstairs and flick on the 18hz TH subs. I wouldn't trade em for anything and I'd suggest anyone interested in music that goes beyond chamber music and George Winston played at dinner levels to try it once in your life.
__________________
"We may have to blast.." -Doc Brown
  Reply With Quote
Old 15th February 2013, 01:55 PM   #299
Juhazi is offline Juhazi  Finland
diyAudio Member
 
Juhazi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Jyväskylä
My journey to better bass started in november 2012. I have linked my project thread earlier, but a brief presentation here:

A slot-loaded 2x15" 470L closed sub
- room 2,7x3,6x2,6m plus a little more, area 10,2m2. low RT30s
- home theater set, main speakers are 6,5" SEAS coaxials in closed boxes
- new project is 15" Dayton DCS380-4 driver in 235L box, a pair set as PPSL configuration

I have been waiting for the drivers for 9 weeks now...

I have figured that this is as far as I can go in my room. I am sort of curious to hear this finally...
Attached Images
File Type: png ppsl 518 2xDayton 15 complete.png (17.0 KB, 60 views)
File Type: png hornresp ppsl470 spl.png (52.9 KB, 59 views)
__________________
AES Associate Member / My DIY speaker history: -74 Philips 3-way, -82 Hifi 85B, -07 Zaph L18, XLS10+PR/Hypex, -08 CSS125FR, -08 Hifitalo AW-7, -08 TangBand FR, -09 MarkK ER18DXT, -13 PPSL470, -13 AINOgradient

Last edited by Juhazi; 15th February 2013 at 02:03 PM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 15th February 2013, 02:13 PM   #300
Banned
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Switzerland
Single subwoofer is in most cases not a good idea if it's not in the near field.
  Reply With Quote

Reply


Hide this!Advertise here!
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
I have 2 Boston G5 Car Audio Subwoofers (sound quality type) For home use? ta_nhra02 Subwoofers 5 20th January 2010 05:20 AM
Questions for DIY home Subwoofers SunnYii Subwoofers 10 23rd May 2007 11:26 PM
Jack Hammer subwoofers for High-end home audio? cemmany Multi-Way 16 5th April 2006 11:15 AM
Autosound subwoofers in a Home Theater environment The Paulinator Multi-Way 1 27th June 2003 03:44 AM
Home cinema front speakers/subwoofers mcai7et2 Multi-Way 0 31st January 2003 10:53 AM


New To Site? Need Help?

All times are GMT. The time now is 07:04 AM.


vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2014 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright ©1999-2014 diyAudio

Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.3.2