Hi,
Being bored with not taking something apart
for a while on a whim I bought these today :
Tibo EDGE MINI Black | Speakers Per Pair | Richer Sounds
£30 elsewhere and claimed retail price of £50.
To put that last point to bed you can get these for £50 :
Wharfedale DIAMOND 9.0 Black | Speakers Per Pair | Richer Sounds
And there is no real competition in terms of build quality.
Still £60 gives the speakers for 5.1 and one spare.
Unusually for me I plugged them in a system they have
no right to be in and formed some opinions before taking
them apart, and they are pretty good for £20 a pair.
1) They are AV speakers designed to be high pass filtered.
Run full range bass distortion is an issue at sensible volumes.
(Probably is filtered, but 5 rather than 2 will help levels.)
2) Sound best near wall and axis crossed a little in front
of the listener, though axis straight on is not too bad.
3) No glaring faults, but vocals tend to dominate music,
probably a good trait for AV, but outside the vocal range
there is not much insight and a general "opaqueness",
I guess the latter depends on what you are used to.
4) Low bass is missing and upper bass a little
tubby near wall. AV filtering may fix the latter.
(Still for the size, pretty decent bass overall.)
5) At low levels tone controls help, but not much
at higher levels, which overall is a good sign.
Overall impression is a decent attempt, but a small,
budget, low tech bass/mid struggling with limitations
as you turn the wick up, surprising at modest levels.
They get better as you turn them down, relatively.
rgds, sreten.
Further details and photos to follow as I take them apart.
FWIW they get slaughtered by my favourite budget speakers :
Wharfedale CR30.4 Black | Speakers Per Pair | Richer Sounds
But they are five times the price
.
Being bored with not taking something apart
for a while on a whim I bought these today :
Tibo EDGE MINI Black | Speakers Per Pair | Richer Sounds
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
£30 elsewhere and claimed retail price of £50.
To put that last point to bed you can get these for £50 :
Wharfedale DIAMOND 9.0 Black | Speakers Per Pair | Richer Sounds
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
And there is no real competition in terms of build quality.
Still £60 gives the speakers for 5.1 and one spare.
Unusually for me I plugged them in a system they have
no right to be in and formed some opinions before taking
them apart, and they are pretty good for £20 a pair.
1) They are AV speakers designed to be high pass filtered.
Run full range bass distortion is an issue at sensible volumes.
(Probably is filtered, but 5 rather than 2 will help levels.)
2) Sound best near wall and axis crossed a little in front
of the listener, though axis straight on is not too bad.
3) No glaring faults, but vocals tend to dominate music,
probably a good trait for AV, but outside the vocal range
there is not much insight and a general "opaqueness",
I guess the latter depends on what you are used to.
4) Low bass is missing and upper bass a little
tubby near wall. AV filtering may fix the latter.
(Still for the size, pretty decent bass overall.)
5) At low levels tone controls help, but not much
at higher levels, which overall is a good sign.
Overall impression is a decent attempt, but a small,
budget, low tech bass/mid struggling with limitations
as you turn the wick up, surprising at modest levels.
They get better as you turn them down, relatively.
rgds, sreten.
Further details and photos to follow as I take them apart.
FWIW they get slaughtered by my favourite budget speakers :
Wharfedale CR30.4 Black | Speakers Per Pair | Richer Sounds
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
But they are five times the price
.
Last edited:
Hi,
Some further listening tests at lower volumes later at night indicate
that they are thoroughly competent and IMO a bargain at the price.
Bass and distortion improves a lot as you drop overall SPL levels.
Frustrating is turning up the wick doesn't give what you expect.
rgds, sreten.
Will still take them apart etc. but doubt I'll break them up for parts.
Roy Orbison sounds rather good at reasonable volumes.
Some further listening tests at lower volumes later at night indicate
that they are thoroughly competent and IMO a bargain at the price.
Bass and distortion improves a lot as you drop overall SPL levels.
Frustrating is turning up the wick doesn't give what you expect.
rgds, sreten.
Will still take them apart etc. but doubt I'll break them up for parts.
Roy Orbison sounds rather good at reasonable volumes.
Last edited:
I would bet the enclosure is super cheaply made..made out of virtual cardboard. I would bet the whole thing would collapse onto itself if you whacked it hard with your fist.
The crossover probably has has the woofer going full range, well into break-up.
The woofer looks like those used in the current JBL & Infinity units........
Hope you can get some TS parameters.
Have fun!!!
-----------------------------------------------------------Rick.........
The crossover probably has has the woofer going full range, well into break-up.
The woofer looks like those used in the current JBL & Infinity units........
Hope you can get some TS parameters.
Have fun!!!
-----------------------------------------------------------Rick.........
Hi,
Details will follow, and you may be very surprised. As I've given
opinions without dissecting them yet, we will see. I like them.
We will see if my opinions relate to the technical details.
rgds, sreten.
FWIW the 6" wide by 7" deep by 9" high cabinets are probably worth
the asking price to most DIY'ers on there own *. I'm no mug, and
crap cabinets are not part of my impressions so far, unlikely in reality.
I'll also stick my neck out and say the x/o is going to be better
than the single capacitor to the treble regime, again we will see.
* double layer the front baffle for most FR's. £10 a cabinet is cheap.
Last edited:
Those look just like the speakers from one of our local chain stores (DSE) I actually bought a pair for a lady I was seeing who had no music in her flat.
That pair had the woofer running full and a small cap in series with the tweeter.
Personally I thought that the tweeter was causing all the distortion when pushed and when a local store offered me a second hand Jamo silk dome for $20- I opened them up and routed out for the bigger tweeter and added some dense polyester wadding and a single layer of 25mm eggcrate foam
Adding a small coil on the woofer and a "Close to book value" second order on the tweeter made them quite respectable, they are being used by a niece at the moment still going after a decade.
Over here they retailed at around $50- a pair I couldn't make the boxes that cheaply
That pair had the woofer running full and a small cap in series with the tweeter.
Personally I thought that the tweeter was causing all the distortion when pushed and when a local store offered me a second hand Jamo silk dome for $20- I opened them up and routed out for the bigger tweeter and added some dense polyester wadding and a single layer of 25mm eggcrate foam
Adding a small coil on the woofer and a "Close to book value" second order on the tweeter made them quite respectable, they are being used by a niece at the moment still going after a decade.
Over here they retailed at around $50- a pair I couldn't make the boxes that cheaply
Pre-op : the known, claimed and apparent facts
Hi,
Spec :
50W short term power handling
4-8 ohms impedance
2 way bass reflex
100mm long throw woofer
20mm soft dome tweeter
"high quality" push terminals
70-20,000Hz frequency response
MDF cabinet with profiled edges
232 x 147 x 190 (H x W x D) mm.
1.85Kg each
designed and developed in the UK
Info from inspection :
The cabinet depth is 170mm - 190mm includes the 10mm stock grille.
Tweeter is 75mm in overall diameter (plastic faceplate)
mid/bass unit is 115mm overall diameter (thin folded pressed steel)
The rear terminal block includes a wall mounting "keyhole"
- which will block off the :
rear mounted port, 90mm long, 32mm diameter, flared exit
Seen through the port, midbass unit is marked 4 ohms
midbass unit is not shielded
Knock test gives a different signature to front, back, top and side
Some quick number crunching and assuming 10mm stock
yields an approximate box volume of 4L tuned to 70Hz.
12mm yields
rgds, sreten.
To follow : post op facts and photos
Hi,
Spec :
50W short term power handling
4-8 ohms impedance
2 way bass reflex
100mm long throw woofer
20mm soft dome tweeter
"high quality" push terminals
70-20,000Hz frequency response
MDF cabinet with profiled edges
232 x 147 x 190 (H x W x D) mm.
1.85Kg each
designed and developed in the UK
Info from inspection :
The cabinet depth is 170mm - 190mm includes the 10mm stock grille.
Tweeter is 75mm in overall diameter (plastic faceplate)
mid/bass unit is 115mm overall diameter (thin folded pressed steel)
The rear terminal block includes a wall mounting "keyhole"
- which will block off the :
rear mounted port, 90mm long, 32mm diameter, flared exit
Seen through the port, midbass unit is marked 4 ohms
midbass unit is not shielded
Knock test gives a different signature to front, back, top and side
Some quick number crunching and assuming 10mm stock
yields an approximate box volume of 4L tuned to 70Hz.
12mm yields
rgds, sreten.
To follow : post op facts and photos
Last edited:
Interesting post Sreten - I'm surprised at what you can get for the money. I'm wondering how they can be manufactured, transported and then retailed at that price level? They must be less than £5 at the factory gates !
I presume the Diamonds are a better choice for garage/kitchen duty ? Say driven by a cheapy class d amp.
I presume the Diamonds are a better choice for garage/kitchen duty ? Say driven by a cheapy class d amp.
Wait for the photo
Look like this model : Eltax - Concept Mini
High quality build ! paper woofer ?
Can you measure them ?
Look like this model : Eltax - Concept Mini
High quality build ! paper woofer ?
Can you measure them ?
Post-op : the gleaned facts
Hi,
Cabinet is 12mm decent density MDF.
x/o is single tiny capacitor on the tweeter,
bipolar and I can't read the value.
"Damping" is a single sheet of 15mm lightweight BAF.
Tweeter is 4 ohm with a 7.5mm x 45mm magnet.
Midbass (4 ohm) has a 11mm x 60mm magnet.
It is a paper cone metalised on the front only.
Slightly concave flat plastic dustcap.
Estimated 22mm diameter voicecoil.
TBH pictures wouldn't be that interesting, it seems you
do get what you pay for, in this case not bad for £20.
Verdict :
TBH I was surprised a little at how basic they are. The last
similarly built speakers I looked at I truly hated the sound.
The best part is the cabinets, they are worth the asking
price for a project if cabinet building is not easy for you.
The grilles are usable but can be improved
with a felt lining to reduce diffraction.
The input terminals are fine for what they are.
Internal damping was a joke, easily improved.
The jury is out on the cheap drivers and x/o.
May have a good look at them when I have
some real spare time, but not at the moment.
Overall I have them down as adequate for what I'd call "normal"
TV levels, but not much more, relatively they are good value.
rgds, sreten.
Bass unit cutout is 100mm, tweeter unit 50mm + lug ears.
Hi,
Cabinet is 12mm decent density MDF.
x/o is single tiny capacitor on the tweeter,
bipolar and I can't read the value.
"Damping" is a single sheet of 15mm lightweight BAF.
Tweeter is 4 ohm with a 7.5mm x 45mm magnet.
Midbass (4 ohm) has a 11mm x 60mm magnet.
It is a paper cone metalised on the front only.
Slightly concave flat plastic dustcap.
Estimated 22mm diameter voicecoil.
TBH pictures wouldn't be that interesting, it seems you
do get what you pay for, in this case not bad for £20.
Verdict :
TBH I was surprised a little at how basic they are. The last
similarly built speakers I looked at I truly hated the sound.
The best part is the cabinets, they are worth the asking
price for a project if cabinet building is not easy for you.
The grilles are usable but can be improved
with a felt lining to reduce diffraction.
The input terminals are fine for what they are.
Internal damping was a joke, easily improved.
The jury is out on the cheap drivers and x/o.
May have a good look at them when I have
some real spare time, but not at the moment.
Overall I have them down as adequate for what I'd call "normal"
TV levels, but not much more, relatively they are good value.
rgds, sreten.
Bass unit cutout is 100mm, tweeter unit 50mm + lug ears.
Last edited:
Hi,
To answer some of the other posts :
I'm not in a position to measure them at the moment.
For hifi I would assume the £50 Diamonds are far better,
and a much better buy, these are a false economy.
Probably ok as rears in a basic setup. The other use I can think
of is one my very budget tricks : modding the headphone out
or adding interruptable speaker sockets to TV's and driving
basic external speakers with the TV's power amplifiers.
rgds, sreten.
To answer some of the other posts :
I'm not in a position to measure them at the moment.
For hifi I would assume the £50 Diamonds are far better,
and a much better buy, these are a false economy.
Probably ok as rears in a basic setup. The other use I can think
of is one my very budget tricks : modding the headphone out
or adding interruptable speaker sockets to TV's and driving
basic external speakers with the TV's power amplifiers.
rgds, sreten.
Last edited:
Hi,
Indeed. The only difference being the port and grill stud mounting.
In fact RS's picture of the Tibo's looks more like the Eltax's.
RS were selling the Eltax's at £30 a pair.
rgds, sreten.
Seas has good drivers options with CA12/L12/W12 woofers.
Troels project could be a good starting point : Eekels' Mini
Cheaper options are peerless HDS-104, ss 12W/8524G00, sb acoustics SB12NRXF25-4
a French project : Projet Toybox : la mini aux deux visages ! - Enceintes
Plenty of 4" drivers
Troels project could be a good starting point : Eekels' Mini
Cheaper options are peerless HDS-104, ss 12W/8524G00, sb acoustics SB12NRXF25-4
a French project : Projet Toybox : la mini aux deux visages ! - Enceintes
Plenty of 4" drivers
Hi,
Dragging out two of my budget references that have been in storage
for years indicates that I have been somewhat generous, as they
both slaughter the Tibo's in every sensible respect for music.
The Tibo's are definitely only good for AV with their vocal emphasis,
and that is for a very basic system as power handling is very poor.
The two speakers are JPW ML310's and Mordaunt Short MS20i Pearls.
Both bought on a similar whim from RS, both for £50 a pair on sale.
Of the two the JPW's are more robust sounding, the MS's delicate.
The Tibo's are 6"x7"x9". Nominally 4" bassmid.
The somewhat larger, 7"x7"x12" JPW's are in a different league for music.
Vocals are put back in the correct perspective, there is bass, a lot more
power handling, a bit rough and ready, a little opaque, but miles better.
Nominally a 5.25" bassmid.
The larger again MS's, 7.5"x8.5"x14.5", with their lighter balance sound
more detailed but this allied is with some genuine transparency. Clean
power handling takes a further good step and bass goes even deeper.
They are a world away from the Tibo's, and big step from the JPW's.
Nominally a 6.5" bassmid. (Would be great basis for a DIY TL/MLTL.)
The Tibo's are going to be a project to reuse the cabinet and tweeter,
and to try to get something that can compete with the above for size.
rgds, sreten.
Note : I retuned the bass alignment of both the JPW's and MS's,
by foam lining the ports, for the above, not returned to stock.
Speaker placement near wall for all three.
Dragging out two of my budget references that have been in storage
for years indicates that I have been somewhat generous, as they
both slaughter the Tibo's in every sensible respect for music.
The Tibo's are definitely only good for AV with their vocal emphasis,
and that is for a very basic system as power handling is very poor.
The two speakers are JPW ML310's and Mordaunt Short MS20i Pearls.
Both bought on a similar whim from RS, both for £50 a pair on sale.
Of the two the JPW's are more robust sounding, the MS's delicate.
The Tibo's are 6"x7"x9". Nominally 4" bassmid.
The somewhat larger, 7"x7"x12" JPW's are in a different league for music.
Vocals are put back in the correct perspective, there is bass, a lot more
power handling, a bit rough and ready, a little opaque, but miles better.
Nominally a 5.25" bassmid.
The larger again MS's, 7.5"x8.5"x14.5", with their lighter balance sound
more detailed but this allied is with some genuine transparency. Clean
power handling takes a further good step and bass goes even deeper.
They are a world away from the Tibo's, and big step from the JPW's.
Nominally a 6.5" bassmid. (Would be great basis for a DIY TL/MLTL.)
The Tibo's are going to be a project to reuse the cabinet and tweeter,
and to try to get something that can compete with the above for size.
rgds, sreten.
Note : I retuned the bass alignment of both the JPW's and MS's,
by foam lining the ports, for the above, not returned to stock.
Speaker placement near wall for all three.
Last edited:
The Silver Flute W14 may be suitable (if not too expensive). I am currently working on a design that puts 2 of them in 10 litre.
dave
You're missing the all-important bass cutout size here, sreten! An estimate of tweeter cutout and room for mounting plate would be interesting too. I suppose it's about 100mm on the bass cutout.
Few 4" woofers:
Peerless 830870 HDS 106 PPB MidWoofer Speaker
SB Acoustics :: 4? SB12NRX25-4
H1152-08 CA12RCY
Eekels Mini might indeed be a useful start.
Eekels' Mini
BTW, be very interested to see what Mordaunt Short did in those MS20i Pearls of yours on crossovers, since I have a pair of MS plastic basses lying about. Fancy starting a thread on them?
Few 4" woofers:
Peerless 830870 HDS 106 PPB MidWoofer Speaker
SB Acoustics :: 4? SB12NRX25-4
H1152-08 CA12RCY
Eekels Mini might indeed be a useful start.
Eekels' Mini
BTW, be very interested to see what Mordaunt Short did in those MS20i Pearls of yours on crossovers, since I have a pair of MS plastic basses lying about. Fancy starting a thread on them?
You can rule that one out. It was my 1st choice when i started working on the small MTM with the Silver Flute (since i''m sitting on 2 dozen of them) but they need a much bigger box (they work VERY well in the 32" ML-TL they were aquired for)
dave
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