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Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

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Old 29th September 2012, 02:46 PM   #21
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If I remember correctly Zaph was pretty disparaging regarding Morel drivers and others using a similar design and has the measurements to back it up.

Yep, here are his comments about the MW166:
"Comments: The response is smooth enough to work with, but this driver is plagued by highish tall order distortion through the midrange. It has a huge voice coil (3") but a tiny spider supporting it. I don't recommend this driver as it's non-linear distortion of all types is pretty obvious with most music. Tested October 2005."
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Old 29th September 2012, 03:14 PM   #22
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Yes he was also pretty disparaging regarding the MW144. His an My measurements were VERY different. see here --> Morel MW144 deceitful specs and the following posts where zaph replies. my swept sine measurements do show relatively high distortion between 500 and 1000Hz (from memory), but I don't notice it

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Old 29th September 2012, 03:25 PM   #23
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I prefer first order x-overs in speakers for domestic use, imo they sound better and i belive in having as little as possible in the signal chain.

The Oy speakers have this x-over today:

Click the image to open in full size.
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Old 29th September 2012, 03:26 PM   #24
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Did I miss them or were there no distortion measurements in that thread?
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Old 29th September 2012, 09:44 PM   #25
system7 is offline system7  United Kingdom
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I did wonder about the crossover. I know what the simple coil and capacitor one sounds like. In fact it's rather coloured even if lively. Lynn Olson and Jeff Bagby comment they found such a setup unsatisfactory in their D'Appolito designs.

I'd think something better would be 1mH coil, 10uF and 3 ohm in series shunted across the bass. 3.3-4uF series and 0.4mH shunt on the treble. Plus 2 ohm/10 ohm wirewound attenuator on the tweeter. That would give the tweeter an easier time of it and lose some cone breakup. Good start point for adjustment by ear.

But it's up to you.
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Old 29th September 2012, 09:56 PM   #26
sreten is offline sreten  United Kingdom
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Quote:
Originally Posted by system7 View Post
This is all VERY interesting, Ingvar! You'll just have to ignore sreten's usual negativity.
Hi,

There is nothing negative in my opinions. I'm all for enthusiasm and all
against misrepresentation of facts or alleged "experience" versus calling
referring to driver tests as "hearsay", when clearly descriptions of a
persons "experience" is as near to real "hearsay" as it actually gets.

I don't know whats VERY interesting about it, given the paucity of details.

Its a very expensive MTM, built by someone who freely admits that he
has no real experience of building such speakers, so no real perspective.

Given that you could build this for a hell of a lot less :

My RS180 MTM Design

In pretty much the same cabinets, or a different box choice, with near
identical sensitivity, bass extension and SPL capability, the obvious
question is do the far the more expensive drivers deliver the goods ?

I don't think so, nothing negative about that, and the above designs
crossover is currently far more advanced than the conjecture here.

rgds, sreten.
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Last edited by sreten; 29th September 2012 at 10:10 PM.
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Old 29th September 2012, 10:15 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sreten View Post
Hi,

There is nothing negative in my opinions. I'm all for enthusiasm and all
against misrepresentation of facts or alleged "experience" versus calling
referring to driver tests as "hearsay", when clearly descriptions of a
persons "experience" is as near to real "hearsay" as it actually gets.

I don't know whats VERY interesting about it, given the paucity of details.

Its a very expensive MTM, built by someone who freely admits that he
has no real experience of building such speakers, so no real perspective.

Given that you could build this for a hell of a lot less :

My RS180 MTM Design

In pretty much the same cabinets, or a different box choice, with near
identical sensitivity, bass extension and SPL capability, the obvious
question is do the far the more expensive drivers deliver the goods ?

I don't think so, nothing negative about that, and the above designs
crossover is currently far more advanced than the conjecture here.

rgds, sreten.
But they don't seem to go very low, so they would need a pair of subwoofers?
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Old 29th September 2012, 10:37 PM   #28
sreten is offline sreten  United Kingdom
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rullknufs View Post
But they don't seem to go very low, so they would need a pair of subwoofers?
Hi,

They go as low as the Morels in similar boxes.

rgds, sreten.
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Old 29th September 2012, 10:43 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ingvar ahlberg View Post
I prefer first order x-overs in speakers for domestic use, imo they sound better and i belive in having as little as possible in the signal chain.

The Oy speakers have this x-over today:

Click the image to open in full size.
I fail to see how a standard 2nd order xover has any more in the signal chain than a 1st order one.
As far as I see it the extra components are parallel to the drivers and as such not strictly in the signal chain.

Either way I never liked too much acoustical overlap between drivers and very much prefer 24dB active to any passive xover.
But that's just me…
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Old 29th September 2012, 10:54 PM   #30
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[QUOTE=Charles Darwin;3184175]I fail to see how a standard 2nd order xover has any more in the signal chain than a 1st order one.
As far as I see it the extra components are parallel to the drivers and as such not strictly in the signal chain.[QUOTE]

Contrary to popular belief, all components in a circuit are in the signal chain.
Parallel or series no matter, all are in the signal path, especially since sound is AC.

Later,
Wolf
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