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theaudiophile 10th December 2012 10:45 AM

how to...
 
I want to know how to make a multi way speaker do the following if possible, and an explanation of how:
  1. 1.) increase the perceived depth of the stereo image even greater than what is already contained on a recording.
  2. 2.) greater stereo image height
  3. 3.) make it sound very pleasing and appealing but not in an obvious way. So adding midrange warmth will be too obvious in the long term. I have a feeling that most high end speakers do this because how often do you go to a concert and remark on the imaging or clarity or warmth? These characteristics are very much limited to speakers, not real live musical instruments.

bjorno 10th December 2012 11:31 AM

Hi,
:2c:

*1: Add 2 (mono-summed works well too)) >= 42 mS(15m) signal delayed Bessel arrays= Best as phase is slightly 'scrambled, 5-6 element arrays= good enough) visually in a straight line behind(or use a wider azimuth) the main speakers(or simpler DBA:s) wall mounted adjusted to a level near JND, i.e. at or bit higher depending on source material. FR slope = 'Pink' ~3 dB/octave: BW~60-800Hz.

*2: W-W--MM-- T-T-T-T-T--MM W--W Floor to ceiling length, W XO'd over 250 Hz, T-T-T-T-T Bessel or Bessel arrays in 'Edeko' configuration.

*3: No comment as at this Q.='imaging or clarity or warmth?' are here bunched together and would take a lot of thread space to tear apart.:(

b:)

theaudiophile 10th December 2012 12:05 PM

I dont understand any of that. Too much technical jargon not enough explanation.

theaudiophile 10th December 2012 12:07 PM

Or is it possible then to take any given speaker and apply signal processing to an audio file to increase or decrease the depth. Is such a device available?

Depth is usually created by a combination of echoes and EQ.

a_tewinkel 10th December 2012 12:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theaudiophile (Post 3278552)
  1. 1.) increase the perceived depth of the stereo image even greater than what is already contained on a recording.
  2. 2.) greater stereo image height
  3. 3.) make it sound very pleasing and appealing but not in an obvious way. So adding midrange warmth will be too obvious in the long term. I have a feeling that most high end speakers do this because how often do you go to a concert and remark on the imaging or clarity or warmth? These characteristics are very much limited to speakers, not real live musical instruments.

For greater distance/depth perception a low ratio of direct vs reverberant sound is necessary. A dipole placed well away from the front wall could be an option there. Also, rolling of the highs above about 8 kHz will enhance distance perception by simulating the high-frequency air absorption which becomes significant at larger distances, but is often not captured in the recording.

Height is difficult since height perception relies mostly on HRTFs. Again, modifying the frequency response to simulate the appropriate HRTF might help.

Your third point will be difficult. You will have to avoid early reflections which do not come from a lateral angle since they will colour the sound. The direct/reverberant ratio should neither be too high nor too low (about -5 dB would be ideal). But that depends on the room and listening distance as well. Lastly, the speaker should have a relatively neutral frequency response and balanced, smooth power response without obvious rises. An excess of energy around 4 kHz, where our hearing is most sensitive, is also something to avoid.

As I stated in your other topic, I strongly encourage you to read Floyd Toole's Sound Reproduction. It is a bargain and a must-read.

Well now, good luck :D

bjorno 10th December 2012 12:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theaudiophile (Post 3278614)
Or is it possible then to take any given speaker and apply signal processing to an audio file to increase or decrease the depth. Is such a device available?

Depth is usually created by a combination of echoes and EQ.

Are you kidding me?

b:):D

bzfcocon 10th December 2012 01:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theaudiophile (Post 3278552)
I want to know how to make a multi way speaker do the following if possible, and an explanation of how:
  1. 1.) increase the perceived depth of the stereo image even greater than what is already contained on a recording.
  2. 2.) greater stereo image height
  3. 3.) make it sound very pleasing and appealing but not in an obvious way. So adding midrange warmth will be too obvious in the long term. I have a feeling that most high end speakers do this because how often do you go to a concert and remark on the imaging or clarity or warmth? These characteristics are very much limited to speakers, not real live musical instruments.

Quote:

Originally Posted by theaudiophile (Post 3278609)
I dont understand any of that. Too much technical jargon not enough explanation.

For 1 and 2: You asked: "I want to know how to make a multi way speaker do the following" - a highly technical question. You got a technical answer. If you don't understand the technical jargon, then how can you realistically hope you will be able to make it ?

It's like asking "I want to know how to build a Ferrari" and hoping you will be given an Ikea building set.

For 3: you can't be serious :D This whole forum is about "make it sound very pleasing and appealing but not in an obvious way" in 1000 different ways. If there was simple solution, everybody would have used it, right ?

Charles Darwin 10th December 2012 01:32 PM

Buy a digital reverb processor. You'll even get a number of presets like 'room', 'hall', 'cathedral' or 'cavern'.

Not exactly hifi though…

mondogenerator 10th December 2012 02:06 PM

i use a behringer 'ultrafex pro' multiband dsp processor. In addition to a bass and multiband processing sections, it has 'surround' processing. Note that its a 2 channel devic e, and the function increases depth and width of soundstage. I use it for movies. I suspect it merely adds a short reverberation. As Darwin says, its not really 'hi-fi' though.

theaudiophile 10th December 2012 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mondogenerator (Post 3278714)
i use a behringer 'ultrafex pro' multiband dsp processor. In addition to a bass and multiband processing sections, it has 'surround' processing. Note that its a 2 channel devic e, and the function increases depth and width of soundstage. I use it for movies. I suspect it merely adds a short reverberation. As Darwin says, its not really 'hi-fi' though.

This is not what I meant. If you use such a device you are adding reverb or changing the recording quite a lot. I wondered if the original depth in the recording can be magically removed or enhanced. I guess no such device is possible?


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