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Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

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Old 16th September 2012, 03:54 AM   #121
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I can get 40Hz with dual 15s in open baffle. So you should have no issue getting 50Hz or better
Honestly try dual woofers, once you hear it you won't go back.
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Old 16th September 2012, 04:02 AM   #122
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silent Screamer View Post
The other thing that has changed is that I am now going to be using a dipole RAAL which has a slightly lower efficiency (~93dB)

and the 2 x 12MUs come in around 93dB as well, so I really don't want to be driving up the woofer SPL, when what I really need is to get lower in frequency.

So any of the efficient 15" is probably going to be border line needing attenuation anyway.

Had a play with a couple of the crossover types and different slopes to see how it effected the curve and without any real measurements I need to leave that step to a bit further down the track.
You won't be attenuating much at all. Don't you have a digital EQ?
What size baffle are you intending on using?

Last edited by Melon Head; 16th September 2012 at 04:05 AM.
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Old 16th September 2012, 04:24 AM   #123
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Melon Head View Post
I can get 40Hz with dual 15s in open baffle. So you should have no issue getting 50Hz or better
Honestly try dual woofers, once you hear it you won't go back.
Well if I buy 2 x 15", I can always try hook them up together in the one speaker to try them out and see how much difference it makes over a single 15"

If I found that I was blown away by the difference I could always buy two more.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Melon Head View Post
You won't be attenuating much at all. Don't you have a digital EQ?
What size baffle are you intending on using?
Have one of these... Ground Sound

Not planning on using a baffle plan to just suspend the drivers like a few of the others that have posted in this thread.
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Old 16th September 2012, 04:55 AM   #124
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If your not familiar with the software that comes with it here is a screen shot of my current crossover...
Attached Images
File Type: jpg XOver Config.jpg (422.4 KB, 203 views)
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Old 16th September 2012, 04:59 AM   #125
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Looks like a sweet kit!
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Old 16th September 2012, 05:02 AM   #126
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lol want to be for the price
but this speaker project is not about compromises (no avoidable ones anyway).
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Old 16th September 2012, 05:10 AM   #127
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Wow, just did the conversion to US $. Ouch! That's a lot of money and still need many channels of amps.

I'm wondering on how well that Raal dipole is going to do down low. Might roll off earlier than the normal model. This could cause a rise in distortion near the crossover point if that area of the Raal now needs boosted.
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Old 16th September 2012, 06:22 AM   #128
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If you are not using a baffle at all, you won't be attenuating the bass to match 93dB
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Old 16th September 2012, 06:31 AM   #129
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silent Screamer View Post
Well if I buy 2 x 15", I can always try hook them up together in the one speaker to try them out and see how much difference it makes over a single 15"

If I found that I was blown away by the difference I could always buy two more.
What you should notice is very realistic drum sounds, eg snare, rimshot, the leading edge of fast dynamic transient notes are super real like heavily plucked notes on stringed instruments, the decay of notes is the same as single 15. If you love music with sudden changes in dynamic content slapping on bass guitar, drums, orchestral music, you will love dual 15s. If you mainly listen to accoustic type of music without drums or dynamic changes a single 15 might do

Last edited by Melon Head; 16th September 2012 at 06:35 AM.
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Old 16th September 2012, 07:45 AM   #130
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Originally Posted by Melon Head View Post
If you are not using a baffle at all, you won't be attenuating the bass to match 93dB
Even with a baffle he won't be attenuating the bass, if he wants to get to 40hz with a low-mid q driver. I really don't see any good reason to go baffleless on the bass drivers. You throw away efficiency you're already losing due to the dipole roll-off. With an active setup setting levels is pretty trivial anyways.

The way I'm doing it with a single 15 on each side (in a u-frame), IIRC I've got a boost of about 12db at 35, 8db at 40 and I high shelf at 100hz -6db to flatten everything out. I also have a low shelf at 100hz sometimes +5db, this is on the fly to taste depending on the content. Without that high shelf the boost on the bottom end to get to 40 flat is 20+ and near clipping the outputs on my DAC. That's something you've got to keep an eye on with bass heavy music using this kind of boost.

I used to eq with huge amounts of boost on the bottom end so I wouldn't have to shelf the rising response, but to do so I'd have to digitally attenuate the bass driver -10db in order to have enough head room for the low end boost. These days I like to use as much of my DAC's bit depth as I can, so I flatten out the rising response and can the digital attenuation.

This is all at super sane apartment listening levels though. I imagine I'd want to double up on the woofers if higher spl was required.

Long story short I think h-frames are the way to go for dipole bass.
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