Yes MTMs are simple (2 way) and efficient (2 woofers alow you to compensate for baffle step and still retain a sensitivity of 86db+ in most cases).
I built 3 good MTMs in my day - my first one was a large one using 2 8" Focal Neoflex 8N515 woofers and the Morel MDT33. In my room it had a tight but narrow sweet spot. Superb if you listen alone; not so good if your wife or friend listens with you and is also critical of music.
A friend told me that smaller drivers would reduce this so I built another using the Dynaudio 15W75 and D260 (Gemini) and later a more efficient one using ScanSpeak 18W8546 and 9900. The image issues remained.
I dont know if this feature is the domain of all MTMs though. For me this was a limitation I could live without. My wife likes to listen too.
In all 3 cases the MTMs was supplemented with a pair of stereo subwoofers (different ones) so SPL capability was not an issue.
RockLeeEV, I am a little confused. If the Tritrix would retail for around what we DIYers would pay how does it compare to the HT2-TL?
What about the JBL 4312E (my son has them along with a subwoofer they really rock).
Yes many new JBL home speakers like the LS80 and Pro Arrays are tubby. Why I dont know and yes most Dyns I have heard sound quite lifeless. It's like "everything is there, but the 'music' is missing". Can't understand why.
An option for those who want to do wood work but not the design part and still use good drivers is Rick Craig's Selah Audio. Rick has a wider variety of stuff that his website would lead you to believe.
Common Kits.
Speaker Kits
Some custom versions.
Custom Center Channels
Hi Folks,
I'm trying my hands at my first speaker build and I'd like recommendations on a kit please!
About Me
I have minimal wood working experience and no soldering / electrical experience. I've got bar clamps, hand drills, soldering iron and other basic hand tools. I don't have access to fancy tools like drill presses. I'm also dirt poor!
Design Goals
I live in a small condo where the room size is approx 15x15 feet. So I don't need something with high power handling. I'll be sitting about 9 feet from the speakers - just a stereo configuration. I'd like decent bass extension as I don't really have much room for a subwoofer.
As I don't have the fancier tools, I've been researching kits as well. If you are considering the tritrix kit at ~$250, you should consider the overnight sensation or the neo nano ($128 and $150 respectively for the pairs) kits. Besides glue, you would need two terminal cups and a hole saw for a powered drill and hook up wire. Egg crate foam and poly fill stuffing from a craft store. The rest, electronics and drivers and ports and wood, is included. What's nice about starting with the overnight sensations is you can add the rest Paul Carmody's designs as he voices them to be similar. When you go multichannel, you have options. In fact, if you can wait, I think he's revising the Classix II. That design seems fit your criteria. In Paul's words, "And of course, the big highlight of the Classix II is the deep bass coming from such an unassuming bookshelf speaker cabinet. Perhaps one reason I'm so attached to this design is that I wish so dearly I had it for the years I was living in apartments." It looks like DIY Sound group has the flat pack ready, but waiting for the revision of the electronics. You can also search the Parts-Express forums for more ideas and builds of the mentioned speakers.
Hi Folks,
Thanks for all the replies - really appreciate the involvement of this community!
After reading through the econowave speakers, I think they might be a bit complicated for a first timer. I think something with pre-cut cabinets is needed for someone of my level of skill.
RockLeeEV, the ER18's are very well reviewed, but for a first time build, again, a little costly for me and probably outside my skill level as I'd need to but the cabinets myself. maybe for my next project!
Overnight Sensations - I think I'm going to try this first. It doesn't really meet my requirements in terms of floorstanding, but I'm going to build them as a fathers day gift. The kit is easily available, it comes in a solid birch (so finishing is easy, just stain). I hope the shipping to Canada isn't outrageously expensive.
heyduard, why a terminal cup over a binding post? I do have a hole saw, I do lots of home construction work, just don't have precision tools.
Thanks for all the replies - really appreciate the involvement of this community!
After reading through the econowave speakers, I think they might be a bit complicated for a first timer. I think something with pre-cut cabinets is needed for someone of my level of skill.
RockLeeEV, the ER18's are very well reviewed, but for a first time build, again, a little costly for me and probably outside my skill level as I'd need to but the cabinets myself. maybe for my next project!
Overnight Sensations - I think I'm going to try this first. It doesn't really meet my requirements in terms of floorstanding, but I'm going to build them as a fathers day gift. The kit is easily available, it comes in a solid birch (so finishing is easy, just stain). I hope the shipping to Canada isn't outrageously expensive.
heyduard, why a terminal cup over a binding post? I do have a hole saw, I do lots of home construction work, just don't have precision tools.
Hi Folks,
Thanks for all the replies - really appreciate the involvement of this community!
After reading through the econowave speakers, I think they might be a bit complicated for a first timer. I think something with pre-cut cabinets is needed for someone of my level of skill.
RockLeeEV, the ER18's are very well reviewed, but for a first time build, again, a little costly for me and probably outside my skill level as I'd need to but the cabinets myself. maybe for my next project!
Overnight Sensations - I think I'm going to try this first. It doesn't really meet my requirements in terms of floorstanding, but I'm going to build them as a fathers day gift. The kit is easily available, it comes in a solid birch (so finishing is easy, just stain). I hope the shipping to Canada isn't outrageously expensive.
heyduard, why a terminal cup over a binding post? I do have a hole saw, I do lots of home construction work, just don't have precision tools.
Good idea. I have no idea why people are trying to upsell a beginner on projects that will consume a lot of time and money (actually I know why, it's to get you hooked so you're one of us, one of us, one of us...). They make it sound like it's easy. It isn't - especially if its your first time. Overnight Sensations are popular and use high quality drivers and is a package deal. Go for it and Have fun!
To the extent of the term "kill"?
The directional qualities do benefit, i'll give you that, but beyond that they're probably a lot closer, with biases removed, than for A to "kill" B.
I said the ER18MTM would compare decently to an HT2-TL, as they have the same crossover designer, same cabinet designer (actually may be the same cabinet as the drivers are swappable), similar calibers of ribbon tweeters, and an otherwise excellent, if not world class midwoofer. I think the Infinity Primus plus DIY mods may be better than the Tritrix.
Never heard them, but that tweeter/midrange spacing and layout is rather questionable.
Because it appeals to the mainstream.
Did you look into the other, RS180 design I suggested for you in my original post? It was originally designed using this prefab cabinet:
http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=302-750
and drivers/crossovers would cost a good amount less than the ER18MTM.
Well two reasons
1) The OP specifically wanted a tower that could dig deep without a subwoofer and provide a "great" level of bang for buck. He did chang his mind when he saw that DIY does require some level of woodworking aside from flat packs (and that there aren't many tower speaker flat packs available in his price range, and pre-assembled towers won't save him any money).
2) The cheapest DIY, really isn't all that much better than a good deal on a cheap, but well designed commercial tower (and if he's willing to DIY, some of those towers can benefit from DIY cabinet mods like additional bracing, mass loaded vinyl, insulation swaps, etc). If OP doesn't wanna DIY, I'd honestly recommend s/he go the commercial route as it's less of a hassle and often the results are even better than DIY. Spending a little bit more gets you closer to the high value assosiated with DIY.
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I hope the shipping to Canada isn't outrageously expensive.
heyduard, why a terminal cup over a binding post? I do have a hole saw, I do lots of home construction work, just don't have precision tools.
Email Eric at DIY Soundgroup or the folks at Parts express to get an idea on shipping.
As for a terminal cup over binding posts, for some reason, a terminal cup is less expensive than a pair of binding posts. but hey I like binding posts myself. Very blingy. You had mentioned there was a budget.
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Danny Richie of GR Research is blowing out some very good kits at unbelievable prices. Crossovers are pre-built, woofers are surface mount. See post #45 for my favorite, but go back to the beginning for all of the kits he is blowing out.
For those that like such things, he also posts professional reviews of many of the kits.
Best deal on loudspeaker kits ever.
For those that like such things, he also posts professional reviews of many of the kits.
Best deal on loudspeaker kits ever.
yes, two options for you.
Solen Electronique Inc. i buy a lot from them. great service.
or contact Bob at Creative Sound Solutions - Loudspeakers, Parts and DIY Speaker Kits . he can place your PE,madisound meniscus etc. order for you and get free shipping to the border. he then ships it to you Can post. MUCH cheaper than ordering from PE directly. He's a great guy and has some very good products of his own.
david
by the way, i just finished a Swope setup for a friend and last yr built the OS's. i prefer the swope TM's to the mtm's or the sensations because it was the leanest (least warm sounding?) in the upper bass. i don't care for a warm sound myself but that's simply a preference. the Swope Tm's, MTM's, and sensations have increasing warmth in that order. both the swope models have a superior treble range due to the upgraded tweeter.
don't get me wrong, i love my sensations, they sound awesome at a great $ and now in a knockdown kit! also consider the Nano Neos on Sale - $55/pr (drivers & XO) - Techtalk Speaker Building, Audio, Video, and Electronics Customer Discussion Forum From Parts-Express.com also in flatpacks. these will blow your mind at the amount and depth of bass! no sub needed in my office but i found they became more detailed when i plugged the port. then they where comperable to the sensations with a slight edge in overall sq going to the latter.
good luck
david
don't get me wrong, i love my sensations, they sound awesome at a great $ and now in a knockdown kit! also consider the Nano Neos on Sale - $55/pr (drivers & XO) - Techtalk Speaker Building, Audio, Video, and Electronics Customer Discussion Forum From Parts-Express.com also in flatpacks. these will blow your mind at the amount and depth of bass! no sub needed in my office but i found they became more detailed when i plugged the port. then they where comperable to the sensations with a slight edge in overall sq going to the latter.
good luck
david
1. I agree with your JBL analysis. My nephew's dance music sounded quite good but my music (a mix of 60s and 70s Rock and 50s Jazz) did not.
2. Again you are on the money. The biggest differences a DIYer sees in a commercial sense is in the high end. For example commcercial speakers that employ a RAAL tweeter, Accuton Mid and ScanSpeak Iluminator woofers would cost considerably more than $4000 that Rick charges for the Tempesta. I have found this to be true in many cases going back to the late 80s when Mike Dzurko's ACI kits were around. I have built any but am sure Troels, John (Zaph) K, etc. kit also offer great value in the $1000-$4000/pr range. This seems to be the "sweet spot" for value for DIYers. Why even Jim Salk's direct to customer Song Tower is also highly rated and I am told easily competes with speakers that are twice as costly.
Oh yes, Danny is doing a good turn, I know many in India who are planning to import kits from Danny. Given the cost of shipping, duties, taxes, etc..as well as earning levels we in India are a bit more sensitive to cost (no offense meant to my friends in the "first world").
Thanks David, I wrote to Bob at CSS. Hope to hear back soon.
Navin, I agree that the sweet spot is higher up in the DIY price point, but my skill level isn't there yet for me to purchase such high end gear. I want to learn on the cheap stuff first before spending a bundle on high end drivers and crossovers!
Navin, I agree that the sweet spot is higher up in the DIY price point, but my skill level isn't there yet for me to purchase such high end gear. I want to learn on the cheap stuff first before spending a bundle on high end drivers and crossovers!
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