Hello Folks,
I got just a pair of the Tang Band W5-704, Tang Band W5-704D 5-1/4" Woofer 264-850
and this too nice parts:
Tang Band 25-1744S - Parts Express Ships Fast and Ships Free
(OK the tweeter might be a overkill for the mid-bass, but I expect a lot from him)
I saw that someone already tried to get the right enclosure, for the 5" W5 and I have the same issue, I tried in WinISD to get some lead, but for a closed enclosure it gets not really low, and for a vented, it gives a nice low frequency, but a unrealistic vent length.
Any ideas for a enclosure? According to the manufacturer, the driver should go below Hz in a 17l but I cant get a realistic result for that in WinISD at least one that will not have a too long wen, to high airflow in the vent and as well the cone would not jump out... the Xmax 3mm is not really the top thing.
But any way there must be a nice enclosure for the driver.
I have no real limitation in the enclosure, but I would preffer a bookshelf size...any way the parameters dont show a lot of performance in bigger boxes.
Any oppinions are more than welcome
I got just a pair of the Tang Band W5-704, Tang Band W5-704D 5-1/4" Woofer 264-850
and this too nice parts:
Tang Band 25-1744S - Parts Express Ships Fast and Ships Free
(OK the tweeter might be a overkill for the mid-bass, but I expect a lot from him)
I saw that someone already tried to get the right enclosure, for the 5" W5 and I have the same issue, I tried in WinISD to get some lead, but for a closed enclosure it gets not really low, and for a vented, it gives a nice low frequency, but a unrealistic vent length.
Any ideas for a enclosure? According to the manufacturer, the driver should go below Hz in a 17l but I cant get a realistic result for that in WinISD at least one that will not have a too long wen, to high airflow in the vent and as well the cone would not jump out... the Xmax 3mm is not really the top thing.
But any way there must be a nice enclosure for the driver.
I have no real limitation in the enclosure, but I would preffer a bookshelf size...any way the parameters dont show a lot of performance in bigger boxes.
Any oppinions are more than welcome
Hi Michael, nice pages
Thanks for the link
I think I will go for the 20 Litre version, so far the preliminary calcualtion is 27,5x440,165cm
I downloaded your file for the 20l and it seems the limit will be 10watt power, than the air movent in the vent would be too fast, what is your experinece?
I also played with the highpass and it seems a 30hz highpass would do well...
what do you think?
(PS just a note, your synergy amps kit looks quite like the right thing to make my project a aktive speaker )
Thanks for the link
I think I will go for the 20 Litre version, so far the preliminary calcualtion is 27,5x440,165cm
I downloaded your file for the 20l and it seems the limit will be 10watt power, than the air movent in the vent would be too fast, what is your experinece?
I also played with the highpass and it seems a 30hz highpass would do well...
what do you think?
(PS just a note, your synergy amps kit looks quite like the right thing to make my project a aktive speaker
)
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Hi Michael, nice pages
Thanks for the link
I think I will go for the 20 Litre version, so far the preliminary calcualtion is 27,5x440,165cm
I downloaded your file for the 20l and it seems the limit will be 10watt power, than the air movent in the vent would be too fast, what is your experinece?
Thanks, glad you found the information useful.
I've not tried it in a 20L box. According to simulation,air movement is fine with a port of 2" dia and a length of 3.6".
You'll need to go active at 30Hz.
The Synergy amp is ideal for active speakers. I developed it out of necessity because it was taking too much of my time designing passive crossovers simply to evaluate drivers. I needed something simple, fast to work with and above all, good performance. After testing out some commercial crossovers, I found that they don't meet my expectations. Ended up designing the Synergy.
Attachments
OK a small visualisation in sketchup,...
would this positioning of the drivers and vent work?
the size is 20l
440x165x275 of inner volume
Yes, not a problem. Just make sure the woofer is not in the middle of the front panel. If it is, it's better to change the dimensions.
If the position of the woofer is fine, there's enough space to locate the vent in the front panel. Front firing vent is better if you decide to place your speakers against the back wall.
Here's my fun with it...
Canvas pictures by wolf_teeth_speaker - Photobucket
T/S measured:
15 ltrs:
Hope this helps,
Wolf
Canvas pictures by wolf_teeth_speaker - Photobucket
T/S measured:
15 ltrs:
Hope this helps,
Wolf
Thank for all the feedback,
I have moved the vend to the front panel and putted some dimensions so that you can get a better impression of the proportions.
(the dimensions are not final, its just for orientation)
As well I ordered this tool to measure the speakers for correct values:
Dayton Audio DATS Dayton Audio Test System 390-806
I have to wait till it arrives and for the customs, then I will measure the drivers and place here the actual values.
I have moved the vend to the front panel and putted some dimensions so that you can get a better impression of the proportions.
(the dimensions are not final, its just for orientation)
As well I ordered this tool to measure the speakers for correct values:
Dayton Audio DATS Dayton Audio Test System 390-806
I have to wait till it arrives and for the customs, then I will measure the drivers and place here the actual values.
Hi,
According to Zaph|Audio We have 12.1L Vas, 53Hz Fs and 0.49 Qts for the W5.
According to my WinISD modelling about 12L tuned to 40Hz should work well. 20L is
large for a 5", and you really don't want Vbox to be greater than Vas in nearly all cases.
rgds, sreten.
According to Zaph|Audio We have 12.1L Vas, 53Hz Fs and 0.49 Qts for the W5.
According to my WinISD modelling about 12L tuned to 40Hz should work well. 20L is
large for a 5", and you really don't want Vbox to be greater than Vas in nearly all cases.
rgds, sreten.
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Hi Sreten,
thanks for the hint, indeed the 20l are really more than 2x the Vas, according to wolf_teeth´s measurements one driver had a Vas of cca 8,5 the second of 9,7, that would give a average of 18,2liter as a max.
Less than 20, but in about less than a 10% tolerance, how exact is this rule? Would it now work anyway? (I still try to understand this rule, I dont know exactly yet what would that mean soundvise ...)
I tried in WinISD the 12l box and to turn it down to 40hz is quite a magic, what is your size of the port, to keep the air still moving at decent speet at f.e. 10watts?
thanks for the hint, indeed the 20l are really more than 2x the Vas, according to wolf_teeth´s measurements one driver had a Vas of cca 8,5 the second of 9,7, that would give a average of 18,2liter as a max.
Less than 20, but in about less than a 10% tolerance, how exact is this rule? Would it now work anyway? (I still try to understand this rule, I dont know exactly yet what would that mean soundvise ...)
I tried in WinISD the 12l box and to turn it down to 40hz is quite a magic, what is your size of the port, to keep the air still moving at decent speet at f.e. 10watts?
Yes, I mend the maximum for the average would be 2x9.1=18.2l
I will recalculate the size of the 12l box and put that into sketchup to see how the 5" port would fit, I place it later here.
WinISD gives me on your values a -3db at 80hz and a - 8db at 37,3hz
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I'm in the process of building something very similar to imagios' initial 20 liter plan using the W5 704D driver.
Mine is a tad smaller at 19 liters using similar tall, deep and slim box dimensions with the port tuning at 41Hz.
What are the consequences of box volume exceeding Vas ? Is it a case of increased excursion due to less restoring force from the box ?
Hi,
Using Zaphs parameters and a 12L box tuned to 40Hz I get :
-3dB at 56Hz, -6dB at 42Hz, and -10dB at 32Hz. Basically
good bass down to 40Hz with a quasi 1st order shape.
Mild 0.3dB peak 100Hz to 200Hz. (WinISD 0.44)
Somewhat better than a 12L Qbox=0.69 sealed box.
(-3dB at 77Hz, -6dB at 58Hz, and -10dB at 44Hz).
rgds, sreten.
The bigger the box the more it is susceptible to driver vagaries.
If Vbox exceeds Vas then simply put you would be better off
with a bigger driver, many 6.5"ers work very well in around 20L.
Vas to Vbox ratio determines how much the box air linearises
the drivers suspension, the smaller the box the more linear.
Using Zaphs parameters and a 12L box tuned to 40Hz I get :
-3dB at 56Hz, -6dB at 42Hz, and -10dB at 32Hz. Basically
good bass down to 40Hz with a quasi 1st order shape.
Mild 0.3dB peak 100Hz to 200Hz. (WinISD 0.44)
Somewhat better than a 12L Qbox=0.69 sealed box.
(-3dB at 77Hz, -6dB at 58Hz, and -10dB at 44Hz).
rgds, sreten.
The bigger the box the more it is susceptible to driver vagaries.
If Vbox exceeds Vas then simply put you would be better off
with a bigger driver, many 6.5"ers work very well in around 20L.
Vas to Vbox ratio determines how much the box air linearises
the drivers suspension, the smaller the box the more linear.
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Hi,
With Zaphs specs the classic maximally flat vented alignment comes
out as 23L tuned to 44Hz. Flat to 50Hz, -3dB at 40Hz and around
the same -10dB point as the 12L tuned to 40Hz.
Problem is in a real room you'll end up with the classical vented boomy
bass problem, poor transient response, and nearly certain one note bass.
The box will not appreciably linearise driver distortion.
Which isn't a good return for building twice as big boxes. My simple
modelling indicates 15L tuned to 38Hz is about as good as it gets
for this driver, and 15L is plently enough for many 6.5" drivers.
So an intelligent use is around 5-10L sealed and little more vented.
rgds, sreten.
With Zaphs specs the classic maximally flat vented alignment comes
out as 23L tuned to 44Hz. Flat to 50Hz, -3dB at 40Hz and around
the same -10dB point as the 12L tuned to 40Hz.
Problem is in a real room you'll end up with the classical vented boomy
bass problem, poor transient response, and nearly certain one note bass.
The box will not appreciably linearise driver distortion.
Which isn't a good return for building twice as big boxes. My simple
modelling indicates 15L tuned to 38Hz is about as good as it gets
for this driver, and 15L is plently enough for many 6.5" drivers.
So an intelligent use is around 5-10L sealed and little more vented.
rgds, sreten.
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Ok that would bring me to Michaels size with his 13 liters on his Oriole project...
I had my doubts when I saw the Qts of the driver, whether he really fits a vented box... it seems he might do a better job in a three way system sealed and high-passed from 110hz, but I definitely go for the two way with the ceramic tweeter. (as both where a birthday gift )
I seems I can not get a low frequency and nice sound, you just cant argue with the physics ...
I had my doubts when I saw the Qts of the driver, whether he really fits a vented box... it seems he might do a better job in a three way system sealed and high-passed from 110hz, but I definitely go for the two way with the ceramic tweeter. (as both where a birthday gift
)I seems I can not get a low frequency and nice sound, you just cant argue with the physics ...
It seems my 19 litre box will be on the large side for the W5 704D, but I am well on the way to completing the enclosures so I think I will carry on and hear what happens. Though it'll be some weeks before I complete everything I shall certainly post my results back here. Looking forward to seeing where your design heads too Imagios, please keep us updated.
By the way, thanks for you comments about the effects of box size Sreten. It cause a few stuck pennies to drop.
By the way, thanks for you comments about the effects of box size Sreten. It cause a few stuck pennies to drop.
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