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Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

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Old 27th September 2012, 05:55 PM   #141
tinitus is offline tinitus  Europe
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btw, there's nice new 8" from 18sound...8MB500
though Im not sure it sounds any better than Beta8
or may even be worse
all you may get for sure is better build quality, and probably a tougher driver
old 8MB400 is on sale at Lean and looks like a bargain, if its any good
measurements look different, but that could rely on many other things, and not mean anything, hard to say really
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Old 27th September 2012, 06:08 PM   #142
tinitus is offline tinitus  Europe
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JRKO View Post
...... like it can handle 2khz just fine and would push more air
be careful with measurements
may not sound like it looks
bigger drivers are usually not very good above 1khz, but ofcourse depends
but you really have to know the driver well to rely on anything above that
and many drivers(most) will probably fail long before that
but again, playing loud, the smaller driver may fall first
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Old 27th September 2012, 08:13 PM   #143
IG81 is offline IG81  Canada
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Originally Posted by JRKO View Post
Oh great

The great and mystical Baffle Step Correction

How does that work on these very wide speakers? Wide is good right? (gets hit by wife )
The ideal situation is to have a speaker large enough, that baffle-step is around the point where room gain kicks in. Speaker placement versus the floor, side and back walls allows for some "fine-tuning" with regards to this.

I just finished building large speakers of my own, 22" wide and 37" tall. Baffle step should be around 200Hz, but I don't feel like I need any correction with them in my 10'x13' room. Alternatively, since you want a ~200Hz Xover, it might land pretty near the baffle-step point and all that will be needed is to adjust driver levels accordingly, if at allnecessary.

IG

Last edited by IG81; 27th September 2012 at 08:16 PM.
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Old 27th September 2012, 10:01 PM   #144
badman is offline badman  United States
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Originally Posted by JRKO View Post

Breakup and beaming are separate issues but are both results of the freq. wavelength being smaller than the cones diameter and thus ending pure pistonic motion
Incorrect- breakup is much more closely tied to stiffness- which decreases with increasing driver diameter assuming constant cone thickness.
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Old 27th September 2012, 10:23 PM   #145
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Originally Posted by badman View Post
Incorrect- breakup is much more closely tied to stiffness- which decreases with increasing driver diameter assuming constant cone thickness.
In a strict mechanical engineering sense of the term, yes.

With speakers, "breakup" is used more loosely. Guitar players use it to refer to harmonic distortion (mostly caused by exceeding Xmax), what you're referring to they call "cone cry".

In hifi, it's most often used to refer to the notchy hash above the wavelength/diameter limit, much of which is the comb filtering that causes beaming.

Real cone breakup tends to generate a high resonant spike, and can most often be seen in tweeters and fullrange drivers.

Last edited by Keriwena; 27th September 2012 at 10:30 PM.
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Old 27th September 2012, 10:31 PM   #146
djn is offline djn  United States
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Originally Posted by VT67 View Post
Now this is an interesting thread. A few years ago I built a pair of Iwata horns designed for a 2" driver. Up until now I haven't found a suitable bass cabinet to accomodate these horns. The main idea was/is to keep it a two-way system. Suggestions are welcome. As you can see in the picture they serve as a printer stand and collect dust

Regards
This is basically what you have the start of. Best speaker I've ever heard. Build a 6cu ft box and use either the TAD 1601 15" woofer or the Lambda TD15X woofer. Then use either a TAD 4001 CD on the horn or a JBL 24xx CD with the True Extent barrilium (sp) diaphragm.

For me, best 2 way you can find.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S11nqJmqYKs

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Old 27th September 2012, 10:39 PM   #147
djn is offline djn  United States
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He is the evolution on my old room. Then a pix of the new reduced system in my new room.

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Old 27th September 2012, 10:45 PM   #148
badman is offline badman  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Keriwena View Post
In a strict mechanical engineering sense of the term, yes.

With speakers, "breakup" is used more loosely. Guitar players use it to refer to harmonic distortion (mostly caused by exceeding Xmax), what you're referring to they call "cone cry".

In hifi, it's most often used to refer to the notchy hash above the wavelength/diameter limit, much of which is the comb filtering that causes beaming.

Real cone breakup tends to generate a high resonant spike, and can most often be seen in tweeters and fullrange drivers.
The notchy hash doesn't take place with metal cones, until the failure of the material stiffness. The off-axis falls off cleanly. The off-axis misbehavior in softer coned speakers is due to damped breakup.

Speaker Building Supplies from Madisound

In Hifi we're talking about breakup, not only high-Q breakups, but any breakup in the mechanical sense. Guitar speaker talk definitely is more loosely defined, but their light floppy cones tend to "break up" mechanically much more easily than hifi cone assemblies.
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Old 27th September 2012, 10:49 PM   #149
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He is the evolution on my old room. Then a pix of the new reduced system in my new room.
Ooooooooo! I like the new chairs!






What? What do you expect me to say?
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Old 27th September 2012, 11:00 PM   #150
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Originally Posted by badman View Post
The notchy hash doesn't take place with metal cones, until the failure of the material stiffness. The off-axis falls off cleanly. The off-axis misbehavior in softer coned speakers is due to damped breakup.
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Huh? That thing hits 2K then BAM! Don't let the smoothing fool you.

But that's what I'm saying, really - the "breakup" is caused by acoustic realities, not mechanical limits. Most folks aren't driving their hifi speakers to where 'cone cry' is an issue.

Then again, given the subject of this thread, it might be a consideration.
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