first build

[Evan93]

heey

I'm Evan, and I'm new to this forum and speaker building, so I could ask some really dumb questions

i'm planning on building a pair of speakers, to replace my current technics sb-ch770 3 ways.

i'm aiming at clear, accurate high tones, and a deep, strong bass.
the music that would be played through them would be rock, metal and dubstep, i know it's a weird combo and two totally diffrent styles.

the designs i've came by were the visaton ct 142
http://www.visaton.de/bilder/forum/ct142-1.jpg
(i've heard somewhere else on the web that the tweeters aren't that good?)
and the markstart kit mkII
MarkStart - Lautsprecher Selbstbau by blue planet acoustic
(heard quite good things about)

wich of the two is better/has better sound quallity

other input is welcome too, but my budget is max 200 ex wood and finish, but I'm hoping at 200 total

Evan

p.s. i hope i diddn't made too much grammer/spelling mistakes

[Tytte71]

Hi

I have no clue about the sound of your proposed builds/kits. But for deep strong bass and nice highs I would google the Econowave project. I would suppose it could be possible to build that one for as low as 200€ if you buy the parts on sale or second hand.

[Evan93]

thanks for the idea, i've googled it for a while but i don't really think it's what i'm looking for.

for what i've understood is econowave all about evenly spreading the high tones in the room, so the ¨perfect listening spot¨becomes a lot bigger. it isn't really about the lower frequencies, but correct me if i'm wrong.

my listening position is always pretty much the same.

anybody who knows something about the two speakers in my opening post?

[Tytte71]

Still can't help you with the speakers you mentioned
I would just add that it is not the wide sweet spot that is the main clue (a side effect though), but the even power response. You do really not realize how important it is before you have tried it.
After years of fiddling with "typical" hifi speakers, some costing (for me) an arm and a leg I could never return back after having played on extremely cheaper self made setups... similar to the econowave. There are off course alternatives to this like e.g. the Orion, Nao, Gedlee and Gainphile's approach, but I believe for the money, the Econowaves are very hard to beat and a very good place to start. That is just my opinion

[Evan93]

is there an econowave design/plan somewhere? because i can't seem to find one on the web.
designing a speaker/crossover from scratch is at the moment to much for me, i just don't have the knowledge to do that.
I'm looking for a plan that's like, already done so that i know i'm building something worth the build, and not being stuck at something above my head.

[Helmuth]

Hi

Here a complete set of speakers with some of the topline drivers of visaton.
Titanium dome mid and High and polypropylene woofer witch is very suitable for a closed box. this one is 200euro drivers are about 600euro together new.

You can buy and use them or take them apart and build a new cross over because there is where the magic is done when the drivers are OK.

Marktplaats.nl > Visaton luidsprekers TE KOOP!! - Audio, Tv en Foto - Luidsprekers



I can help design one with new drivers then I would make a nice two way.

with this 55euro basmid scanspeak.http://www.scan-speak.dk/datasheet/pdf/15w-8424g00.pdf

and this 26 euro tweeter monacor dt109
MONACOR INTERNATIONAL : Produktdetailseite

filter C=4,7uf Janzen bipolair or MKT, L=0,27mH wire wound aircoil r<0,4Ohm


box 9 liter BR-pipe 4,7cm 24cm long


Or a 6,5 inch driver for more bas.
br-pipe 28cm long 8,2cm, box 22 liter.
See bleu line in graphic.
http://www.scan-speak.dk/datasheet/pdf/18w-8424g00.pdf
55euro

[Helmuth]

When you have more money you can improve the two way design to a 3Way and have more subbas with a 26cm woofer. So you can play lower and louder . In the 2way design power is limited it is a nice speaker for a 50w amplifier.http://www.scan-speak.dk/datasheet/pdf/26w-8534g00.pdf.

The bass-reflex pipe can be replaced with a rectangular wooden port of the same length an surface. See the simulation for data.

[RockLeeEV]

Start with a good pair of dynamic, capable speakers with even power response.

If you really need "extra" boom n sizzle afterwards you can equalize it in externally. Though IMO when you've got dynamic, clean, neutral speakers there's no need for added boom n sizzle.

[Evan93]

Originally Posted by Helmuth

I can help design one with new drivers then I would make a nice two way.

with this 55euro basmid scanspeak.http://www.scan-speak.dk/datasheet/pdf/15w-8424g00.pdf

and this 26 euro tweeter monacor dt109
MONACOR INTERNATIONAL : Produktdetailseite

box 9 liter BR-pipe 4,7cm 24cm long


Or a 6,5 inch driver for more bas.
br-pipe 28cm long 8,2cm, box 22 liter.
See bleu line in graphic.
http://www.scan-speak.dk/datasheet/pdf/18w-8424g00.pdf
55euro

I really appreciatie this, and i think i will be going for the 6,5 inch scanspeak driver and the dt109 tweeter.

does the filter stay the same with this driver or does it change?
and is it correct that a box of 180X150X815(mm) is 22L?

BTW what are some good programs to use for calculations and filters?

Evan

[Helmuth]

Originally Posted by Evan93

I really appreciatie this, and i think i will be going for the 6,5 inch scanspeak driver and the dt109 tweeter.

does the filter stay the same with this driver or does it change?
and is it correct that a box of 180X150X815(mm) is 22L?

BTW what are some good programs to use for calculations and filters?

Evan

Yes there are spice programs like symetrix. Problem is to give them the right in put so they can calculate the right response it is engineers stuff.

A filter calculation programme will show a result if like the speaker is the ideal 8Ohm. this is not the case in real live.

The monacor tweeter has a reasonable flat impedance but the scan speak show normal woofer impedance curve. See the bleu line is resistance of the woofer at XO frequency the impedance starts to rise due the voice coil induction it is also a coil you see.

With the series filter the drivers see the same phase shift and XO point it compensates it self that is why i choose it and it is cheep to make.

The filter stays the same. When you want to do it good you have to use free ware like arta and measure the response of the loudspeaker.

I would make it 16x21x70 inside it is 23,5 liter about 1,5 liter extra for port and speaker magnet and frame and reinforcement in the box.