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Old 12th November 2011, 07:36 PM   #101
Elias is offline Elias  Finland
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KSTR View Post
Hi Elias,

I own quite a few recordings, electronica genre mostly, and in general any modern stuff that doesn't care about mono compatibilty for vinyl and FM, which have bass signal panned all acrross the place.

-------:-------

I did similar experiments (with 3 small bookshelf speakers) a year back or so to test the capabilities of simple rematrixing methods for "soundbar" speakers which are coming in fashion more and more, trying different (and frequency dependent) matrix factors -- inspired by Gerzon's Trifield equations. With multichannel convolver/DSP outputs there is complete freedom of choices.

While it basically works quite well, it's not my cup of tea, I prefer (and manipulate my stereo signals deliberately for) true stereo bass which is required IMHO to provide any sense of spacial realism (stereo reverb tails of bass signals even when those are panned center, that is). Oftentimes we hear people say that we cannot localize a SINGLE sound source sound below 150Hz or so, but this plainly ignores the fact that TWO speakers (signals) can provide a "sense of direction" down low there, either with two speakers or rematrixed to three in a conventional Trinaural/Trifield setup.

- Klaus

Hi Klaus,

You've seen the pics of my first prototype of the single speaker stereo.. with the FRS8 and all.. There is no bass to start with

I'm using separate dipole bass below 200 Hz.

I may not recommend using this single speaker concept at bass, since at most recordings the bass is mono so it will be emitted as single mono speaker, which do not perform well in a small room acoustic space. I've talked about that earlier
Elias Pekonen Home Page - Dipole Bass vs Monopole Bass


What comes to the ability to localise bass, I've seen studies indicating it is possible down to the lowest octave 20Hz, BUT it may require free field conditions since in a small room (smaller than or comparable to wavelength) there is no propagating wavefield and ITD is ambiguous.

Using more than one bass loudspeaker with decorrelated signal (e.g. reverb) may externalise bass, but I cannot say for sure if it is localisable. However, my hypothesis is even externalised bass can help in generating more believable sound image because not heavily contradicting cues take place.

- Elias
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Dipole Bass vs Monopole Bass Stereophonic Sound from a Single Loudspeaker 3 Speaker Linear Stereo Matrix Wavelets
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Old 14th November 2011, 10:23 AM   #102
graaf is offline graaf  Poland
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looks like a competition for SSS - as it stands - Audyssey stereolitic audio docks:

Click the image to open in full size.

Click the image to open in full size.
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Old 14th November 2011, 08:20 PM   #103
von Ah is offline von Ah  United States
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Elias, I seem to have missed how you achieve the 0.5x matrix-ing of the stereo signal. Are you using passive attenuating, or DSP, or active filtering?
I'm enjoying the thread, regardless.
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Old 14th November 2011, 11:16 PM   #104
CLS is offline CLS  Taiwan
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Passive.

Stereophonic Sound from a Single Loudspeaker
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Old 15th November 2011, 05:17 AM   #105
Elias is offline Elias  Finland
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Originally Posted by graaf View Post
looks like a competition for SSS - as it stands - Audyssey stereolitic audio docks:
[/IMG]
Nowadays these things keep popping up like mushrooms after the rain ! General megatrend Maybe we'll see such a trend for SSS as well, one day.


- Elias
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Old 15th November 2011, 05:25 AM   #106
Elias is offline Elias  Finland
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Originally Posted by von.ah View Post
Elias, I seem to have missed how you achieve the 0.5x matrix-ing of the stereo signal. Are you using passive attenuating, or DSP, or active filtering?
I'm enjoying the thread, regardless.

It's purely passive, see post #11. Very easy !

Note, similar idea can be used in other spread speaker matrix reproduction systems, like Trinaural, or the one CLS is using.

I'm integrating all the 3 channel speakers as one.

Looking at your avatar, you have potential ! You'll already have one element at the top of the box Now, but two more elements at the sides at do some rewiring


- Elias
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Old 15th November 2011, 06:28 AM   #107
graaf is offline graaf  Poland
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Originally Posted by Elias View Post
Looking at your avatar, you have potential ! You'll already have one element at the top of the box Now, but two more elements at the sides at do some rewiring


- Elias
so You have flooded the center element?
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Old 15th November 2011, 10:24 AM   #108
Elias is offline Elias  Finland
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Originally Posted by graaf View Post
so You have flooded the center element?
At the moment I don't see a reason for that. I'm using the psychoacoustic shelving filter to adjust the balance between center and side elements. It seems to work well.


- Elias
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Old 15th November 2011, 10:43 AM   #109
graaf is offline graaf  Poland
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Originally Posted by Elias View Post
I'm using the psychoacoustic shelving filter to adjust the balance between center and side elements.
basically it lowers the level of the center element in the HF? sort of electric pillow?
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Old 15th November 2011, 12:20 PM   #110
Elias is offline Elias  Finland
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Originally Posted by graaf View Post
basically it lowers the level of the center element in the HF? sort of electric pillow?
The filter is steering high freq energy from the direct sound (attenuation) to the side (boost) which will be reflected as indirect sound which adds decorrelation.

This will help in spatially homogenizing pinna cues ! The loudspeaker itself will not be localisable.


- Elias
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