Routering help needed: collet grip / bit slip - Page 2

dstmbgh · 21st January 2013, 12:43 AM

Thanks to all of you for taking the time to help with your advice. The router in question is mounted upside down in a homemade router table with downdraft dust control. The setup is working great for dust control, but it also pummels the collet with mdf dust. Besides tightening the collet more, I've not yet tried to remedy the situation, as I wanted to get some advice first.

I will implement the suggestions above. Thank you for your help. I may be back for more help depending on what I encounter.

David

Andrew Eckhardt · 21st January 2013, 01:07 AM

There were some Craftsman routers made where the collet is machined into the end of the motor shaft and not replaceable. Unfortunately that doesn't work so well compared to a collet that's slit from both ends. What works okay for large machine tools doesn't work so well when the slits are only a half inch long. When you tighten the nut force is applied to the bit from the end of the collet over a comparatively small area. Particularly when using solid carbide bits with very high shaft hardness there just isn't enough grip. Cleaning the collet well can help. If you have one of these routers and decide to lube anything (after good cleaning, otherwise forget it) it's probably best to use very light oil, soon subject to complete evaporation might not be too bad (like WD 40), and put it, lightly, on the nut only. That might get you by for loading one cutter, and unless you load a carbon shafted cutter next, you'll probably have to do it all over again. These were not good routers.

tvrgeek · 21st January 2013, 01:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ODougbo

The dust can collect inside the arbor - it can get very deep.

The old Sears routers fall apart pretty fast

Mine is about 30 years old and works as well as new. Of course, that's why I bought the Rigid.

Three votes for lube on the threads. I had a problem with the Sears router where it would slip the adjustment in the base. A bit of lube on the bolt of the clamp and wa-la. Now I it gets correct clamping force with just thumb supplied torque.

Anti seize is a good choice for lube in this use. It is non-galling and handles force well. A TINY amount will do. TINY. Did I mention you need only a tiny bit?

prairieboy · 21st January 2013, 02:29 AM

Hate to be a grump, but routing 3/4" mdf with a 1/4" bit is, well, scary (or really slow). I know people do it, but years ago I had a bit snap off when edge routing and was fortunate it didn't hit me. I truly believe that for efficiency, and safety, a 1/2" router is really the only way to go.

phivates · 21st January 2013, 02:52 AM

1 get a real router
2 don't use wd-40 for anything except fragrance
3 don't insert the cutter to the bottom of the collet. That impedes tightening
4 get a real router

jackinnj · 21st January 2013, 02:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phivates

2 don't use wd-40 for anything except fragrance

WD-40 is a fish oil derivative.

ODougbo · 08:10 AM

I have a old Sears, the lever for the lock broke (I might had one before this also). I never could find a way to lock up the Arbor to tighten.
Sears is really goods about small parts, maybe go spend a few $$ on a new collet, couldn't hurt.

WD is good for a few things:
Starting 2 stoke engines (weed wackes, etc.)
Bike chains
Cleaning parts
Shooting potatoes (propane gas for propellent)

puppet · 21st January 2013, 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prairieboy

Hate to be a grump, but routing 3/4" mdf with a 1/4" bit is, well, scary (or really slow). I know people do it, but years ago I had a bit snap off when edge routing and was fortunate it didn't hit me. I truly believe that for efficiency, and safety, a 1/2" router is really the only way to go.

I'd put aside some cash for a 1/2" collet router too if I were the OP ... especially for table duty. Bearings on that 1/4" Sears will be going next.

ODougbo · 21st January 2013, 04:02 PM

btw, found a spanner wrench that fit the collet (?????) it fits perfectly, but since it fits over the collet - 7/8" is biggest cutter that I could use.

Always good to have 1/2" router and a smaller 1/4" on hand, for trimming, 45 and round overs bits.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ODougbo

I have a old Sears, the lever for the lock broke (I might had one before this also). I never could find a way to lock up the Arbor to tighten.
Sears is really goods about small parts, maybe go spend a few $$ on a new collet, couldn't hurt.

WD is good for a few things:
Starting 2 stoke engines (weed wackes, etc.)
Bike chains
Cleaning parts
Shooting potatoes (propane gas for propellent)

dstmbgh · 22nd January 2013, 03:39 AM

Okay, so...tonight before I began working I cleaned the inside of the collet well with some emery cloth and mineral spirits, being sure any residue was wiped clean afterwards. I also cleaned the threads, both on the collet and the collet nut. Per one poster who said that his Craftsman router like mine required that he make sure the bit was seated all the way in the collet otherwise it would slip (contrary to general practice), I tried this, tightening the collet nut as much as was possible (remember, my router does not have a double nut tightening setup). I also made sure the bit shaft was clean. Proceeding only 1/8" at a time, I completed all driver cutout holes with no problems with the bit slipping.

Previously the bit slipped mostly with oak veneered plywood and with cuts in excess of 1/8". Maybe it still would under those conditions, but that's neither here nor there, as I won't do that again. The good news is I am making progress now without problems.

Thanks for all your help, guys.

David

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21st January 2013, 12:43 AM	#11
dstmbgh diyAudio Member Join Date: Sep 2011	Thanks to all of you for taking the time to help with your advice. The router in question is mounted upside down in a homemade router table with downdraft dust control. The setup is working great for dust control, but it also pummels the collet with mdf dust. Besides tightening the collet more, I've not yet tried to remedy the situation, as I wanted to get some advice first. I will implement the suggestions above. Thank you for your help. I may be back for more help depending on what I encounter. David

21st January 2013, 01:07 AM	#12
Andrew Eckhardt diyAudio Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: PA	There were some Craftsman routers made where the collet is machined into the end of the motor shaft and not replaceable. Unfortunately that doesn't work so well compared to a collet that's slit from both ends. What works okay for large machine tools doesn't work so well when the slits are only a half inch long. When you tighten the nut force is applied to the bit from the end of the collet over a comparatively small area. Particularly when using solid carbide bits with very high shaft hardness there just isn't enough grip. Cleaning the collet well can help. If you have one of these routers and decide to lube anything (after good cleaning, otherwise forget it) it's probably best to use very light oil, soon subject to complete evaporation might not be too bad (like WD 40), and put it, lightly, on the nut only. That might get you by for loading one cutter, and unless you load a carbon shafted cutter next, you'll probably have to do it all over again. These were not good routers.

21st January 2013, 02:29 AM	#14
prairieboy diyAudio Member Join Date: Nov 2010	Hate to be a grump, but routing 3/4" mdf with a 1/4" bit is, well, scary (or really slow). I know people do it, but years ago I had a bit snap off when edge routing and was fortunate it didn't hit me. I truly believe that for efficiency, and safety, a 1/2" router is really the only way to go.

21st January 2013, 02:52 AM	#15
phivates diyAudio Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Willamette Valley	1 get a real router 2 don't use wd-40 for anything except fragrance 3 don't insert the cutter to the bottom of the collet. That impedes tightening 4 get a real router

22nd January 2013, 03:39 AM	#20
dstmbgh diyAudio Member Join Date: Sep 2011	Okay, so...tonight before I began working I cleaned the inside of the collet well with some emery cloth and mineral spirits, being sure any residue was wiped clean afterwards. I also cleaned the threads, both on the collet and the collet nut. Per one poster who said that his Craftsman router like mine required that he make sure the bit was seated all the way in the collet otherwise it would slip (contrary to general practice), I tried this, tightening the collet nut as much as was possible (remember, my router does not have a double nut tightening setup). I also made sure the bit shaft was clean. Proceeding only 1/8" at a time, I completed all driver cutout holes with no problems with the bit slipping. Previously the bit slipped mostly with oak veneered plywood and with cuts in excess of 1/8". Maybe it still would under those conditions, but that's neither here nor there, as I won't do that again. The good news is I am making progress now without problems. Thanks for all your help, guys. David