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Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

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Old 8th September 2012, 05:05 AM   #51
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The challenge is to make all the loudspeakers suspended .
That's what I like in Stig's approach .
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Old 8th September 2012, 07:24 AM   #52
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Greg there is nothing to stop me doing something similar to what you have done if it isn't going to cause M-T issue (see pic)

BTW very nice speakers you have there... Do you find the planars harsh when used with the RAAL? Also is that one solid block of wood?

Curious as to what you used for your bass, and if you feel it is in the same league as the other speakers (distortion, quality wise etc)
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Old 8th September 2012, 12:02 PM   #53
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Here is a Sketch Up rendition of what I see it looking like...
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Old 8th September 2012, 01:25 PM   #54
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I can't see the utility of having a faulty emission represented by the mid mounted to the rear .
I must give credit also to Natehansen66 who made the scaffolding to suspend the speakers : still the woofer isolation remains a mystery ...
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Old 8th September 2012, 02:09 PM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StigErik View Post
There is one good reason for doing push pull with both woofers and midranges, and that is distortion reduction. Odd order harmonics are reduced with a factor up to 10 because of phase cancellation of the distortion products between the drivers.
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Originally Posted by john k... View Post
That would be even order cancelation.
This the main reason for having the drivers opposed.
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Old 8th September 2012, 02:17 PM   #56
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ohhh . I see
And what do they say about reflections from the basket and the cylinder
( the magnet ) ? Are they less important than distortion cancellation ?
Also having two sources presents some problems .
Just asking
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Old 8th September 2012, 03:43 PM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by picowallspeaker View Post
ohhh . I see
And what do they say about reflections from the basket and the cylinder
( the magnet ) ? Are they less important than distortion cancellation ?
You need to think about the wavelengths involved. He's looking at crossing at 2k which is a wavelength of 6.75".

As far as woofer isolation, in my application the naked driver "scaffolding" is mounted to the u-frame, but the wire suspending the drivers hangs from rubber grommets. That plus the "swinging" action of the cable ensures little to no vibration transfer from the woofer to the upper drivers. They pass the touch test at least when the woofer is doing 40hz, which is as scientific as I'm willing to get here.
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Old 8th September 2012, 05:39 PM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silent Screamer View Post
Greg there is nothing to stop me doing something similar to what you have done if it isn't going to cause M-T issue (see pic)

BTW very nice speakers you have there... Do you find the planars harsh when used with the RAAL? Also is that one solid block of wood?

Curious as to what you used for your bass, and if you feel it is in the same league as the other speakers (distortion, quality wise etc)
Those Illuminator mids are soooo cute! I can't believe both of them basically fit right next to the Raal. Even of to the side, you have to be aware of the CTC distance. Like I said, I'm not using my own advice and crossing technically too high at 3KHz, but I trade off poorer off axis performance for easier task for the Raal. Plus, I think meaty snare drums sound more powerful with more of their top end coming from the Neo10 than the Raal. It's just my preference after trying every combination possible.

Using the Neo10 with the Raal is in no way harsh. Just the opposite actually as long as you get off of the Neo10 by at least 3KHz, they are smooth as silk. No break-up like a metal or hard paper cone.

The wood is 4 layers glued up. Bamboo plywood-mdf-bamboo plywood-baltic plywood. first layer is tung oiled, back 3 are Rustoleum speckled finish paint.

Woofers are B&C 15NDL46. see here:

B&C 15NDL76 15" Neodymium Woofer 294-683

I started with Lambda Dipole 15, but sold those and went with the lower Qts B&Cs.

Greg
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Old 9th September 2012, 05:51 AM   #59
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lol problem is they are too cute... I am having trouble convincing myself that they are big enough to handle the job of a mid.

If I was using a typical tweeter that crossed over higher, I could justify having them in there and just slip something a bit bigger in underneath to fill in the bottom end.

Their sheer physical size is mucking with my head because in the past small speakers just didn't do low frequencies. I was toying with the idea of yanking them out of there and replacing them with the 18WU's, but as you can see from the graph they don't go much lower and the graph is no where near as smooth.

Problem is getting my brain to jump from a 120mm mid to a 393mm woofer.

Currently I am running 2 x 8ohm 12MU's in parallel, but I am wondering if perhaps it should run 2 x 4ohm 12MU's on separate amps, and just split the signal from the Digital X-Over. (I have 6 x 8ohm and 4 x 4ohm available)

Is this too big of a jump for OB or is it just me?
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Old 9th September 2012, 06:08 AM   #60
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I think your mids are just fine as long as you do not ask them to play too low. I personally prefer more surface area, but those Illuminators you got are some of the best out there.

Greg
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