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Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

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View Poll Results: Which Kit For High-end Home Theater?
Eekels' Mini 1 3.45%
SEAS 5INCH 1 3.45%
3-Way Classic 2 6.90%
CA18RLY/22TAF-G 0 0%
SEAS Excel Bifrost 3 10.34%
QUATTRO 4 13.79%
Lumine One 1 3.45%
A Different Kit - Please List Below 1 3.45%
I Have No Idea But I Like To Vote 16 55.17%
Voters: 29. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 19th November 2011, 06:24 PM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by navin View Post
10 drivers? Are you building 5 of these things?
Yes I am building a 9.1 system so I will need 9 boxes. The 10th driver was free (10% discount at madisound when you buy 10+). I will be reshaping the boxes to trapezoids. This will allow me to maintain the front baffle width that Troles says is very important.
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Originally Posted by navin View Post
For crossover parts just talke to Solen. THey make good caps (not unrealistically priced) and inductors. If you really want to splurge get the Litz inductors from them. Otherwise even the "Perfect Lay" series available at Madisound are fine. Get good stuff not crazy stuff.

In the blind testing I had between a Multicap and Solen cap (5uf series cap for the tweeter section) there was no evidence that one was better than the other.
Thanks! I will give Solen a call.

Last edited by 2MuchRiceMakesMeSick; 19th November 2011 at 06:26 PM.
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Old 19th November 2011, 08:05 PM   #52
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Originally Posted by navin View Post
That's a big speaker to have 5 of them ina 10x15 room. You wont need a sub! LOL. 5 7" woofers will move good air.
He won't strictly "need" a sub at all. However he could still benefit from a couple of sub's doing the really low stuff.
In a tiny room like this I like to run Hi-Fi speakers (not sat's) set to handle "fullrange" signal on an AV amp, even 5 1/4 inch bass mid's will be fine in a room this small with this amount of speakers. Typically this leads to better sound I find.


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Originally Posted by navin View Post
Actually, rob, a faulty amplifier hook up can fry either a ribbon or dome. Ribbons usually are damaged (and many domes too) if they are pushed hard. Typically ribbons have very little Xmax (smaller than good domes) and hence the foil get damaged. The good ribbons like Fountek and Aurum Cantus have replaceable foils (many domes like the MDT33, D2905-9900 too have replaceable dome-voice coil assemblies so you retain the magnet and faceplate and frame).

In effect you can blow a dome as well a ribbon. I have blown both many times including the hardy D28 from Dynaudio and MDT33 from Morel. It is just easier to blow a ribbon and hence most manufacturers cross them over high and steep or both.
Faulty amp or do you really love high volume?

I have never blown a tweeter myself but I have seen the effects of attaching a faulty amplifier to a speaker a couple of times. Both were Domes (voice coil melted/fused in one burned piece, same with bass driver, well and truly cooked by DC), it is my understanding it is even easier to kill the ribbons that's all.
Both may be equally screwed in the face of a faulty amp pushing DC.
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Old 21st November 2011, 06:43 AM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rob g View Post
He won't strictly "need" a sub at all. ...In a tiny room like this I like to run Hi-Fi speakers (not sat's) set to handle "fullrange" signal on an AV amp, even 5 1/4 inch bass mid's will be fine in a room this small with this amount of speakers. Typically this leads to better sound I find.

Faulty amp or do you really love high volume?
Yes in fact with 9 7" woofers I am beginging to feel that there might be a case of too much bass bloom.

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Originally Posted by 2MuchRiceMakesMeSick View Post
Yes I am building a 9.1 system so I will need 9 boxes.
9 7" woofers in 10x15 ft. Why? Wel you've ordered the drivers anyway. My advice would be to build 4-5 systems and try the sound with 4.0 (phantom center) or 5.0. 9.1 in 150 sq. ft. is a tad over the top and this coming from someone who have 2 JBL 2245 (B460) bass bins for the bass in a room that was 240 sq. ft. (midbass was 4 8" Focal 8N515 and the tweeters were the MDT33 that I later blew by playing the whole system way too loud - people could hear the music 200-250 meters away).
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Old 21st November 2011, 12:42 PM   #54
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I have a listening room about the size of 2MuchRiceMakesMeSick's.
I listen down the width of the room, bass is incredibly well balanced. I really wish I could get the bass to be this good in other rooms with larger systems!
Currently I use Linkwitz Pluto 2.1 with no subwoofers. Bass definition is superb. I may experiment with Pluto sub's one day but only "because its there" in mountaineering speak, not because of any additional bass requirements or quality issue.

In larger rooms (home large, not auditorium in Geddes speak) I would want the help of sub's for movies.
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Old 21st November 2011, 12:51 PM   #55
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Some are missing the point. It is a 9.1 system, not a 2 channel with multiple drivers connected. You will still need the sub for low duty and not all of the drivers will be working at the same time so it won't be overkill with that many woofers. It is so that the timbre remains the same throughout the system. Makes transition more seamless.
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Old 21st November 2011, 01:18 PM   #56
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Originally Posted by Brian Oshman View Post
Some are missing the point. It is a 9.1 system, not a 2 channel with multiple drivers connected. You will still need the sub for low duty and not all of the drivers will be working at the same time so it won't be overkill with that many woofers. It is so that the timbre remains the same throughout the system. Makes transition more seamless.
That's why I said "However he could still benefit from a couple of sub's doing the really low stuff."

I find two sub's better than one larger one. I also found this in much larger rooms.

However my 1.42pm post explains that set up correctly I do not find the need for any sub at all, at least listening down the width of a small room like this.
I should point out the Pluto 2.1's are active equalized speakers with high quality long throw drivers and linkwitz Transform for the deep bass. The quality from these is such that for my taste they produce excellent bass at sensible volumes.

Many who like Home Theatre/Cinema will want very high volume and powerful overblown bass. Obviously sub's are required for this. I find two (at same volume output) is much better for this. Any more than this would get ridiculous for a small room. Simply physically finding space for the units, let alone any other considerations.
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Old 21st November 2011, 02:21 PM   #57
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2 much rice,
You should experiment with your AV amp, see what works best in your room. Some may prefer the typical 80hz crossover for instance.
If you experience bass boom sometimes it is good to cross high to a well placed sub or two. That said with well placed speakers in a room that size you will probably find better clarity not using the electronic crossover in the av amp, running every channel fullrange. This is something you could not get away with in a large room, you would have to involve the electronic crossover earlier to protect the speakers and reduce distortion if you wanted high levels.

Last edited by rob g; 21st November 2011 at 02:24 PM.
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Old 21st November 2011, 02:34 PM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rob g View Post
That said with well placed speakers in a room that size you will probably find better clarity not using the electronic crossover in the av amp, running every channel fullrange.
I had a passive sub on 5 of my 7 channels for a while, but sadly I had to put them in the basement at this place. Once we move to a proper house again and I can re-do my media room, this is the only way I fly.

You'd be surprised how bass effects can seem to wash over the room just like any other effects. My favorite is at the beginning of Star Trek 6 where the Praxis moon explodes. That rolling shockwave that approaches the ship and then washes over it is ridiculous when you've got surround channels that can go all the way down.
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Old 21st November 2011, 02:44 PM   #59
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Originally Posted by DrDyna View Post
I had a passive sub on 5 of my 7 channels for a while, but sadly I had to put them in the basement at this place. Once we move to a proper house again and I can re-do my media room, this is the only way I fly.

You'd be surprised how bass effects can seem to wash over the room just like any other effects. My favorite is at the beginning of Star Trek 6 where the Praxis moon explodes. That rolling shockwave that approaches the ship and then washes over it is ridiculous when you've got surround channels that can go all the way down.
Yes,
Deep, powerful bass like this can be great fun.

Where would Sci-Fi movies be without all that ultra realistic deep bass in the vacuum of deep space!

A great surround sound disc I would suggest trying is the movie Daybreakers. Excellent sound quality and involving sound steering.
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Old 21st November 2011, 02:54 PM   #60
DrDyna is online now DrDyna  United States
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Originally Posted by rob g View Post
Yes,


Where would Sci-Fi movies be without all that ultra realistic deep bass in the vacuum of deep space!
Haha, I know, right?

It's all in good fun.
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